4300 repeatedly breaks turnbuckle,

[cowboydoc]

Re: Sorry Guys, no more Deere for me!!

I don't think you've abused a tractor like I have and I have never had one single thing go wrong with this tractor. I've used too big of a disk, mower, hauled too heavy of haybales, etc. etc. with it and it has never let me down. There has to be a reason this is happening. Not sure what it is but I'm sure if some of us with some tractor experience were around when you were using it we could find the problem. Not saying you are but oftentimes we overlook things or tend to leave pieces of the story out.

 

[smilingreen]

Gee.....
am I ever glad I own a 790. No problems at all. Maybe the Jap. made stuff is better??!!

 

[rancar]

Dave...

Eh....I believe much of the 4x00 and 4x10 series is "Jap made stuff." It's just assembled in Augusta, Georgia. /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif
...Bob

 

[smilingreen]

OHHHHH!!!!!/forums/images/graemlins/mad.gif
I hate it when someone gets one over on me!!!!/forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif Well, gee....I'm speechless...../forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif

 

[iamgott]

Re: Sorry Guys, no more Deere for me!!

Hi John, thanks for the help, I really mean it!!
The numbers off the old housing are: YZ 80986
and YZ 80420

The number on the new housing is YZ 81141 with a "W" in a square box and then a 1 after that

The number on the box the new housing came in is
YZ 81033

I must admit, the new housing looks tottally different, the inside has been milled much more, I mean it looks like at least 2 lbs less aluminum, I wonder if the dealer has a line on after market parts? Oh well, if it fits, its goin on, I need my machine,,,,,,,,,,,,yesterday!! Again, Thanks for the help and I guess I need a swift kick for starting this post the way I did. I apologize to everyone for that, and thanks to er'one for not rippin in to me, I definitely had it comin. I guess when I got home that day, I should of took a shower and went to bed, lol

 

[JohnMiller3]

Re: Sorry Guys, no more Deere for me!!

<font color="red">...The part is invalid.... </font>

I put everyone of those #'s in and get the same results... what is JD "nomenclature" of the part... is your hst, pr, gear sync?

I will post a hst for an example... but it doesn't show those mount area's... (none of them do?)

...updated... need to eliminate the "space" for JD database to accept...

 

[JohnMiller3]

Re: Rear Axle HST Housing Assy

this has your part number - right side

Rear Axle Housing HST – JD4300


Cart KEY PART NO. PART NAME QTY TRANSMISSION SERIAL NO. REMARKS

1 YZ80371 SHAFT 2

2 19M3115 CAP SCREW 6 M6 X 12

3 YZ80710 RETAINER 2

4 F65275 SEAL 2

5 F40211 BALL BEARING 2

6 YZ80420 HOUSING 1 - XXXXXE AXLE, RH

YZ81033 HOUSING 1 XXXXXF - AXLE, RH, (SUB FOR YZ80986)

7 YZ80331 DOWEL PIN 4

8 YZ103129 BALL BEARING 2

9 YZ80044 GEAR 2 73T
Cart KEY PART NO. PART NAME QTY TRANSMISSION SERIAL NO. REMARKS

10 F39040193 RING 2

11 YZ81133 BALL BEARING 2

12 19M7825 BOLT 2 M16 X 65

13 19M8610 BOLT 6 M16 X 110

14 YZ80421 HOUSING 1 - XXXXXE AXLE, LH

YZ81034 HOUSING 1 XXXXXF - AXLE, LH, (SUB FOR YZ80987)

 

[iamgott]

Re: Sorry Guys, no more Deere for me!!

UH oH, those numbers came right off the castings, also it an HST 4300 hydro. Probably is an aftermarket, I been looking closer, and man!!! They reduced the casting by heck, at least 20%. The original is much more massive and much heavier casting. This sorta worries me.

Here's another number off the box the new one came in:
20021113dy2 I sure hope this one comes up, thanks again, Ed

 

[JohnMiller3]

Re: Sync Reverser Housing Assy

this has the new housing #
Sync Reverser


Cart KEY PART NO. PART NAME QTY TRANSMISSION SERIAL NO. REMARKS

1 YZ80371 SHAFT 2

2 19M3115 CAP SCREW 6 M6 X 12

3 YZ80710 RETAINER 2

4 F65275 SEAL 2

5 F40211 BALL BEARING 2

6 YZ80420 HOUSING 1 - XXXXXE AXLE, RH

YZ81033 HOUSING 1 XXXXXF - AXLE, RH, (SUB FOR YZ80986)

7 YZ80331 DOWEL PIN 4

8 YZ103129 BALL BEARING 2

9 YZ80044 GEAR 2 73T
Cart KEY PART NO. PART NAME QTY TRANSMISSION SERIAL NO. REMARKS

10 F39040193 RING 2

11 YZ81133 BALL BEARING 2

12 19M7825 BOLT 2 M16 X 65

13 19M8610 BOLT 6 M16 X 110

14 YZ80421 HOUSING 1 - XXXXXE AXLE, LH

YZ81034 HOUSING 1 XXXXXF - AXLE, LH, (SUB FOR YZ80987)

 

[_RaT_]

Re: Sorry Guys, no more Deere for me!!

See what I mean, John's a wealth of information and this is just on the parts side! Rat...

 

[iamgott]

Re: Sorry Guys, no more Deere for me!!

Yes Rat, Actually Ive been a member for quite awhile, and it took awhile, but at some point, I remembered John from long ago. Really, I have been so busy trying to get our small business off the ground, and going back and forth with the dealer over this machine, I been neglecting my Computer, lol.
Plus at one time it crashed and it took me a while to find the site again.
As for the machine, I am a persistant person, Relentless, some might say. Its not even the money, but the principle of the matter. I definetely apreciate er'ones advise and I'll keep er'one updated as to what happens. Ed,,,,,,,,gott

 

[_RaT_]

Re: Sorry Guys, no more Deere for me!!

I applaud your effort to establish a business. I also wish the best outcome from this dilema. The repeated breaks of the turnbuckle and finally the axle housing certainly don't appear from your description to be from neglect or abuse. Thats what makes it so puzzling. Your boxscraper, from your description, doesn't even seem all that heavy. My 72" weighs a little over 1000lbs. Rat...

 

[iamgott]

Re: Sorry Guys, no more Deere for me!!

WOW!! I dont belive mine wieghs that much. Its pretty heavy duty, but I can near pick up one end of it. Mine is 72" also, but not near that heavy. Rat, do you have a JD compact tractor? and if so, does the turnbuckle look the same as the one I posted on the web site? Or anyone else for that matter. Im wondering if my local dealer is using some cheap aftermarket turnbuckles?? Thanks, and I posted some pics of the axle housings and my tractor in pieces on the page "link above" thanks again,,,Ed,,,,,,,,,,gott broken tractor pics HERE!

 

[BillyP]

Re: Sorry Guys, no more Deere for me!!

I have a tiller I use in my poultry houses. The book says it weighs 740lbs. The tiller offsets to the right, so there's about twice as much weight on one side than the other. When I'm transporting and hitting bumps, you can probably multiply the weight on that one side by 3 or 4.

I just don't see the weight as being the factor in in your problem.

 

[Jim_Fisher]

Re: Sorry Guys, no more Deere for me!!

iamgott,

On the turnbuckle that failed, at the top of the assembly, is a ball and socket that slides onto the pin in the right side of the rockshaft. Does that ball and socket move freely?

It seems to me that if that joint isn't free to move, the normal side to side movement of an implement would try to bend the turnbuckle bolt and result in the failure of the bolt, in the same manner that a coat hanger will break if it is repeatedly bent in one spot.

The other thing that comes to mind is the possibility of installing the ball and socket the wrong way. I don't have the three point hitch on my 4300 right now to test my theory (using the backhoe today), but I suspect that if the ball and socket was installed backwards, it might bind on the rockshaft pin, causing the same end result that I would expect if the ball wasn't free to move in the socket.


Jim Fisher

 

[iamgott]

Re: Sorry Guys, no more Deere for me!!

Yes, I keep it lubricated and its installed correctly. I know, its befuddlin, The other side has never broke since I purchased the machine, only the right side breaks, still open for any suggestions. I really wonder if someone makes an aftermarket turnbuckle and thats what they use. Im gonna check with another dealer, or better yet, John Deere Themselves.

 

[Jim_Fisher]

Re: Sorry Guys, no more Deere for me!!

<font color="blue"> Yes, I keep it lubricated and its installed correctly. </font>

I wasn't thinking lubrication as much as a burr or a stray piece of weld spatter.


<font color="blue"> I really wonder if someone makes an aftermarket turnbuckle and thats what they use. </font>

I can't imagine the dealer buying an aftermarket part if Deere will supply an OEM part under warranty and pay them to install it.


That bolt must be at least 3/4" ... I use an MX5 mower on mine and have some pretty good hills on which I mow paths.

If the part is inherently weak, mine should have broken long ago.

Another thing that puzzles me is where it broke. I would expect the weakest spot to be where it is drilled for the roll pin. From the picture that you posted it looks like it broke right at the base of the threads.

Hope you figure it out.

 

[iamgott]

broken turnbuckle

Yea Jim, It breaks on the bottom section, right at the end thread. Every single one breaks the same exact place. Keep thinkin, I really need to figure this out. and as for the one called Loner, That isn't called for, but oh well, some people just have to.

You know Jim?? I just thought of something, the links are at an angle, narrow at the top and spread out as they go down, I wonder if this would exert sideways stress? It still seems to be a straight pull but,,,,,,,,,,,,hmmmmn

 

[Jim_Fisher]

Re: broken turnbuckle

<font color="blue"> I just thought of something, the links are at an angle, narrow at the top and spread out as they go down, I wonder if this would exert sideways stress? </font>

I don't think that it would. The ball and socket makes it act like a pendulum. The only way to get the side stress would be for the ball and socket to bind or exceed the range of the ball and socket.

Most all of the joints are ball and socket. Even where the sway arm attaches to the tractor, a ball and socket is used.

The only major joint that isn't a ball and socket is also the joint that is closest to the break. Even if the implement were offset to the point where it balanced on the right draft arm, the ball and socket at the rear of the draft arm would prevent it from twisting the draft arm and stressing the turnbuckle.

The only thing that I can see that would tend to twist the draft arm and stress the turnbuckle is the fact that the draft arm isn't perfectly straight. If that is the case, then I would expect to see a good bit of wear at the top of the draft arm on one side and at the bottom of the draft arm on the other side at the point where the bottom of the turnbuckle is pinned to the draft arm.

 

[iamgott]

Re: broken turnbuckle

Ok, guess its back to square 1, hehe.
Maybe Im workin to fast, hittin bumps, jerkin it around to much, I dont know. I know a few months ago, I said I was gonna be real careful to see if I could keep from breakin it, and it still breaks, and always in the raised position. Not once has it broke while using it. Seems to me there should be a clue here. I know, a long time ago, I went to pull someone out of a hole. On the way back, I hit a chuckhole, a big one, and man did it bounce. I mean it made such a "KACHANG!!!" when I looked back I thought for sure it would have been broken, but it wasn't. But now, I can put on a new shackle, work the machine for 20-30 hrs, hit a small bump, and snap!! I guess, it really sounds like I'm doin something to cause fatigue and then when its had enough, it snaps?
I really just use the box to grade dirt, and I rarely grade or push backwards. I hardly ever use the brushhog, maybe twice a year, and its never broke with it on.