Alcohol vs marijuana

[mapper]

"And working the night shift for the past 3 years, I had front row seats to a train wreck. Night shift in a factory setting is a whole nuther animal. Drunks, stoners, and generally no supervisors. Man, you don't want to be operating a machine next to a drunk or stoner. You just don't. Stoners just work slower. "

Similar to my experience, found that neither one could learn new semi complex tasks very well, and while the stoners were just frustrating to deal with the alcoholics were argumentative and frustrating to deal with. Had one guy who was a functioning alcoholic, for a number of years he was able to keep up as long as I was patient with him But as he got older he became much worse, the simplest new task or process became impossible for him to learn. Because it was a civil service job the termination process took several years. I was finally able to convince him to take early retirement so I didn't have to finish the termination process.
Bottom line, drugs such as alcohol and pot don't have any place in the workplace or behind the wheel. And heavy chronic use of either on your own time will tend to have effects that will impact your work performance.

 

[polo1665]

Things have changed quite a bit in the factory arena in the last 40 - 50 years (at least in the industry I work in). In the 70's it wasn't unusual for there to be alcohol present in the shop. People hid it in their lockers and took a sip here and there. Christmas parties in the shop were crazy, with foremen shutting down machinery specifically due to the fact that everyone was drunk.

It started slowing down somewhat in the 80's, at least it wasn't as overt as it had been. No more alcohol allowed at parties. I can still remember an electrician that frequently worked on a furnace that I ran as a tech back in the 80's. He was often somewhat tipsy, and checked for live wires by licking his fingers and touching them.....crazy dude. Over the last few decades the drinking thing has pretty much fizzled out at work. I'd say the old guard pretty much retired out about 15 years ago. Now we are encouraged to watch for the signs and report anyone who may appear to be under the influence. They administer a breath-a-lizer test on premises, and then send them out for a blood test.

Drugs are a different matter though. It has at times gotten hard to find people to hire. Many couldn't pass the initial drug test. In my industry, they started random drug screening in the early 90's. Up until then I smoked pot, but stopped when the pee tests started. Couldn't see losing a good job for that. I too had started drinking and smoking pretty early, earlier than Mace even (had two older brothers who would party around me a lot, figured it was the right thing to do ). Did a lot of stupid things in my younger days. Miracle that I never killed anyone (or myself). Now I pretty much just enjoy my beer, and try not to do anything stupid.

Don't think I would start smoking weed again, even if they did make it legal. Last stuff I remember was too potent.....called it "stupid weed" cause all you did after smoking it was sit on the couch, watch TV and look stupid.

 

[MossRoad]

Anyone remember laughing so hard your cheeks hurt the next day? That's about the only negative physical side effects of pot smoking I can remember.

Now alcohol, on the other hand... what great fun driving the porcelain bus. Wondering if that was cherry wine or blood. Headaches. Stomachaches. The shakes. Clean up the mess. Put your foot out of bed onto the floor to stop the room from spinning. Wonder how you got home? Why is the car parked in the flower bed? Just nothing good about it once you go too far with alcohol.

 

[MossRoad]

Language not safe for work, so watch at your own discretion...

 

[Doofy]

Ahhaaaa, Boones Farm or Annie Cream Jeans (Annie Green Springs). Fine Memories, if I remember correctly. I do remember waking up in the car, in the driveway without remembering the 20 mile drive home.

Only by the Grace of God do we survive this phase of life and live to grow old.

 

[Snobdds]

I manage and am an Actuary for an insurance company. So I work with a lot of very smart, math oriented, introverted, nerds basically. There is a very distinct trend I see, none of them drink. However, they do like to smoke weed. They all have very good memories and the ability you have very long critical thought. So I think scapegoating stoners as not having good memories and as idiots is naive. All things have different reactions to people, like some drinkers are fun to be around and some are just jerks. Some of the smartest people I know go home at night and smoke and are ready the next day to complete some of the most complex problems known to man (healthcare).

So to paint a broad brush into grouping everyone as the same because of a common trait, is a fools game.

 

[houstonscott]

If you drink to "get a buzz", you are in a very very small minority, of those who enjoy a drink. If you use pot you have behavioral issues.

 

[tungularafishcamp]

Interesting discussion and it's great to see all the differences of opinion without any personal attacks!

In my opinion the most exciting thing about the legalization of marijuana in several states, is how much faster medical use is expanding. The development and cultivation of various strains has gone leap years ahead and a whole lot of serious medical problems are being helped))

I too imbibed alcohol/marijuana/others too much as a kid, starting way too young, dope smoking is probably why I have no high school memories I still drink a bit a bit, no pot or hard drugs for a loooong time although now that I don't have kids at home if I ever get down to Oregon soon enough I might have to pick some Liberty caps.

In the difference between alcohol vs marijuana discussion I think Houston Scott nailed it when he said SOME folks will drink just for the taste, personally I love half a beer with dinner, but with the exception of medicinal use, folks are consuming marijuana for the altered mental state.

If someone would make a good(for my taste buds) non alcoholic beer, I would think about giving up water

 

[Sigarms]

In the difference between alcohol vs marijuana discussion I think Houston Scott nailed it when he said SOME folks will drink just for the taste, personally I love half a beer with dinner, but with the exception of medicinal use, folks are consuming marijuana for the altered mental state.

I'll respectfully disagree. Beer is an aquired taste. Alcohol makes it taste horrible when you're not use to it. However, it's the same alcohol your brain gets use to it, now it tastes good. I'm guessing the reason you haven't found a good non alcoholic beer that tastes good is because it doesn't have any alcohol in it

 

[Dadnatron]

I don't think it is because of the lack of alcohol. I believe the process of removing the alcohol and the beers which are brewed are the reason.

If they made a really good low alcohol low carb beer, I'd love it. I like a good IPA in the evening, but I am not young enough for it not to run to my weight. "Session" beers are brewed specifically for a lower EtOH content. They were originally brewed as a 'lunch time' beer for manual laborers to have while at work, but not have the drunken effects which would result in you losing your hand in a machine.

There are a few Session beers which are worthwhile, but most just don't have the flavor. And it ISN'T, for the most part, the EtOH content. The process of brewing is so varied and the inner workings is magnificent. I used to brew, but I just wasn't as good as my local breweries, and I found myself drinking 'inferior beer' simply because I had brewed it.

I finally decided that in order for me to improve, I'd likely have to have a much better place in which to do it. My kitchen just wasn't capable of doing what I wanted to do.

I ended up recognizing that my local breweries would be able to produce anything I wanted... so I happily just purchase from them.

I still like Stone Brewing Co. IPA (San Diego) and Urban Chestnut Schnickelfritz - Wheat beer (St. Louis)... but otherwise, I almost always drink local beers, WHEREVER I am . I love trying new local beers wherever I go, and more often than not, I find them to be very good to excellent.

No experience with pot or other drugs.

 

[Deere Dude]

I really enjoyed the taste of beer but ended up getting drunk more times than not, but did it again the next night and then repeat. Never at work but was groggy all day until I got off work then I was feeling good enough to start over...from late teens until middle 20s. I never could see and still can't understand how anyone can down hard stuff. The bartenders like me though.

In my early 20s I would hang with my doper cousin now and then. I never bought any pot but he have me a hit or two and then one day he gave me one for later. I stashed it in my car.

I worked in a factory on second shift on a snowmobile line putting bogey wheels and tracks on the machines. In night at the 6 PM break I drove downtown and lit it up. It was a pretty good joint and I really got a buzz on. I came back to work and sat down in the cafeteria with some co-workers and one friend said, "What in the world is wrong with your eyes?" I said, "Nothing, it was late." I got out of there pretty fast because I just felt how bloodshot they were.

Five minutes later it was time to start the assembly line up so I got in my station. As soon as it started I knew i was in trouble. I could not focus on putting a nut and bolt together much less 20 of them plus put wheels in correctly. That was 40+ years ago and I still remember it well. The only way I could function and do the job was if I would take my mind off the job and focus on something across the factory floor and do the job from muscle reflex memory. I would try to focus directly on the job that simply would not work and that lasted for a couple hours. Maybe if I was doped up long enough and hard enough I could function normally, but I really doubt it. That was the last one I ever had and drinking was gone right after that. Of course I lost a lot of bartender friends and pot friends. It wasn't like they gave a crap about me anyway.

 

[Larry Caldwell]

I stopped smoking pot back in the mid '80s. Honestly, I just didn't like having to smoke it. Never was a smoker. It also started to get expensive.

I drank a lot for many years. More than I should. More than anyone should. Stopped that for the most part when I turned 30 (there's a story in that, of course). These days, I rarely drink at all. I can probably count on one hand the number of alcoholic drinks I have in any calendar year ... and can count on no hands the number of them I actually finish. Just not interested in that anymore. I enjoy life entirely too much to feel the need for an altered mental state.

I don't know if that is biological or mental. The alcohol part is probably biological. When I was in my 20s I hung out with a hard drinking crew. Most of them kept drinking and are dead now. I went teetotal when one of them got drunk and coked up and murdered a girl. I knew he had a problem, but he was "one of the guys" and I never said anything. When I quit drinking, the rest of the crowd wasn't so happy to have me around. I eventually got back to moderate alcohol consumption. It's a family joke that every year my New Years resolution is to drink more, and every year I fail. My wife and I have a huge liquor cabinet. Some of those bottles are 30 years old. The way to develop a huge liquor cabinet is to buy it and not drink it.

As for weed, I started smoking it before there were hippies, when the beatniks called it "tea." I had a serious depression problem, and I guess I used it to self-medicate, though I didn't have the foggiest what I was doing. I quit that when I started a system software company in the early '80s. I needed my memory.

Then it was just me, a cup of coffee, and a cigarette. Man I loved nicotine. Quitting tobacco was the hardest thing I ever did three times. If it didn't, you know, kill you and stuff, I would still be smoking. Factory smoke has gotten expensive, so I would be growing my own. You can raise burley anywhere. The PITA is curing it. I know I have a nicotine problem, so I can't even think about that. My one remaining daily vice is a premium coffee from a local roaster that makes Starbucks taste like a mud puddle. When it's not sold out, I drink Buckmaster Rogue Valley Blend, part dark roast to give it body, part medium roast to stoke the caffeine.

Now that I'm retired, could sit on the porch or in a rowboat drowning worms and get so drunk I fall asleep. I suppose I could smoke pot if I wanted. It's legal in my state. Friends grow the stuff and would provide me with all the high quality bud I could smoke. I just don't care. Like you, I like my life.

 

[motownbrowne]

If you drink to "get a buzz", you are in a very very small minority, of those who enjoy a drink. If you use pot you have behavioral issues.

You could be dealing with people every day who are daily pot smokers and you might never know it. Honestly, doctors, lawyers, police, professionals of every sort and you might never know.

I think the guy who is an actuary makes a great point. Yeah, lots of total fuｩkups happen to smoke pot habitually, but there's multitudes more people who snooker it responsibly and have no problem at all. Thing is, unless you ask them and they answer honestly, you'd never know it.

 

[geoff l]

Used to have a drop of two back when I was a young man, I still now and then will have a bottle of beer or cider, but that's it as it upsets my system nowadays.
There is a culture amongst the youngsters here in the UK of smoking high grade grass, causing all manner of psychological issues in the long term, and increasing the crime rate in inner cities.
I'm glad to live in the wilds so as not to be exposed to the degradation that is ensuing in town, the grass smoking habit has gone from recreational to perpetual over here in some sections of society.

 

[houstonscott]

You could be dealing with people every day who are daily pot smokers and you might never know it. Honestly, doctors, lawyers, police, professionals of every sort and you might never know. I think the guy who is an actuary makes a great point. Yeah, lots of total fuｩkups happen to smoke pot habitually, but there's multitudes more people who snooker it responsibly and have no problem at all. Thing is, unless you ask them and they answer honestly, you'd never know it.

You might be speaking with a mass murderer too, you'd never know, but they definitely have a behavior issue.

 

[sseelhoff]

You might be speaking with a mass murderer too, you'd never know, but they definitely have a behavior issue.

Mala prohibita vs. mala per se.

 

[Sigarms]

I think the guy who is an actuary makes a great point. Yeah, lots of total fuｩkups happen to smoke pot habitually, but there's multitudes more people who snooker it responsibly and have no problem at all. Thing is, unless you ask them and they answer honestly, you'd never know it.

I think the issue is that some beer drinkers think for whatever reason, they are the only ones who can use a recreational drug responsibly

 

[sseelhoff]

I think the issue is that some beer drinkers think for whatever reason, they are the only ones who can use a recreational drug responsibly

Coupled with the fact that one industry pays a lot of money to lawmakers to keep the other potential competitor out of business.

 

[motownbrowne]

You might be speaking with a mass murderer too, you'd never know, but they definitely have a behavior issue.

My point is that your hasty generalization was, by nature of a generalization, incorrect. You said "if you use pot, you have behavioral issues". Sorry, but that's not true. Maybe you're an 80 year old lady going through chemo, or a 7 year old with uncontrollable seizures, or a beloved community figure who smokes pot on the weekends. Do some people who smoke it have behavioral issues? OF COURSE. Do plenty of people who don't have behavioral issues? YES!!

It's like saying, everyone who eats chocolate fudge is poor at math. Just doesn't work that way.

 

[tungularafishcamp]

I'll respectfully disagree. Beer is an aquired taste. Alcohol makes it taste horrible when you're not use to it. However, it's the same alcohol your brain gets use to it, now it tastes good. I'm guessing the reason you haven't found a good non alcoholic beer that tastes good is because it doesn't have any alcohol in it

Taste buds are a personal thing, I remember my first drink of beer, I was 6 we had just moved to Ohio from Japan, bbqing with neighbors, my dad gave me a sip of ice cold Wiedeman sp? And I thought wow, so much better than cool aid!!!! Since then my beer tastes have changed and I love dark heavy full flavored beers (I blame that on my first warm guniness in the BVI all the na beers I have seen/tried are Pilsners and they just don't do it for my tastes either with or without alcohol.

X2 on Dadnatrons comments, I too brewed a long time ago but once we got a local brewery and he started selling beer in pigs it was ez to give up brewing my inferior beer!