Snow Chains on front tires??

[John_Mc]

Ok, even with packed snow, something is not right if you have to use so much down pressure.
Any down pressure should not take the front end off the ground. You are losing a lot of tractive force.
It should be enough to provide just enough pressure to insure surface contact with the desired bucket angle. With enough traction, the bucket gets under the load and as it proceeds forward, the weight of the snow in the bucket itself, provides further ground contact stability.
Not trying to be insulting. Have confronted this occasion with myself and many customers.

You apparently have not dealt with how hard the ice and snow freezes to the pavement up here... and when it is down below 0˚F, rock salt is completely ineffective in helping to loosen it.

I try to avoid lifting the front wheels, but sometimes even if I do lift them, the lip of the loader just slides along on top of the ice - regardless of the bucket angle. Once things warm up a bit, and the ice is just sitting on top of the pavement, rather than frozen to it, you are correct that it does not take much pressure.

 

[arrow]

You apparently have not dealt with how hard the ice and snow freezes to the pavement up here... and when it is down below 0˚F, rock salt is completely ineffective in helping to loosen it.

I try to avoid lifting the front wheels, but sometimes even if I do lift them, the lip of the loader just slides along on top of the ice - regardless of the bucket angle. Once things warm up a bit, and the ice is just sitting on top of the pavement, rather than frozen to it, you are correct that it does not take much pressure.

I’ve dealt with zero temps and nothing more than minus 10.
If one is using the front bucket to leverage the tractor and thus having to lift the tractor to gain that leverage, my thinking and experience is the loss of front wheel additional push, negates the effectiveness of the technique.
I guess it depends on the size of the tractor and whatever works best for the operator. Can be a little tough on the frame of fel and tractor for that matter.
Wondering if a toothed rear implement may be better or even the teeth on say a root grapple.

 

[dnw64]

Ok, even with packed snow, something is not right if you have to use so much down pressure.
Any down pressure should not take the front end off the ground. You are losing a lot of tractive force.
It should be enough to provide just enough pressure to insure surface contact with the desired bucket angle. With enough traction, the bucket gets under the load and as it proceeds forward, the weight of the snow in the bucket itself, provides further ground contact stability.
Not trying to be insulting. Have confronted this occasion with myself and many customers.

It's not a bucket, it's a front mount snowblower. AND I have added a UHMW "cutting edge".

 

[John_Mc]

Wondering if a toothed rear implement may be better or even the teeth on say a root grapple.

Actually, I use the ripper shanks on my 6' box blade from time to time. When conditions are really bad, even lowering just two of the shanks to concentrate the weight won't crack the ice - it just leaves some grooves partway through it.

 

[Shawn T. W.]

True. But the topic here was about getting stuck in deep snow or mud, during which I'm either plowing, pulling a trailer thru snow, or clearing trails, not lifting anything heavy. So those are the scenarios I had in my head, when talking weight distribution.

Well ... If you talking about the rabbit trails this has gone off on ... Sure!

But, my take on the OP was dealing with snow, with a backhoe on ...

Without any load up front, TLB's tend to be a bit tail heavy, until there is something put up front, in general a bucket full of snow, is quite a bit lighter then dirt, so the front end still needs some steering assistance, so chains could certainly help with steering, presumably Guy is using his TLB and the loader bucket to clear snow from his driveway ... As most people don't buy a CUT to go "logging" in the woods with turf tires ...

One of the challenges with snow removal is usually most of the weight of whatever implement is being used needs to be on the ground to do the job ... So either you need a really heavy tractor, or a way to increase traction, like chains ...

The smaller and lighter the tractor is, the more pronounced this challenge is ... I run chains front and back on my SCUT, plus add 275 Lbs of weight lifting plates to the back on the BH mounting frame, in addition to filled tires and steel wheel weights, I don't drop the bucket all the way to the ground, and use the rear blade to do most of the work, the front bucket kinda just scoops off some of the previous furrow left from the rear blade ...

 

[arrow]

Actually, I use the ripper shanks on my 6' box blade from time to time. When conditions are really bad, even lowering just two of the shanks to concentrate the weight won't crack the ice - it just leaves some grooves partway through it.

Hmm
It’s as if a mechanism similar to a flail mower only with its hammers specially formulated to strike and break up ice instead of grass might be a solution.
Cost factors for such a specialized instrument become concerning however.

 

[fatjay]

I was considering tires on the front just for steering, I'm on full lock and still going strait.

 

[bdhsfz6]

I've been usin

Kubota L4760 with turf tires. Would I cause a problem if used chains on front tires only? I have the backhoe for weight on rear tires.
Guy

FWIW, I've been using a FEL plow with front only chains since 1979 on all 7 of my Kubota tractors. I always carry weight on the 3pt, don't get aggressive with what I'm doing and have never had a problem.

I would not consider doing this for anything other than plowing snow however.

 

[John_Mc]

I was considering tires on the front just for steering, I'm on full lock and still going strait.

I assume you meant "chains on the front"?

When dealing with snow, I sometimes find that full lock is more likely to push straight ahead than if I decrease the turn to maybe half. (I'm running R4 tires if you have other style tread, YMMV.) If you are using a loader bucket, lift it a bit to put more weight on the front wheels. With a plow, the underslung setup some folks on here have sounds as though it really makes a difference: the weight of the loader frame is still on the front tires, just the plow itself and a little bit of added frame are on the ground.

If using chains to improve lateral traction/steering, the diamond pattern ("Euro style") chains help more than ladder style. If you can;t find that style for your tires, try looking at chains for UTV/ATV.

 

[WinterDeere]

Well ... If you talking about the rabbit trails this has gone off on ... Sure!

But, my take on the OP was dealing with snow, with a backhoe on ...

Au contraire! That sounds exactly like my situation. With backhoe mounted, there's a lot more weight on those rear tires, as I had described.

I'm running a heavy ballast box in deep snow, he's running a backhoe-mounted tractor in deep snow. What's the diff?

You seem to be arguing there will be more weight on the fronts, because he has a backhoe mounted on the back of the tractor? I'm having trouble following that logic, but will admit I've been only quickly skimming this thread, and might have missed something.

 

[Too many Kubotas]

I'm running a heavy ballast box in deep snow, he's running a backhoe-mounted tractor in deep snow. What's the diff?

To me the main difference is that the backhoe can be used to get unstuck if needed.

 

[Shawn T. W.]

.

You seem to be arguing there will be more weight on the fronts, because he has a backhoe mounted on the back of the tractor? I'm having trouble following that logic, but will admit I've been only quickly skimming this thread, and might have missed something.

No, normally with just a BH on, yes it will be tail heavy, and with him trying to use the loader to clear snow ... He will also be lightening the load on the front tires ...

Most tractors don't have a heavy BH on back, which would then need to add weight, like the video shows, no load on the front pallet forks, but a small load on the rear carryall, evens it out to almost 50/50 ... A heavy load like a BH would be more than twice that weight ... So would be tail heavy.

And if he is using the bucket or a plow/snow pusher the tires shouldn't be in "deep snow" either ... Much different situation than pulling a trailer or trees out of the woods on a unmaintained trail with deep snow ...

And yes, having an "unstucker" on the back of/when it's needed! But limits how you can clear snow.

 

[WinterDeere]

A heavy load like a BH would be more than twice that weight ... So would be tail heavy.

Exactly. Which is why I was giving my experience from that perspective, also running tail-heavy on my tractor. In the OP's case, chains on front only are less useful, as I was stating. I've found the same experience on my tractor, and my ballast box isn't even as heavy as a BH.

 

[Shawn T. W.]

Exactly. Which is why I was giving my experience from that perspective, also running tail-heavy on my tractor. In the OP's case, chains on front only are less useful, as I was stating. I've found the same experience on my tractor, and my ballast box isn't even as heavy as a BH.

So ... Nothing the OP should do different other than except it won't turn?

Either suck it up buttercup, or maybe buy a four wheeled loader, or ditch his BH, or buy a pickup with a plow, or pay someone to clear his snowy driveway, or?

 

[WinterDeere]

So ... Nothing the OP should do different other than except it won't turn?

Either suck it up buttercup, or maybe buy a four wheeled loader, or ditch his BH, or buy a pickup with a plow, or pay someone to clear his snowy driveway, or?

No one said that. All I said that chains on only front tires, with none on rears, isn't going to buy much on a machine where most of the weight is on the rear.

In any case, that's all that needs to be said. Have fun.