Advice on Hydrostatic Transmission vs Gears

[stevem5215]

K46 can be serviced. You must remove it and turn it upside down. I've done my Craftsman one twice now. Both times the fluid was beat up and bad looking. Refresh it and it'll work like new again. I use 5w-50 in it or whatever is close to available. The K58 is heavier duty and better overall and not known to fail like the K46 design due to a lightweight design.

 

[Too many Kubotas]

My first tractor experience, except my home made version, was an L3800 size Kubota that came with my girlfriend when she moved in.

I was ecstatic to have a loader but it didn't take me long to start really disliking its manual transmission, especially when using the loader to pick up dirt.

These days I'm using the L3800 she bought after moving to here the most often, by far. And that's largely because it's an HST.

 

[Ortimber]

Resale likely would be better with an HST. For a compact size tractor, I wouldn't own anything other than an HST machine.

 

[mmaliga]

I have 2 gear tractors (Case 255, Mitsubishi MTE2000) and 1 HST (New Holland 25S). It truly depends on what you are doing with what attachment. The Hydro tractor is an incredible lawnmower. Loader work is pretty good with it. The Mitsubishi tractors do well with grading and snow clearing. Transmission selection is just one part. Tires are the biggest deal. Weight is a big deal as well. Lifting capacity can be important. Size can be important.

 

[Wobblin-Goblin]

In my experience that only happens with the heavy 24 hp tractors that only exist because they’re trying to beat the epa emissions regulations. If you have enough power the HST works just fine.

I had a MF 1643 with Hydro. Clearly before the new emissions standards applied and almost double the horsepower you quoted...and I hated the Hydro on that tractor. Between the noisy whine and the power loss it was a bridge too far for me and I replaced it with a 4707 with Powershuttle.

Also recently bought a new TYM 2515, but with the reverser, not hydro.

Hydro has its uses, but gears with a reverser (or even better: clutchless powershuttle) are overall superior, IMO.

 

[Wobblin-Goblin]

Because the edit function isn't friendly, here is a new post based on my personal experiences with both Hydro and geared Shuttle tractors:

1. If you are using the loader with forks to lift and move pallets the Hydro is far superior because it's a pain to creep up to the pallet slowly and position the forks perfectly so they slide in the slot without wrecking the pallet.

2. If you are mowing/bush hogging, Hydro is slightly better due to the ability to instantly change direction and speed. It's not as big of a an edge as #1 above, but it's certainly an advantage.

3. Using the loader to do earth work is a push. Hydro is still quicker than a Reverser, but not by a lot. In order to have the grunt, you'll need to use low range in Hydro when digging into a pile, but after that, you'll have to stop completely to shift into mid range to get anywhere. It's "easier" to use than a geared Shuttle, but once you get used to the geared Shuttle, I think the advantages in this use are negligible.

4. Pulling anything. Geared Shuttle wins hands down.

5. Noise, vibration, and harshness (NVH) is greater on the Hydro than geared Shuttle, so win goes to the Shuttle.

6. There is more maintenance with a Hydro, that is a fact. However, in terms of reliability, a seasoned operator should know what not to do to avoid either cooking the fluid of a Hydro or wearing out a clutch on a geared Shuttle, so this category is a slight advantage to the Shuttle.

 

[Too many Kubotas]

In order to have the grunt, you'll need to use low range in Hydro when digging into a pile, but after that, you'll have to stop completely to shift into mid range to get anywhere.

Maybe I'm doing it wrong, but to fill a loader bucket with dirt from a pile requires very little forward power, just enough to creep forwards a little bit while raising and curling the bucket.

In other words, the tractor may need only 5 hp to move, and the loader does the work.

Also, I can use low or mid range for that operation, and if I parked the trailer that the dirt generally gets dumped into even remotely intelligently it can stay in low range.

 

[4570Man]

Maybe I'm doing it wrong, but to fill a loader bucket with dirt from a pile requires very little forward power, just enough to creep forwards a little bit while raising and curling the bucket.

In other words, the tractor may need only 5 hp to move, and the loader does the work.

Also, I can use low or mid range for that operation, and if I parked the trailer that the dirt generally gets dumped into even remotely intelligently it can stay in low range.

If it’s a fresh pile off a truck it scoops pretty easily but if it’s set for a while and compacted it’s hard to break loose.

 

[Too many Kubotas]

In my case it's generally getting the dirt from piles that have sat there for a decade or more.

If for some reason it's more than the L3800 would like to deal with, without using it as a dozer of sorts, I'd either get a smaller bucket or use the larger tractor. Thankfully that hasn't happened yet, but I'm sure it also depends on the type of dirt.

 

[Wobblin-Goblin]

One advantage to Hydro while digging into a pile is that if you let off the go pedal, the tractor simply stops. On a geared tractor, you can let off the go pedal but those tires are still churning until something breaks or the tractor stalls.

 

[hayden]

One advantage to Hydro while digging into a pile is that if you let off the go pedal, the tractor simply stops. On a geared tractor, you can let off the go pedal but those tires are still churning until something breaks or the tractor stalls.

You need to clutch or hit the reverser, depending on what you have. I've been practicing my timing on hitting the reverser with my new-to-me IVT transmission. That's still needed with an IVT. You can also brake and that automatically clutches.

 

[JTKub]

My first tractor experience, except my home made version, was an L3800 size Kubota that came with my girlfriend when she moved in.

Girlfriends that come equipped with tractors? Sounds great unless you tick her off. LOL

 

[Too many Kubotas]

Girlfriends that come equipped with tractors? Sounds great unless you tick her off. LOL

Hah, that was many years ago and we're still together.

Also, she bought two of the four we have now, although she has never used either one of those two. I sure do.

 

[redman135]

To the OP. HST would be better for your children as they are more forgiving of mistakes, than their gear driven equivilents, and easier to learn from a zero start.
BUT be aware that these small tractors are narrow and tippy. LOOK at the rear rims. You want the 2 piece rims that let you widen the track for more stability(surprising amount of difference) and ballast the rear. Significant safety gains.
I am off hill country and the tractors have wide track or dual wheels.

 

[Wobblin-Goblin]

You need to clutch or hit the reverser, depending on what you have. I've been practicing my timing on hitting the reverser with my new-to-me IVT transmission. That's still needed with an IVT. You can also brake and that automatically clutches.

LOL, no kidding. I was simply making the point that geared tractors will bury or break themselves if not operated correctly.

 

[Texasmark]

As I get older, I realize the kids really won't be comfortable (or safe) on the older 60's tractors I have that I grew up with (AC, Farmall). We don't farm full time but maintain the fields, odd jobs, etc. I am considering selling the older machines (well maintained and in excellent condition), and finding a 40-50hp size modern machine with cab and quick detach loader - something the kids can relate to and use more than the old stuff. Won't hurt me to plow snow in a warm cab either.

I am favoring hydrostatic for ease of use. But in general, how do they hold up compared to conventional geared machines? I realize this is a very broad question, but how trouble free are the newer hydrostatics?

Well I made that mistake when I bought my 25 HP "second set of hands" for general purpose, whatever comes up, help while working alone. So I bought the old school gear shifter.

3 years later, I traded it in on a hydro because the shifter was a PIA when doing the kind of support work for which I bought the small tractor......haven't looked back.......too many hydros out there on big machinery working hard every day and holding their own to worry about it working.

If you make the same mistake I did, once you get the hydro you can't believe the difference in convenience.

One fine example. As stated I work alone and hooking up implements is my biggest !@#$%^&&*. With the hydro you can back up to the implement, standing on the right side, easily access the 3 pt lift lever and the foot pedals....so if you need to back up a couple of inches, you don't have to mount the tractor, push the clutch find the right gear, let the clutch out and all that "crap". You just reach down with your right hand and put a little pressure on the necessary foot lever and move the machine to suit you with nothing more than a little hand pressure where you are standing.......just no comparison.

 

[walnutman]

Yanmar YT series. That trans is the cat's meow.

 

[Texasmark]

Yanmar YT series. That trans is yhe cat's meow.

YT2 Series | YANMAR Tractor

Explore YANMAR tractor models in the innovative YT2 series. Popular for 10 to 50 acres.

www.yanmartractor.com

Good looking tractor at 35 HP. The Yanmar was the first tractor brand of its kind to enter the N. Dallas area as I recall back in the late '60's or early 70's....just nobody else for a long time. Yanmar builds engines and tractors for JD and other companies too. The 3 speed hydro is common over a 2 speed in the industry. My 2021 LS MT2-25S has the Yanmar 3 cyl. 25 hp diesel....never had a minutes trouble with it.

 

[JRH02]

I think it has a lot to do with what you're used to, doesn't it?

My neighbor used my post hole digger so it was on his Kubota when I needed it. He said just take the rig to auger your holes. It was basically the same size as my B7100 but sat higher. Hydro. It was kind'of nice on the trail between our places. But when drilling/ positioning, I hated it.

I like gears.

 

[walnutman]

This is the 59hp YT359C
The transmission is amazing and he didn't even get into the A/B modes.