2420 injection pump ?

[bobfor]

Hello all,new member to the forum and Chinese tractors (or tractors and diesels for that matter). I have a 2004 2420 farm pro and it recently just stalled while bush hogging,after some research it seems its the injector pump. Just curious

1. What is the power steering looking pump thing,in front of the injector (looks like the cap is a breather?)
Also Ive read on a few forums that the plunger can stick and cause this but where on the pump would I go to get access to that? Ive been told by a dealer that it would be behind a plate thats behind the pump,but mine doesn't have the plate there.

2. Also looking at injector pumps online it seems there are different models and my doesn't really look like the ones Ive seen. Also on my manual it says TY290X is there a 290 and a 290 x model? thanks in advance Bob

 

[Bob Rooks]

Welcome Bob. :applause: :welcome: :applause:

 

[Rich Waugh]

Bob,

I'd suggest you call the folks at Affordable Tractor Sales in Texas and ask them about your issues. They're extremely knowledgeable and helpful, and they'll have any parts you may need. I wouldn't jump to any conclusions about the injector pump right off the bat, either. I don't hear of all that many failures of injector pumps, at least not compared to the injectors themselves, bad fuel, dirty fuel systems, etc. Always look for the cheapest possible problem - it's more likely than an expensive injector pump.

 

[bobfor]

Bob,

I'd suggest you call the folks at Affordable Tractor Sales in Texas and ask them about your issues. They're extremely knowledgeable and helpful, and they'll have any parts you may need. I wouldn't jump to any conclusions about the injector pump right off the bat, either. I don't hear of all that many failures of injector pumps, at least not compared to the injectors themselves, bad fuel, dirty fuel systems, etc. Always look for the cheapest possible problem - it's more likely than an expensive injector pump.

Rich thanks for the response, well I have did the basic trouble shooting that was recommended. Ive changed the fuel filter,changed the injector oil,and Iam getting fuel to the pump,but when I remove the hardlines and crank it over nothing coming out of those and from the research Ive done,that appears to be injector related. Also heard that sometimes the plunger sticks,but a couple parts dealers said the access to that is behind the primer pump but its not on mine. That's why Iam curious if the 290 and 290x are different? Bob

 

[greg_g]

Hard telling, the Chinese often change mechanicals without changing the manuals. Regardless, your tractor is a rebadged Jinma (JM204). Assuming you want manuals for the 2420, make sure to mention the X when ordering from a Jinma dealer. There are two for the engine, two for the tractor itself.

This piston things to which you refer are typically on top of the pump, not in the rear. Viewing them means removing the top plate. But try this simple test first. The hard lines are fastened to the injectors with hex collars. Loosen both collars about one turn, then crank the engine. If you see fuel dribbling down both, your pump is good. One wet and one dry suggests a stuck "piston. No dribbling means a non-functioning pump.

Sounds like that's about where you stopped. A stripped drive tang (or socket) is usually at fault. Both being dry could indicate both "pistons" stuck simultaneously, but that's more typical of pumps that have sat idle for prolonged periods. Before tearing into the pump itself, I recommend pulling the pump from the drive housing. Look at the exposed end of the pump and at the exposed drive gear. You should see a square drive tang on the pump, and a square socket in the drive gear. If you see a broken tang on the pump - or a stripped socket in the drive - that's your culprit. If both tang and socket appear functional, only then should you consider tearing into the pump itself.

//greg//

 

[bobfor]

Greg thanks for the reply. Well I did completely remove both hard lines from the injectors the other day and turned it over,I guess a fully functioning pump would of shot fuel out very strong? What I got was no fuel from the first line (by the radiator) and a slight dribble from the second line (by the firewall). So by removing the pump from the drive housing you mean completely removing it? Theres no way to check the plunger/piston with the pump still attached to the motor? Sorry for the newb questions,but the most Ive ever done with a diesel is fill the tank a couple times LOL,thanks again Bob

 

[greg_g]

No, the word "dribbling" was used intentionally. And yes, you can view them without removing the pump. But you want to make sure first that the pump drive is functioning normally. If the tang is slipping in the socket, the pump won't be turning at the correct speed. That can produce erratic flow through the hard lines. And in the event of insufficient pressure in those lines, the injectors may not pop. When they don't pop, no fuel is delivered to the cylinder. My recommendation is to disconnect the hardlines at the bottom, so they don't present resistance. Then remove the pump itself from the drive housing. If the tang and socket are undamaged, only then would I remove the top of the pump. I say this simply to minimize the possibly of otherwise unnecessary gasket damage and/or contamination.

That said, the fuel delivery system operates with critical tolerances. Unqualified tinkering can result in expensive repairs/replacements. Given your stated level of experience, you might want to consider handing this specific issue over to a certified diesel mechanic.

//greg//

 

[bobfor]

Unfortunately a mechanic isn't in the cards right now, also I have turned my share of wrenches just never on a diesel. Plus Iam kinda a DIY guy and I figure Iam gonna keep this little tractor for a while so I might as well learn about it? I will have some fun with it in a little bit, also I figure if my pump is bad or something in it,it wont really hurt?

 

[Bob Rooks]

A little "dribble" from an individual pump is acceptable because the pumps only deliver so many cc's of fuel per stroke. From your description it sounds like you only have one functioning barrel and plunger assembly out of all three. It is also possible that you have a stuck rack. Your symptoms are synonymous with corroded components caused by diesel bugs. The DIESEL FUEL BUG . If this is indeed the case then you have probably gone as far as you can go save for R & R the injection pump and governor assembly and take it to a diesel shop for cleaning and calibration.

 

[bobfor]

Bob thanks for the input,but from what Ive read it cost twice as much to rebuild these as it does to buy as new one. And that's if you could even find someone to rebuild it? Also if it is a stuck plunger from small debris,etc cant just that be taken apart ,cleaned and reassembled?

 

[Bob Rooks]

Also if it is a stuck plunger from small debris,etc cant just that be taken apart ,cleaned and reassembled?

Yes, but it's not that simple. Once taken apart it must be recalibrated and that can only be done accurately by qualified technicians on a test bench, and they cost upward of $20 large. The reason accurate calibration is so important is to assure the precise amount of fuel is delivered to each injector which assures even firing (detonation) pressures which assures (all other things being equal) even loading of the crankshaft, crankshaft bearings, rods, etc. In your case it may be cheaper to just purchase a new pump/governor assembly.
I would also test your fuel for bug contamination. I operate a 12 mW diesel-electric propulsion plant, and I have seen diesel bugs bring 16,000 HP diesel engines to their knees.

 

[Rich Waugh]

Everybody I know who tried to take apart one of these Chinese injection pumps ended up having to buy a new one. I'm not saying it can't be done if you're careful and only go as far as what doesn't need a $30K test bench to calibrate, but I just haven't heard of anyone doing it and not ending up needing a new pump. Ya pays yer money and ya takes yer chances, I guess.

 

[Affordable]

No because it would have to be recalibrated, we have a New Injector Pump for the TY290X engine, however the linkage may not be the same as they did have 2- different types of pumps.Now the only one available is the one we stock, not sure if its the same as yours or not, but that's the only one you can get

Tommy
Affordable Tractor Sales
"Your Jinma Parts Superstore"
Home of compact Jinma, Foton, and Koyker Tractors and Parts, Wood Chippers, Backhoes - Affordable Tractor Sales Company

 

[taylor tt]

Hello I have a question about my 2003 2420 farm pro tractor. When I start the engine it goes to a full throttle and the only way to shut it down is there is a metal handle located under the steering wheel that I pulled out and turned and it shut it down. Would this be a injector pump problem? None of the speed levers are stuck as far as I can tell. Any ideas? Thanks

 

[Rich Waugh]

Sounds like the rack is stuck in your injector pump's governor assembly. You can carefully clean this portion of the assembly, but don't mess with the injector pump part or you'll be buying a new pump. Your tractor should have a kill handle somewhere under the dash - what you're using sounds more like the compression release. The kill handle shuts off the fuel flow to the injector pump and on my tractor it is a black plastic T-shaped knob on a cable to the left of the steering column, below the dash. If your injector pump is on the right side of your engine the kill handle will be on the same side, probably. If you can't ind it any other ay, start at the injector pump and trace back the cables/linkages from the governor to the throttle(s) - it will be the "extra" one.

 

[Bob Rooks]

I agree with Rich. Apparently you actuated the compression release. That isn't a recommended method to shut down the engine.
In the illustration shown, the "control rod" is commonly referred to as the rack because of the rack and pinion type of gearing. In your case the rack sounds like it is stuck somewhere in or near the full fuel position.

 

[bobfor]

Hey guys just finding the time to remove the pump,I got everything off and after removing the 3 bolts from inside the housing cover,whats next? Is it pressed in,I don't see how you could get anything in there to press it out? Any help would be highly appreciated,thanks Bob

 

[bobfor]

Alright got it off, I had to take the primer pump off the unit just to get to that outside nut. Also not sure if this is normal but the gear with the 3 bolt holes came out with it,and that doesn't want to come off,is that a pressed on gear? Also once the pump was off (and the primer pump was still off) and I had a look at the cam,I manually turned it and yes the outside plunger (lifter) is sticking,so I definitely think I found my problem. Ive tried to lube it,clean it,and manually turn it but it still sticks (unless I take the top output valves/springs out) and then it doesn't stick,any ideals? I do have a new pump, but if I can get this one working it would be nice and I can throw the new one on the shelf,but if not I still need to get the front gear off,again any suggestions would be highly appreciated,thanks

 

[greg_g]

The drive gear is slotted in the center to accept the tang on the end of the pump drive shaft. The gear slot is what drives the pump tang. What you're describing is a tang that has forcefully rotated in the slot, effectively jamming the two together. That would explain the bad pump timing as well. You'll have to force the gear off the shaft to inspect both slot and tang. It's likely that one or both are beyond repair.

//greg//

 

[bobfor]

Yes I do know it has the slot and woodruff key but from looking at it ,it hasn't appeared to move? As I mentioned I do have a new pump,so no problem there,but Iam off to the local auto parts store for a gear puller. Do the gears normally just slide on and off the shaft or are they somewhat pressed on,also I did have the old style pump so I hope that this one will work (I was told it would)? thanks Bob