4700 - Best way to add valves for grappler and stump grinder

[pclausen]

I have a 4700 w/ a 460 FEL.

I want to add a W.R. Long RBG-60 grapple and Woods TSG50 stump grinder.

I just got off the phone with my local JD dealer, who also sells W.R. Long and Woods.

His suggestion was to get the W.R. Long valve kit w/ hoses ($610) and quick coupler kit ($100). The quick couple kit is a pair of quick connects and a plate that you weld up front on the 460 loader where the tube is that goes between the arms.

I'd prefer the factory hard line kit for the 460 loader, but I guess this would work just fine, but not have that OEM look.

For the rear, he suggested the JD remote kit ($225) which has a lever that mounts on the fender where the cup holder is and then uses cables down to the 3rd valve that is already there next to the FEL valves. The kit also includes hard lines and a bracket to add a single remote to the rear.

Woods makes a valve kit for the TSG50 that connects to a single remote and gives you 2 functions (raise/lower and sweep left/right).

The only downside is that I would need to bungee cord the fender mounted rear remote to be always on, much like you would with a log splitter, when running the stump grinder.

My question is, is there a better way to go about hooking up the grappler and stump grinder than what my JD dealer is recommending?

Would it not make more sense to use the PB port from the FEL valve to power the Woods TSG50 valve unit and not use a bungee cord with the 3rd valve to keep it in the always on position?

Thanks!

 

[dusty3030]

Instead of the woods kit how about a electric diverter kit for the FEL valves and control the grinder with them?

 

[pclausen]

As long as it would "freze" the FEL in place when I hit the switch.

In other words, would I be able to lower the FEL to the ground to where the front wheels are slightly off the ground (for added stability), then enable the electric diverter switch and start working the grinder using the FEL joystick?

I think that would work fine, except I'm not sure how comfortable it will be sitting the the seat working the joystick while look back at what I'm doing.

The JD guy said that some guys have things setup this way, but if they do a lot of stump grinding they move to independent valves sooner or later. I'm going to stop by Tractor Supply to see what they have.

What size is the PB outlet on the FEL valve manifold if I decide to go that route?

 

[dusty3030]

Wear one of them bicycle helmet rearview mirror contraptions:laughing:

I can see that might be a pain in the neck.
Power beyond and then the woods kit or make your own similar with a two spool valve and mount it to the left or right just behind the seat you could probably sit sideways and pull it off pretty comfortable.

 

[pclausen]

Lol, yeah, maybe that will work! Would likely take quite a bit of getting used to.

Yeah, PB to a 2 spool valve seems like the way to go. Perhaps this one?

Surplus Center - 2 SPOOL 10 GPM PRINCE LVT1GB5AC1-26 OC VALVE

It's rated at 10gpm, which would seem like a perfect match to the 9.9gpm of my 4700, no? Total rated flow on the 4700 is 14.7gpm.

So if I'm understanding this correctly, I'd then just need to take the PB out of the W.R. Long and route it to this Prince 2 spool, and then back to the 3 point hitch, right? $169 sounds a lot better than $500+ for the Woods kit.

Then I just need to come up with a rear mount bracket to hold the quick connects and assorted plumbing. Looks like John Deere made one for the now obsolete 4th and 5th valve kit they used to offer for the 4700.

I went ahead and pulled the trigger on the W.R. Long RBG-60 grappler with the electronic valve kit and quick connect bracket kit. So I think I'm all set on how to do the 3rd front control valve.

 

[Westendorf-RR]

You could save some cash with a cylinder-less grapple? They work with what you already have... bucket cylinders on your loader. Local DNR uses a BC-4000 Brush Crusher in state park to clear trees to their burn site... they love it.

 

[pclausen]

Wow, that looks pretty interesting!

However, given my terrain challenges I feel there will be times where I need the curl function to properly pick up slash.

I actually already placed the order for the Long RBG-60 grabble with their electric control valve and bracket kit. They expect it to be here in 3 days!

I also went ahead and ordered the rear remote valve kit for $225, which uses the existing 3rd valve which is currently not connected. It comes with an OEM bracket that allows attaching a 2nd set of remote quick connects.

I'm thinking of a 3-way electronic diverter valve that, when activated, will do the following:

FEL boom cylinders -> stump grinder raise/lower
FEL curl cylinders -> stump grinder left/right sweep
3rd fender mounted valve -> FOL boom cylinders

Given the amount of slash I have to get rid of, I think having the switch for the 3rd function on the FEL joystick will be the way to go.

Think 20 acres of this:

But the view I gained from having the big trees cut down was worth it:

They don't call them the Blue Ridge Mountains for nothing!

 

[Westendorf-RR]

Yeah... I agree when you have "that" much acreage to clear. You may miss your tilt. For seasonal clean up and storm debris it is a solution that is priced right without having to add all the hydraulics and still works well even without tilt. You just use the lift cylinders and tractor to compensate. Beautiful country... nice photos.

 

[foggy1111]

My needs are similar to yours. I have a dedicated grapple (Markham/Gator) for my loader and a Woods TSG50 Stump Grinder. I operate everything with ONE SCV via ONE pair of couplers at the rear of my tractor. I do have the hard lines installed from JD....and these also have couplers (standard) near the Joystick couplers. (this allows the loader to be removed from the tractor)

The grapple operates just fine by plugging into the JD hardline remotes at the front...and is activated by the Selective Control Valve (SCV). Works great!

For the stump grinder......I disconnect all four of my joystick quick couplers and and then couple the loaders lift cylinders only into the 3rd function and control the LIFT CYLINDERS ONLY with the SCV handle. The two cyinders for the stump grinder are now coupled to the loader joystick via JD QD's. Works slick and is quite intuitive with a bit of use.

One thing tho.....you do not have the curl function available while using the stump grinder (unless you want to switch hoses temporarily) nor can you operate the grapple.....but that has not been a big issue to me when grinding stumps.

End result.....ONE set of JD Q Couplers and the JD SCV does it all for me. It only takes a few minutes to re-configure my lines. (I am now a pro at it )

 

[pclausen]

Hi foggy,

I read your thread on the TSG50 and that is pretty much why I decided that is what I need/want!

So my 4700 has the FEL valves as follows:

So I got the bracket with the 4 quick disconnects for the FEL shown at the bottom of the picture. I take my FEL off all the time. I find it quicker to mount/dismount that than some of my 3 point hitch implements!

So anyway, I ordered up this kit to get the 3rd "built-in" valve activated:

Note how the bracket that mounts at the rear has holes to accept a 2nd remote.

In the short term, I want to do exactly what you're doing, use the fender mounted 3rd SCV lever to raise/lower the FEL when using the stump grinder, which would be controlled via the FEL joystick.

To do this, I would run hoses from the grinder to the FEL bracket shown in the 1st pic above, and extend the rear remote with a 3rd set of hoses to the boom cylinders of the FEL.

Long term, I'd like to be able to just leave the FEL connected to the front quick connects (the grappler is independent and uses the PB port, so we can ignore him), and then connect to grinder to the rear mounted remotes, which would be pre-wired to a diverter valve.

So when using the stump grinder, I flip a switch, and the fender mounted lever begins controlling the FEL up/down, and the joystick controls the grinder.

Flipping the switch to "normal" restores the joystick to control the FEL and the fender mounted lever controls the 1st remote as by the OEM design.

As stated above, the grappler is independent of all this and using the switch on the FEL joystick will open and close the grabbler regardless of my "stump grinder" switch position.

Here's what the W.R. Long switch looks like:

Being a sucker for the OEM look, I was wondering if JD makes a knob with a switch and a hollow joystick shaft I can adopt to fit my 4700?

 

[dusty3030]

Being a sucker for the OEM look, I was wondering if JD makes a knob with a switch and a hollow joystick shaft I can adopt to fit my 4700?

Look up the one for the 2011 4x20 tractors 3rd scv kit. It has the handle and switch you can probably get the part number of of jd parts.

 

[foggy1111]

Hi foggy,

I read your thread on the TSG50 and that is pretty much why I decided that is what I need/want!

So my 4700 has the FEL valves as follows:

So I got the bracket with the 4 quick disconnects for the FEL shown at the bottom of the picture. I take my FEL off all the time. I find it quicker to mount/dismount that than some of my 3 point hitch implements!

So anyway, I ordered up this kit to get the 3rd "built-in" valve activated:

Note how the bracket that mounts at the rear has holes to accept a 2nd remote.

In the short term, I want to do exactly what you're doing, use the fender mounted 3rd SCV lever to raise/lower the FEL when using the stump grinder, which would be controlled via the FEL joystick.

To do this, I would run hoses from the grinder to the FEL bracket shown in the 1st pic above, and extend the rear remote with a 3rd set of hoses to the boom cylinders of the FEL.

Long term, I'd like to be able to just leave the FEL connected to the front quick connects (the grappler is independent and uses the PB port, so we can ignore him), and then connect to grinder to the rear mounted remotes, which would be pre-wired to a diverter valve.

So when using the stump grinder, I flip a switch, and the fender mounted lever begins controlling the FEL up/down, and the joystick controls the grinder.

Flipping the switch to "normal" restores the joystick to control the FEL and the fender mounted lever controls the 1st remote as by the OEM design.

As stated above, the grappler is independent of all this and using the switch on the FEL joystick will open and close the grabbler regardless of my "stump grinder" switch position.

Here's what the W.R. Long switch looks like:

Being a sucker for the OEM look, I was wondering if JD makes a knob with a switch and a hollow joystick shaft I can adopt to fit my 4700?

Hmmm. I may need to read this a few times.

If I understand correctly....you have Power Beyond (PB) already on your tractor? Wow! If you do.....then I would use the PB to operate a new 4 port valve (I think you can get it with the grinder direct from Woods which includes a bracket and everything complete!! :thumbsup to operate the stump grinder and leave everything hooked up as you now have it!! This way you can fully operate your loader and grapple with the grinder installed.

I'm just kinda tight....and figured out a way to operate without doing lots of extra plumbing. :laughing: In my case, I already had the SCV and remotes....as well as the hard lines installed on the loader.

I think I would take advantage of the PB feature......and you can then turn around in the seat (or even stand alongside the tractor) to operate in comfort via the Woods valve placement (which stays with the grinder IIRC). The best of all worlds IMO.

 

[pclausen]

That my plan foggy.

Just to be clear, I don't have the PB kit on my tractor yet. Talked to the dealer and the original PB kit is no longer available, but a replacement one is. The only difference appears to be that the new one includes an inline filter, so I busted that out.

Dealer spoke to Woods and confirmed that their dual valve kit will work with either a single remote (bungee corded) or a PB setup. Grinder and valve kit on order as well!

Also, the W.R. Long valve kit will supposedly come with the correct fittings (in other words, custom kit for JD 4xxx) to tie in between the PB coming out of the SCV valve block before it makes it to the loop at the rear of the tractor.

dusty, I'm not seeing that handle when looking at the 3rd SVC kit (I'm only pulling up the rear one). Any chance of getting a part number?

 

[mechatgsk]

This is what I believe you are looking for. I have a 4520 and been thinking of doing the same thing you are doing. The bundle part number for this entire kit is LVB26032.


Mechatgsk

 

[dusty3030]

That's the handle and switch.
I looked in installation book but it didn't have pn's

 

[mechatgsk]

Here are the part numbers individually from JDParts. This will make up the handle and switch.

1-21H1486-Screw-Qty 2
2-LVU16650-Grip-Qty 1
6-LVU16701-Grip-Qty 1
3-37M7355-Screw-Qty 2
4-37M7356-Screw-Qty 1
5-LVA12162-Nut-Qty 2
7-LVA17501-Wiring Harness-Qty 1


Mechatgsk

 

[pclausen]

Thanks Mechatgsk!

I added pricing I fund online for each part:

1-21H1486-Screw-Qty 2 @ $0.50 = $1.00
2-LVU16650-Grip-Qty 1 @ $3.20 = $3.20
6-LVU16701-Grip-Qty 1 @ $14.75 = $14.75
3-37M7355-Screw-Qty 2 @ $0.30 = $0.60
4-37M7356-Screw-Qty 1 @ $0.33 = $0.33
5-LVA12162-Nut-Qty 2 @ $0.35 = $0.70
7-LVA17501-Wiring Harness-Qty 1 @ $48.25 = $48.25

Total $68.83, which is less than what W.R.Long charges for their handle/switch by itself, which is $85.00.

 

[foggy1111]

That my plan foggy.

Just to be clear, I don't have the PB kit on my tractor yet. Talked to the dealer and the original PB kit is no longer available, but a replacement one is. The only difference appears to be that the new one includes an inline filter, so I busted that out.

Dealer spoke to Woods and confirmed that their dual valve kit will work with either a single remote (bungee corded) or a PB setup. Grinder and valve kit on order as well!

I would like to see the pics of the Woods dual valve as well as their brackets and your hydraulic connections when you get that installed. Sounds like it should work pretty nice and if the valve is positioned correctly that may be a nicer way to operate than what I currently do.

I never considered that a pair of rear remotes could power a 4 way valve to operate the grinder. Duh! (Or....maybe I had a brain cramp?)

If there is any way to get turned a bit more to the rear while operating the grinder....it could be a huge plus. After a few hours....my set-up can get to be a pain in the neck - literally.

 

[pclausen]

I'll be sure to post pics of the install details.

I'm thinking I'll install the Woods control valves to the ROPS structure to be easily accessible from the seat, and possibly from the ground as well, standing next to the grinder.

If I install the valves on the grinder, I doubt I can reach them from the seat, at it would preclude me having a 2nd and 3rd remote for use with other rear implements.

 

[foggy1111]

Seems to me that Woods had a nice adjustable, swinging and telescoping arm to mount the valve on. Will be nice to see how that works for you. :thumbsup: