Another Bucket leveler

PineRidge · Mar 21, 2006

Henro I'm just guessing here but if the bucket geometry didn't change as the FEL was being lifted dealers wouldn't be selling a self leveling FELs on some model tractors, as there would be no need for one.

I like the fact that you can find the level position while the bucket is still high in the air after dumping a load of dirt and return to the digging position without lost time. Much more productive IMHO.

B8FISH · Mar 22, 2006

Here's the current JD leveler--looks a lot like yours!

Henro · Mar 22, 2006

Bigdad,

Thanks for posting those pictures. I see that the level indicator tells level for only one position of the loader arms...

I guess for me I'm back to thinking that for my needs the simple kubota level indicator probably works best.

This is because since nothing is flat here, I may be working with the bucket at different heights, and not at one height most of the time. I can see how the level indicator like you have would allow you to set the bucket back to a given position rather quickly, after dumping the bucket. I guess if I were frequently scraping a flat surface, like cleaning out a barn or whatever, having a level indicator that showed level at the scraping level would be a great asset.

Anyone have a level indicator that will allow one to set level of the bucket at any height of the loader arms? The simple indicator on the Kubota bucket offers this capability, but only if my eye ball is calibrated well on a given day.

3RRL · Mar 22, 2006

( I see that the level indicator tells level for only one position of the loader arms...)
Henro, that is what I was trying to say in my previous post. After trying to lay it out on the CAD, I couldn't figure out how to get that level indicator to indicate a level bucket at different loader height.
I was hoping someone could...
I'd really like to see how to do it.

JerryG · Mar 22, 2006

To make it work that way, it would have to have part of the level attached to the uprights or some other stationary part of the tractor. Which that would create an additional problem.

johnk · Mar 22, 2006

That bucket looks so clean looks like there was ever nothing in it!! Put that rascal to work. Just kiding. nice job.

3RRL · Mar 23, 2006

Jerry,
I tried that and it did not work out for me. I tried the attachments in several spots (both bucket and stationary) but each time I lifted the arms up, the amount the stick moved was different than the amount needed to level the bucket at the new height? I even tried to use the theorhetical center point of the bucket pivot and, of course, the stick does not move when leveling the bucket from THAT point...duh. Ha ha, what a ****** I am. The bucket attachment has to be away from the pivot point. /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif
Somebody has to know better than me?

Ford960 · Mar 24, 2006

There is a way... Make the indicator a two piece arrangement. Mount one part to the loader arms so that it can pivot by gravity in relation to the angle of lift arms. The part of the indicator attached to the bucket is then matched to the swinging part of the indicator to determine where the bucket needs to be for level at the angle of the loader.

Ford960

texbaylea · Mar 24, 2006

Rob

I will try to describe this now and if I get time over the next few days I will draw it out. You need to set up a parallelogram. Measure the distance between the bucket pivot and the point where the cylinder attaches. Now take a piece of metal bar for an indicator, about 3/16" x 1-1/4" and long enough to have a hole at each end that distance you just measured. Now mount the bar you just made to the loader on the inside near the knee. Any where it will be easily seen. You want it to be able to pivot on what will be the lower hole and it will be sticking up. Now measure the distance from that mounting point to the bucket pivot and now make a rod of light bar with a hole at each end that last distance.

Now if the pivot pin and the cylinder attach pin were in a vertical line when the bucket was level you would be done. When the indicator bar was vertical the bucket would be level and would be so no matter how high the FEL was. However the cylinder attach pin will probably be forward of the pivot when the bucket is level so make a sector (pie shaped piece) and fasten to the indicator with the point up. Now using a long enough bolt for the upper pivot where the rod from the bucket attaches to hang a pointed piece of metal, plumb bob if you will. When that pointer hangs vertical the bucket is level.

I am not going to be able to do what I just described on my FEL since the bucket cylinder attaches to an intermediate lever arm with a link down to the bucket. Because of unequal lever arm lengths the geometry gets complicated.

This thread has gotten me interested so I will go to work on a solution. I may have to draw this out.

Vernon

3RRL · Mar 24, 2006

Ford960 and texbaylea....
Could you guys post a sketch for each of these methods? I'd like to see exactly how to do it so I can make one.
Thanks,

KubotainNH · Mar 24, 2006

The issue I see with Ford960's gravity setup is if you are on a slight incline but want to dig parallel with the incline it would not be accurate but would dig in. It would be level though. I could be misunderstanding his idea. /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif This does pose a mechanical challenge because of all the shapes of FELs. I'd like to see some drawings of ideas.

JerryG · Mar 24, 2006

Rob,
Here is what you need. It is a little expensive.

3RRL · Mar 25, 2006

That's accurate enough to replace my sine plate! LOL /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

3RRL · Mar 25, 2006

I understand Ford960's concept and it would indicate levelness to the ground but not to the incline. One could mount a shaft perpendicular to the frame and line it up with the shaft on the bucket to get the bucket level with the incline. (Have both indicators)

The only problem I see with this is being able to line up the shafts visually because their movement is "in line of sight" forward and backward, not side to side. I guess you could get pretty good at it though, maybe good enough for what I do? /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Maybe you could translate the forward and backwards movement to "side to side" movements by using miter gears. Hmmm...that sounds like it might work? I'll have to check that out some more.

john_bud · Mar 26, 2006

Guys,

After reading this thread, I am wondering why you want to know if the bucket is level at some place other than at ground level? That's the only place I really care about it. Helps in pealing a consistent 3-5" of soil per pass, digging at a constant down angle and in back dragging. Other that that, I don't really care if it's level as the bucket is usually in full back mode to keep the dirt from spilling.

So, what am I missing?

jb

3RRL · Mar 26, 2006

john,
Apparantly henro has a need for such...
( Anyone have a level indicator that will allow one to set level of the bucket at any height of the loader arms?)

I was also interested. In my case, not so much for the bucket itself but when using fork lift attachment to confirm eyeballing.

As far as having the bucket level on a slope or incline, the mark on standard level indicator can be used. Such as skimming you road that is on an incline. However, if you needed to have your bucket level to the Earth (not the incline) such as unloading with forks while on an incline, I could see use for that. Example: if freight carrier is on a spot level to earth but your tractor is on a hump or incline while approching the the truck, you would need to keep the forks level with the truck bed.

Mostly just peaked my interest for a mechanical device to do this.

I would still like to see what texbaylea has come up with in his description.

bigdad · Mar 26, 2006

john_bud......

I kind of wondered the same thing. I am very new at this tractor thing so I am soaking in all of the wisdom. I ran a skid steer for years and was very spoiled with it's loader because I could see everything in front. The first time I used the loader on my tractor it wasn't pretty, and I figured out why some type of leveler is important.

Thanks all (again). This is very enjoyable.

PineRidge · Mar 26, 2006

( Guys,

After reading this thread, I am wondering why you want to know if the bucket is level at some place other than at ground level? That's the only place I really care about it. Helps in pealing a consistent 3-5" of soil per pass, digging at a constant down angle and in back dragging. Other that that, I don't really care if it's level as the bucket is usually in full back mode to keep the dirt from spilling.

So, what am I missing?

jb
)

If you ever put a set of pallet forks on your FEL you'll immediately know why it's most important to know when things are level at a raised position. In many instances when unloading trucks I can't see the tips of the forks so its impossible to know when to move toward the pallet.

In my case I learned to raise the forks higher than the pallet, tilt the forks forward which then lets me see the tips. At that point you can line up with a pallet and make final adjustments for the lift. Working with pallets is a good use for a self leveling FEL, unfortunately they aren't available for all FELs.

texbaylea · Mar 26, 2006

3RRL

I was out looking at my tractor today and it happened to have the pallet forks on. I realized that I would have to have two marks for my "plumb bob" or "pendulum" to be aligned against. The pivot pins are aligned nearly vertically when the pallet forks are on while the upper pivot is forward when the bucket is on. I need to work on the "line of sight" problem also. It is going to be hard to align the indicator with a mark when you are looking at an angle.

Vernon

3RRL · Mar 27, 2006

I thought so too after reading ford960's post. That makes sense. I could not figure out how to get a level reading without using 2 markers, one being the "plumb bob" either.

I haven't done anything with it yet, but I think translating the movement from "front to back" to "side to side" via small miter gears could give a visual, readable scale to the operator. No doubt getting a little crazy here, but interesting nevertheless. /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif

I'm beginning to think that meter shown by JerryG is an easy solution...probably cheaper in the long run! /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif