M59 Help: Dealer Wants $6K to Replace the Wiring Harness

[hodge]

A friend of mine has a Deere 1023E, and mice got to it the first Winter he owned it. That was a $6000 bill for the dealership to replace the wiring harness.

 

[MinnesotaEric]

Kubota M59, unknown year, ~2600 hours. I've had it about 10 months, have close to $40K into it including major service, new brakes, and completely rebuilt loader and loader hydraulics. I just point this out to say I've been operating with an open checkbook to get this puppy sorted, but I'm pretty sure the dealer is tired of fussing with it and finally gave me a go-away quote regarding this electrical gremlin I've been chasing.

Unfortunately, tractor has been more down than up. I'm the official-unofficial mechanic here at a tropical fruit park under construction in Central Florida. Primary duties for this bad boy are moving mulch, logs, and general sitework. We're blessed to have it, but electrical issues have hobbled it a lot.

TL;DR - Machine keeps blowing:
- the (#7) 5amp fuse for the "brake lamp switch" (orange, 2nd from top right)
- the 30amp slow-blow "keystop" (pink, 2nd from left)

Despite their labeling, one or both of them are involved with the start sequence, specifically the fuel shutoff solenoid (which I have replaced).

Trouble Sequence: No Start
- When turning the key to the 2nd position (before start) — the operator is supposed to hear to the fuel shutoff solenoid open (it does not)
- Then as soon as I depress the clutch pedal (again, before start), the #7 5amp will blow

- The 30amp slowblow gives me trouble in fits, I can't replicate a specific sequence before it

Attempted Remedies
- (3) trips to the dealer where they replaced the fuses, drove it around a little bit, sent it home to me, had the fuses continually blow again 1-3hrs back into operation
- 4-5 hours (from me) looking for any broken wires that I could see in these circuit(s), replacing, repairing, and protecting them ( I can solder pretty alright)

Would be looking for any and all help — including moral support — in chasing down these electrical gremlins, suggestions for things to do beyond above, tips for finding breaks I can't easily see, or ideas on how to bypass some of the circuit to help troubleshoot. I have a multi-meter but I'm not super great with it, for example, I'm not even sure if a fuse is blowing if that intones a problem upstream or downstream of the fuse, or if it could be both.

Thanks in advance. I need you guys.

If I was you I would install fuse circuit breakers and let it buck. The circuit breaker pops saving the dead short from melting the wiring harness, resets and off you go again.

Fuse circuit breakers are available in every fuse type and size.

Amazon.com

 

[grsthegreat]

Well, first off, the OP opined that the dealer was getting sick of working on his tractor, so likely the price was inflated.

Secondly, $295 sounds woefully inadequate for a wiring harness on a tractor that was built in this century. An 8N, OK.

Similarly, I can promise you that even if a factory trainer Kubota tech could replace it (mind all the grime that is in the pics) in 3 hours, ain't no way that is the published labor cost (no doubt in part because of the anticipated grime).

Nevertheless, $6k is over the top. Most likely due to my original point.

dont bet on it. mine was replaced several years ago....heres an equivalent kioti dk45 harness

KIOTI TRACTOR PART OEM GENUINE ASSY WIRE HARNESS, MAIN / TB25-0011D | eBay

Find genuine KIOTI Tractor Parts on eBay, including OEM wire harness assemblies for TB25 models. Shop now and keep your tractor running smoothly.

www.ebay.com

heres michiganiron site for dk45 wiring harness

 

[grsthegreat]

A friend of mine has a Deere 1023E, and mice got to it the first Winter he owned it. That was a $6000 bill for the dealership to replace the wiring harness.

who would pay $6k for a repair to a 12K tractor, when its only a simple wiring harness. there plug and play install. start at one end and replace like for like as you wrap around tractor. mine tool me about 3 hours as i was being very careful and securing loom as i went along.

they list a JD1023e wiring harness kits from $525-750 new

 

[dnw64]

dont bet on it. mine was replaced several years ago....heres an equivalent kioti dk45 harness

KIOTI TRACTOR PART OEM GENUINE ASSY WIRE HARNESS, MAIN / TB25-0011D | eBay

Find genuine KIOTI Tractor Parts on eBay, including OEM wire harness assemblies for TB25 models. Shop now and keep your tractor running smoothly.

www.ebay.com

heres michiganiron site for dk45 wiring harness


View attachment 3811953

That doesn't tell me anything. Do you need ONE of those things, or TEN of them?

 

[sandman2234]

LOL anomad, yeah she's pretty soiled, I gave it a quick garden hose down in the morning twilight, power wash definitely needed.

Okay well here's a update:

- We're back in the barn (yeah)
- I disconnected the brake lights — 5amp fuse still blew on key turn to start (one click later)
- so I thought... what if I just tryyyy to start without the 5amp fuse in at all and... IT STARTED

Which means?
- an open circuit is better than a broken circuit?

Isn't a broken fuse the same as having no fuse? How does that make sense?

I'm super scratching my head at this one.

Also not completely scientific in that I temporarily have a 40amp slow blow in the 30amp spot since I was down to my last 30amp. I think I've gone through 50-60 fuses total of both types in trying to hunt down this gremlin. Time to reorder some of those so I can tech this in the barn where all my tools are.

I'm still not sure how the 30amp and 5amp are related (anyone able to follow that trail on the wiring diagram?)

I appreciate all the responses, guys. Thank you KW, OZ, and anomad for talking this out. I've been here before, so I know it's not yet licked. I'll keep updating since I hate dead threads where the outcome is unknown.

I wish I had bought stock in 30 amp fuses! I went through a bunch with my camper trying to get things straight! I am not a big advocate of amazon but I did buy a huge assortment of fuses on there.
David from jax

 

[grsthegreat]

That doesn't tell me anything. Do you need ONE of those things, or TEN of them?

.? Only one. There are 3 variations depending on options like cab or cab with air, etc.

 

[grsthegreat]

I wish I had bought stock in 30 amp fuses! I went through a bunch with my camper trying to get things straight! I am not a big advocate of amazon but I did buy a huge assortment of fuses on there.
David from jax

I bought the same thing. Keep a set in the rigs and in shop. Have come in handy many times. A whole kit for less than 5 fuses at Napa.

 

[sandman2234]

I bought the same thing. Keep a set in the rigs and in shop. Have come in handy many times. A whole kit for less than 5 fuses at Napa.

I bought 2, one for the shop and one for the camper!
David from jax

 

[rScotty]

Thanks for your quick replies, OZ and KW.

I forgot to ask a pointed question:

Where is/what is the "stop lamp" so I can start from that load and work back to the fuse block. I'm confused by both the manual and the diagram, if that's the parking brake lamp or the brake lights (wait, does this tractor have brake lights) or something related to the light on the instrument panel?

Our M59 doesn't have brake lights. It only has a red BRAKE warning light on the instrument panel.

You probably can't trace back from that light to the fuse because that BRAKE warning light is just an panel LED that lights in response to a signal from a switch. An LED doesn't draw enough current to blow a fuse, only a hot wire touching the frame i.e. a "short" draws that much current

My guess is your electrical short is associated with one of the brake, clutch, or seat switches. There are two brake warning switches - one for the hand parking brake beside the seat, and another switch for the locking lever that locks the foot brakes. Either one should light that BRAKE LED on the instrument panel.

There is also a weird switch under the seat which tells the tractor whether the seat is facing forward or has been reversed for backhoe operation. What is wierd about the seat rotation switch is that it reverses the operation of both the hand brake and the clutch pedal switchs. It does that so that you can start the tractor even when the seat is in the backhoe position......but doing so requires that you put on the hand brake. That combination of seat reversal switch & hand brake switch, & clutch switch has to work together or the tractor won't start. Adjusting them just right required attention several times on our M59 and when wrong it used to blow fuses. I wonder if someone tried to bypass those three switches and got it wrong.
You might want to look closely at those three switches.
rScotty

 

[hodge]

who would pay $6k for a repair to a 12K tractor, when its only a simple wiring harness. there plug and play install. start at one end and replace like for like as you wrap around tractor. mine tool me about 3 hours as i was being very careful and securing loom as i went along.

they list a JD1023e wiring harness kits from $525-750 new

That would be a question for him, not me. I know him, he's as honest as the day is long, and he said that mice had chewed his harness over the Winter, the tractor wouldn't start, and the dealership had replaced the harness for that price. I don't know other details, but I also know that he didn't lie or exaggerate. The point was, it isn't an isolated circumstance where a dealer will charge that kind of money to replace a harness.

 

[Mike1955]

I urge you to set up a test light to replace the fuse. It's the way the pros find shorts. Easy to do. No more feeding it fuses. The light is current limiting so no danger to the wiring. Easiest is to find an old headlight or taillight assembly and rob the bulb socket and some harness. Connect a length of wire to it with appropriate spades to plug into the fuse holder. Use enough wire so you can get the bulb up where you can see it. If you have an amp clamp you can monitor the amperage too to know what load (normal verses dead short) you are seeing. Changing light brightness when wiggling wiring (or pushing the clutch pedal, etc.) is what you are looking for.

Kwenting that’s a starting place. But this man isn’t far enough along in electrical to do that. Are you close enough to go and assist him. You could locate the wire or device with the intermittent short for him. I think you are so close to finding it and a wiring harness is unnecessary. Only one wire probably.

 

[mikester]

Another suggestion: clean up everything and look for dodgey homebrew wiring.

WTF is that loose red wire down below doing? Why is your main fuse panel hanging?

Electrical problems can be a nightmare to diagnose.

Starting with a dirty machine with parts hanging off won't make your life any easier.

 

[deezler]

Seconding the other suggestions that you need to degrease and powerwash the entire machine. Attempting to solve wiring issues on a filthy tractor is simply ridiculous, IMO.

You also stated:

Attempted Remedies
- (3) trips to the dealer where they replaced the fuses, drove it around a little bit, sent it home to me, had the fuses continually blow again 1-3hrs back into operation
- 4-5 hours (from me) looking for any broken wires that I could see in these circuit(s), replacing, repairing, and protecting them ( I can solder pretty alright)

So wait, how many broken wires did you find?!? You imply here that you found multiple wire issues that you had to solder back together? If you found multiple wire breaks, fixed some, and are still poking around on a filthy tractor, dude.... step back and reevaluate things here.

Finally, the suggestion about replacing fuses with circuit breakers is another wise starting point. My poor neighbor was about to give up on his New Holland TC35 for blowing fuses when I did some research on here and found that most people solve it with a slow trip circuit breaker. $15 and he's been good for a few years now.

 

[KWentling]

Kwenting that’s a starting place. But this man isn’t far enough along in electrical to do that. Are you close enough to go and assist him. You could locate the wire or device with the intermittent short for him. I think you are so close to finding it and a wiring harness is unnecessary. Only one wire probably.

I have no idea where the OP is located, but by the pictures I'm sure it's no where near NE Wyoming. He hasn't been on this site since the 21st so this is probably another thread with an unknown outcome.

 

[dodge man]

There is a pretty good chance people will continue to post to this thread and say “the first thing you need to do is power wash that thing”.

 

[Mike1955]

Mice can do unseen damage to tractors. That’s where they work, in hidden places

 

[Jrasband]

The first thing you need to do is power wash that thing.

 

[grsthegreat]

The first thing you need to do is power wash that thing

 

[dnw64]

The first thing you need to do is get out the Steam Cleaner.