422 versus 425

MossRoad · Jun 2, 2005

it is no bulldozer!! 

No, but since you suggested to me to sharpen my teeth on the small bucket instead of leaving them rounded, it does a pretty good impression of one. /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif

FOURTEEN · Jun 3, 2005

Maybe on IN sand, but not on NC clay!! /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif

MossRoad · Jun 3, 2005

I agree that dry clay might as well be a brick wall. We just don't have the weight to break it up with the FEL bucket. I don't think any small tractor in our weight class will do much better.

In rock quarries, they blast the material into little bits before hauling it out with loaders. We have to do the same thing with hard stuff like dry clay... bust it up first with a ripper, tiller, plowshare, etc... then haul it out with the loader. Here's what I use to bust stuff up when needed. I drive back and forth a few times making a checkerboard pattern in an area. With it being in the front, you can re-trace your lines a little deeper each time if needed. Then scoop out the chunks with the toothed bucket and haul it out. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

pah · Jun 3, 2005

I bought a 422 rather than a 425 or 1430 because I already had a larger machine (an older jd crawler c/w loader/excavator bucket and a woods backhoe all in very good working condition ) In the past 13 months since buying the 422 I've put 270 hrs on it with only minor problems. In fact Ive hardly used my larger machine at all. I have 20 acres of hilly woodland and rough pasture. I've done lot's of landscaping, ditching, small pond excavation, grass? cutting and woodlot work ( I heat with wood ). You won't go wrong with either one but If the money and or more attachments are important go with the 422.

Phil_VA · Jun 3, 2005

Thanks to everyone for their responses to this post and the other one I have on attachments. Still no clear decision yet, but I really appreciate the feedback.

I'm leaning towards the 425, but having the extra money to spend on getting more attachments initially is pretty tempting.

- Phil

KentT · Jun 3, 2005

Phil,

I'm pretty much in the same dilemma that you are, but my rationale is to buy the bigger tractor to begin with... attachments can be added later, when the need arises and the $$ are available. You can't inexpensively go back and "re-do" the tractor decision...

blackwell · Jun 3, 2005

The 180 & 422 has one steering cylinder now , the old ones had two and would steer at 300 to 500 psi, with one the pressure would be 600 to 1000 psi under wheel scooting conditions. The cylinder is rated at 3000 psi. SO? One cyl allows the machine to steer twice as fast and reduce the need for a knob on the steering wheel. I think its a good idea on the small machines.
EB

BobRip · Jun 3, 2005

You are probably right. It gives PT the option of a cheaper machine without much loss (if any) in useability. Despite my desire to have a 425, my 422 works very well. I would not trade it for any tractor that my neighbors have.

Bob Rip

BillCroasmun · Jun 3, 2005

I don't have anything to compare to but I haven't "felt" any strain in turning my 180 w/ one cylinder. As you have said Blackwell it steers FAST!

Now I don't do a lot of high torque steering, like in swampy/marshy areas but I have been in a few interesting situations such as hanging the mower deck above a drainage ditch to cut the weeds and then had a front tire slip over the edge. One quick and effortless twist of the wheel and it's "popped" itself right out of the ditch easy enough.

Marks481 · Jun 4, 2005

The Robin 22HP and 25HP engines look like they are interchangeable. Same base size, bolting ring, and shaft diameter (slightly different shaft length). $1299 for 22HP, $1499 for 25HP. Goes to show that the upgrade in engine isn't driving the price difference between the 422 and 425 (looks easy to upgrade the engine if you want, and could probably recover most of the cost selling the replaced engine on Ebay).

PT180 owners would have a little more trouble, since the 18HP shaft is a different diameter (1.125 vs. 1-7/16"), so it wouldn't be as simple.

Anybody know the brand and model of the wheel motors used on the 180/422/425? How about the hydraulic pumps?

Marks481 · Jun 4, 2005

Oh the joys of the search function.

Wheel motors are manufactured by White Hydraulics, Model Number CE, Part# 400230W3122AAAAA. $310 each.

So I guess anyone who has a PT422 and is unhappy with the wheel torque should be able to upgrade to a stronger model for a reasonable amount (and even get drum brakes if desired).

All of this makes me lean toward buying a PT422 instead of a PT425 (I would even consider the PT 180, but the manual attachment pickup and lack of a reversable auxiliary hydraulic circuit make it less attractive).

tracdoc · Jun 4, 2005

( Oh the joys of the search function )

And the satisfaction of a succesful execution of same.... Good find, Tim.

Gravy · Jun 4, 2005

As a 425 owner who lives on steep, wooded, rocky clay that doesn't grow a nice lawn, here are my thoughts:

AFAIK, the differences boil down to:

1) 3 more hp.

2) 30-50% more claimed wheel torque, depending on who you ask and which models you compare.

3) 8" more lift height.

4) ROPS.

5) 2 steering cylinders.

#1&2 aren't very important unless you're going to be digging hard, working on steeper slopes, carrying or pulling heavy loads, etc. Since those things are most of what we do, we went for the 425. If most of what you are going to do is mowing flat yards, this may not be important.

Several 422 (and older 425) owners have commented here that they wouldn't mind more oomph and lift height. I haven't seen any 425 owners regret their choice between the two. In fact, there has been a good bit of discussion about upgrading the power and lift of the 425.

For me, #3 is a huge difference. I can just barely load over the side of my old Toyota 4x4 pickup. I'm pretty sure I could also load into a fullsize 4x2. With the 422, no way.

#4 is only important if there is any likelihood that you will ever work on a slope steep enough to risk a rollover, or where there are overhead hazards like tree branches. With a 422, this is a $500 upgrade (or $125 + shipping for the used one PT has listed at the moment).

My feeling is that #5 isn't really a big deal.

Our decision was that it made more sense for us to spend the extra upfront for the 425, and defer some implement purchase until later. I'm pretty sure it would cost more than the price difference to upgrade the 422 to 425 specs, and you'd have negated any initial savings.

As always, your mileage may vary. What works for me may not work for you.

Whichever you choose, I'm betting that you will find it's more fun than a basketful of puppies. Enjoy!

Gravy /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

Edit for another comment: If your tractor budget is absolutely fixed, with no expectation of future additions, you may get more capabilities for your buck with a 422 and a few more implements. Just remember that a machine that won't do what you need it to is a waste of time and money...

pajoube · Jun 4, 2005

Tim
Welcome to TBN and the PT family. Thanks for the info on the wheel motors.
PJ

BobRip · Jun 4, 2005

When I bought my 422, I took the roughly 2 hour class on maintenance. One of the key points was that the wheel circuit must be kept clean. If you go into it you must filter the system. PT sells a 3 micron filter (the normal one is 10 micron) and hose for this purpose. At that time (2000) it was about $700. If you change the motors then you should do this procedure. You risk the drive motor hydraulic pump. It is very sensitive to dirt. Has anyone changed a motor and did they use this filter?

Bob Rip

Marks481 · Jun 4, 2005

Thanks. I am not a member of the family yet, still browsing and trying to convince SWMBO that I need a tractor. Was thinking about a Kubota BX1800+, but a banner add on TBN for Powertrac has lured me down a whole new path... I haven't been looking at Kubotas anymore...

Thinking that I will have to drive up to Sudbury, and rent a PT425 for a day to see how I like it.

The wheel info was from a thread about brakes that SNOWRIDGE posted on this forum a couple months ago... there is definitely a wealth of information here when you go digging for it. Very nice that the forum keeps all the old posts (rather then killing them after a year like Woodnet).

Clarke · Jun 5, 2005

Had a wheel motor repaired under warranty. Removed motor plugged connections installed repaired motor. Terry said just put the motor back on nothing else was necessary.

sg

pah · Jun 5, 2005

When I bought my 422 in 04 04 Power trac quoted me $750.00 for the rops. I hope they have indeed lowered the price but even $500.00 seems high.

Marks481 · Jun 5, 2005

Anybody have a general idea how much Power Trac charges for shipment of individual implements, like a minihoe or something like that? I know that results may vary by mileage and weight, but a rough ballpark would be useful.

The bottom line is how much money would be saved by buying all attachments at once when picking up or shipping the tractor vs. buying implements individually at a later date.

tim

BobRip · Jun 5, 2005

It is important to realize that no matter what machine you buy, there are always times when you want something bigger (everybody new that right!). On the other hand we were building a foundation at church for a playland. I got there a little late and a guy with a fairly big tractor was trying to dig the trenches with a bucket. When he saw me with the 422 and minihoe, he backoff and said go for it. I was able to dig the trench in about one hour and could much more easily manuever where I needed to. When I got hung up on some trenches, two guys pushing a little helped me out. The bigger the tractor the more effort it takes to unstick it. There are lots of big tractors so owning a small one can actually be better.

Bob Rip