Son's new career path, pretty proud father

[Sigarms]

Even with kids with the same biology and upbringing, they can still be completely different. Our 2 girls are completely different in their personalities and life ambitions.

That I understand. My wife and her sister are NOTHING alike, and I consider myself blessed that I got my wife

That said, having a son die due to a drug overdose (something laced with fentanyl) kind of sticks with you about what you should have done differently as a parent.

I mentioned it in another thread, but one reason why my son in the AF got a pretty big tattoo (which surprised the living heck out of me because he never seemed interested in tattoo's) was because of a pact he made with his brother when they were growing up. I never had a clue about this pact they made with each other.

Helping out last year at the local high school for church work in the county, came across my son's old high school principal and he (principal) was asking about him. I told the principal about the tattoo, and he said he remembered him talking about it and why he wanted it when he was still in high school. I had no clue...

I was impressed with the tattoo shop in Lackland. Can't get one when you're drunk and they ask you why you want it. After my son told him why he wanted the tattoo, he had to go back two times for them to finish it, and they did it for free for him. Had to laugh, son said it hurt like a bugger...I got to admit, it is pretty well done.

 

[gsganzer]

Sorry about your son's death. I remember reading the thread. We can influence our kids only so many hours of the day, the rest of the time, the rest of society has their chance.

I had a nephew that was hooked on drugs. I expect he would have also overdosed at some point, had he not died from asthma. In a sense, the asthma death was also related to his drug use, because he didn't have money to get his rescue inhaler refilled due to poor choices.

 

[Sigarms]

due to poor choices.

You hit the nail on the head as to why some things happen to people when they grow into adulthood IMO.

I'm in no way trying to defend my one son's actions because of the poor choices he made, but there were some things that came up after we talked with his biological sister at his memorial service (first time we met her, long story). His 3 biological brothers (2 who were in foster care) are making the exact same poor choices now that they're adults.

When you adopt kids "locally" from the state you live in whose families may not be a good influence, it adds another wrinkle into parenting.

We never hid our boys biological families from their lives, as they both knew they were adopted between 7-8 years old when they were in the foster care system.

Sad to say, there is no licensing to have children and anyone can have them, but the reality is some people should not be able to propagate IMO. I say that with first hand experience.

At the end of the day, sooner or later I'm looking forward to talking to the son no longer with us as there are so many things I want to say to him.

 

[Gator6x4]

He came home for a visit last night.

I was asleep when he pulled in last night, but in my office at 06:00 this morning to tell me he's going off with his older biological brother for breakfast and hitting a local car show in another town (long story, but I believe I mentioned both of our boys were adopted at a young age).

I had to ask him why he got a hair cut (he keeps his hair within regulations apparently, but longer IMO than I think it normally should be when I see him home LOL) it looked more like a high and tight this morning.

Apparently he was teaching a visiting high ranking official "one on one" on something new. He told me some other things he was doing, and he really seemed happy and enthused with what he was doing. I'm kind of impressed with him training this "official" because this guy is up the food chain after my curiosity got the best of me and I wanted to look.

The reason why I'm really proud of him is I found out from him that his first recruiter kind of screwed him over on his enlistment (he didn't realize it at the time). I couldn't figure out why he didn't get a choice of his MOS's (or whatever the air force calls it), and he didn't know what tech school he would go to until after he finished basic (apparently our son basically let the Air Force decide where to put him which was a big NO NO in my book but he never explained it to us and we didn't force the issue and just wanted to be supportive).

Son wanted to go into the mechanical field (either air craft or vehicles) and got something totally different. I explained to him when he was in tech school that sometimes we don't always get what we want in life, but what determines your future is how you react to something that you don't expect to get. Give 110% of yourself, be enthused, be trainable and act nice with your coworkers is exactly what he is doing even though he was originally disappointed in tech school on what he got.

Since he got that award of some sort for the work he's doing a couple of months ago, he's doing exactly what I told him and he seems happy. Only thing you can really hope for your kids IMO.

Apparently he needs to take some more tests, but he seems to have a good grasp on what he needs to accomplish to get to the rank where he wants to be when his enlistment is up, which tells me he has a game plan. He's also the go to guy for his friends on base when they want to do work on their cars he's reliable LOL. It's also nice to know he's using the tools I bought him before he enlisted (whenever I ask him what he did over the weekend, generally helping someone on their car).

His ONLY kryptonite is his choice in "girlfriends" IMO, but I won't go there... LOL

Most of the US Military Branches recruit on the desired MOS. Then once they get you and subject you to a battery of test they place you in the MOS where they think you would be better satisfied and qualified.

The Military places the individual they do not let the individual place themselves. If they did all people who joined would be Air Craft Pilots.

 

[ultrarunner]

Several in the medical field were recruited solely for medical and another friend who specialty was programming was also recruited for that…

One day you are a nurse in private life and the next day you are an officer nurse in the military.

The recruiters were calling the house when I was in High School… dad put a stop to that and all the men in my family served and dad said the Navy was good for him but Vietnam reshaped their thinking… different times.

 

[Gator6x4]

Several in the medical field were recruited solely for medical and another friend who specialty was programming was also recruited for that…

One day you are a nurse in private life and the next day you are an officer nurse in the military.

The recruiters were calling the house when I was in High School… dad put a stop to that and all the men in my family served and dad said the Navy was good for him but Vietnam reshaped their thinking… different times.

One day you are a nurse in private life and the next day you are an officer nurse in the military.

The pathway to wearing a 2nd Lieutenants bar in the Nursing Corp is more involved than that.

Army nurses do not attend traditional basic training like enlisted soldiers; instead, they attend a Basic Officer Leadership Course (BOLC), 9 week course which is typically held at Fort Sam Houston, Texas, where they learn the fundamentals of military life as commissioned officers.

Key points about Army nurses and training:

• No bootcamp: Military nurses do not go through basic training ("boot camp").
  
  
• BOLC: They attend a Basic Officer Leadership Course to learn military basics.
  
  
• Location: This course is usually held at Fort Sam Houston, Texas.
  
  
• Requirements: To become an Army nurse, you must have a Bachelor's degree in nursing and pass the NCLEX exam.

 

[ultrarunner]

I will have to ask for update…

One of our doctors at age 50 accepted a commission with the VA.

He really made it sound just like that… although he did have prior military service nearly 30 years prior… and did go through basic training… he did not become a doctor and go to medical school until after he separated from service.

I posted before about the Doctor that was our Chief of Staff.

He was in medical school with no intention of serving… quite adamant about it until the military came for him after he ignored them.

Doc said no one had explained his options so clearly as when 2 soldiers were at his dorm room.

His options were arrested as a draft dodger while his conscience objection plea went through the system or finish his medical degree and report for duty… he opted for the later and upon graduation reported and was on a transport to military hospital in Germany…

He said military life as a Doctor serving in Germany was nothing like he imagined and was content patching up soldiers for the remainder of his service and made lifelong friends…

 

[Sigarms]

Most of the US Military Branches recruit on the desired MOS. Then once they get you and subject you to a battery of test they place you in the MOS where they think you would be better satisfied and qualified.

The Military places the individual they do not let the individual place themselves. If they did all people who joined would be Air Craft Pilots.

Yes, you do test, and from there they generally give you your options.

What you described didn't even happen to myself in the 1980's.

Pretty much everyone in my sons flight knew where they were going to for tech school because they knew what they wanted to do before they enlisted and that's what they enlisted for.

 

[Sigarms]

I will have to ask for update…

One of our doctors at age 50 accepted a commission with the VA.

He really made it sound just like that… although he did have prior military service nearly 30 years prior… and did go through basic training… he did not become a doctor and go to medical school until after he separated from service.

I posted before about the Doctor that was our Chief of Staff.

He was in medical school with no intention of serving… quite adamant about it until the military came for him after he ignored them.

Doc said no one had explained his options so clearly as when 2 soldiers were at his dorm room.

His options were arrested as a draft dodger while his conscience objection plea went through the system or finish his medical degree and report for duty… he opted for the later and upon graduation reported and was on a transport to military hospital in Germany…

He said military life as a Doctor serving in Germany was nothing like he imagined and was content patching up soldiers for the remainder of his service and made lifelong friends…

I don't know what the medical profession is like in the military now, but I know from first hand experience that pretty much all of the branches have great medical doctors 30 years ago.

That said, I don't have the air force figured out. Son doesn't have any heat in his dorm room and apparently the mess hall on base has been shut down for a couple of years now and no clue when it will re open.

Apparently housing for enlisted men is becoming an issue as well.

I laughed pretty hard when he told me he has the "hurry up and wait" figured out now.

 

[ultrarunner]

Can’t say I know anyone with air force background… lots of Navy and Marines and Army and a few Coast Guard.

The SF Bay Area has a long and proud Navy history… and the military employed a lot of people here for a long time prior to base closures.

Lots of the kids I grew up with had parent(s) serving at the Oak Knoll navy hospital and some were born there.

Injuries aside just about all have plenty of positives to say looking back at their service… discipline, teamwork, education benefits and VA home loans earned through service.

I was part of a discussion not long ago about how young people can’t afford homes like their parents… almost to a last one the parents used their military service VA loan benefit… many used the education benefit too.

My pilot friend became a commercial pilot using his education benefit and 2 of our nurses from very modest beginnings growing up in Section 8 housing were able to afford nursing school through service…

It’s too easy to forget the sacrifices parents and grandparents made to achieve success…

 

[Gator6x4]

I don't know what the medical profession is like in the military now, but I know from first hand experience that pretty much all of the branches have great medical doctors 30 years ago.

That said, I don't have the air force figured out. Son doesn't have any heat in his dorm room and apparently the mess hall on base has been shut down for a couple of years now and no clue when it will re open.

Apparently housing for enlisted men is becoming an issue as well.

I laughed pretty hard when he told me he has the "hurry up and wait" figured out now.

The Mess Hall at Shaw Air Force Base is closed and will be closed until 2026.

The BAS for enlisted men is,

Enlisted Members​

• $465.77/month .

A friends son was stationed at Ramstein Air Base when they closed the Mess Hall for renovations. He said his son and others has to attend financial counseling when the Mess Hall was reopened and BAS was discontinued for those living on the base.

Something about learning to live on the salary amount after the BAS was discontinued.

 

[garry1p]

1957 I went into the USAF when graduating from basic training four from our class went to washing DC to stand guard at the Tomb of the Unknown Solder the rest were split 1/2 to Air Police and I along with the other half to Fire Departments spread through out the US.
Returning from Vietnam I was allowed to retake all the entry test, the AF was looking for computer techs I ended up reenlisting to take advantage of the training.

Base pay in 1957 was $83.20 per month.

 

[Gator6x4]

I will have to ask for update…

One of our doctors at age 50 accepted a commission with the VA.

He really made it sound just like that… although he did have prior military service nearly 30 years prior… and did go through basic training… he did not become a doctor and go to medical school until after he separated from service.

I posted before about the Doctor that was our Chief of Staff.

He was in medical school with no intention of serving… quite adamant about it until the military came for him after he ignored them.

Doc said no one had explained his options so clearly as when 2 soldiers were at his dorm room.

His options were arrested as a draft dodger while his conscience objection plea went through the system or finish his medical degree and report for duty… he opted for the later and upon graduation reported and was on a transport to military hospital in Germany…

He said military life as a Doctor serving in Germany was nothing like he imagined and was content patching up soldiers for the remainder of his service and made lifelong friends…

“The VA is a civilian system, so all of its doctors are civilians. In addition, some of their hospitals are affiliated with medical schools. sp some of the school physicians work with the VA. The military has its own medical system and is not connected to the VA.”

 

[ultrarunner]

S. Clarence Obituary - CA

August 19, 1926 – April 24, 2008 Clarence Avery passed away suddenly on Thursday, April 24th. He was a prominent local general surgeon practicing in the East Bay and had a distinguished caree…

www.eastbaytimes.com

When I asked Dr Avery about his decision he said he was recruited to serve again and unlike the first time he was now an officer.

Unfortunately, I can no longer call him for details but it was big news here.

If you say there are no military doctors at VA hospitals how can I prove otherwise?

I grew up with many prominent African Americans and Dr Avery is one that was highly respected in all fields.

 

[Sigarms]

The Mess Hall at Shaw Air Force Base is closed and will be closed until 2026.

The BAS for enlisted men is,

Enlisted Members​

• $465.77/month .

A friends son was stationed at Ramstein Air Base when they closed the Mess Hall for renovations. He said his son and others has to attend financial counseling when the Mess Hall was reopened and BAS was discontinued for those living on the base.

Something about learning to live on the salary amount after the BAS was discontinued.

It's no longer called a mess hall LOL It's the DFAC (I had to ask my son LOL).

The dollar amount you listed is also higher for compensation when the mess hall isn't open, at least in my son's case. That said, I guess you got your information here?

Basic Allowance for Subsistence

I'll have to ask him about it.

 

[Sigarms]

I did have to ask my son why he was the one that got picked to train this high ranking official.

He looks at me and says "I don't know, I'm just the one who trained my commanding officer, so they picked me".

At least the kid apparently has half way decent communication skills.

 

[JeepHead]

That I understand. My wife and her sister are NOTHING alike, and I consider myself blessed that I got my wife

That said, having a son die due to a drug overdose (something laced with fentanyl) kind of sticks with you about what you should have done differently as a parent.

I mentioned it in another thread, but one reason why my son in the AF got a pretty big tattoo (which surprised the living heck out of me because he never seemed interested in tattoo's) was because of a pact he made with his brother when they were growing up. I never had a clue about this pact they made with each other.

Helping out last year at the local high school for church work in the county, came across my son's old high school principal and he (principal) was asking about him. I told the principal about the tattoo, and he said he remembered him talking about it and why he wanted it when he was still in high school. I had no clue...

I was impressed with the tattoo shop in Lackland. Can't get one when you're drunk and they ask you why you want it. After my son told him why he wanted the tattoo, he had to go back two times for them to finish it, and they did it for free for him. Had to laugh, son said it hurt like a bugger...I got to admit, it is pretty well done.

Sorry to hear about your son's passing. That would be a very difficult thing to live with, but that wasn't your fault. It sounds like you had a lot of love for your boys and gave them everything you could give, including a good life. I have watched many of my friends and their siblings go in totally different life directions even though they were raised the same way. My boss, who has also been a close friend of mine for 30 years, has raised 4 kids. He's an outstanding father who has always been present in his kids life helping trying hard for them to succeed in life. 3 of the 4 have went on to advanced degrees and great jobs while the 4th has lived her entire adult life in/out of rehabs.

The military can be a strange place as they pretty much own you. When I was in boot camp, one of the guys in my division had been in the Army, then after the Army he went to the Marine core and was a Marine recon special forces. After the Core, he went to college and earned his degree. He then joined the Navy with intentions of becoming an officer. Right after signing with the Navy, he apparently changed his mind and decided he wanted to pursue something different and requested to break the contract with the Navy. The Navy wasn't very happy about that and made him honor his commitment and off to boot camp he went anyways. About halfway through boot camp when we all learned exactly which school we would get, he discovered the Navy decided to bust him down to a cook instead of allowing him to go onto OCS. It was absolutely CRAZY! This guy was the elite of the elite, on graduation day when we all stood there, he had more medals on his uniform than even our chiefs had. I later found out that at the last minute the Navy allowed him to move into a deep sea diver position instead of a cook. I was happy for him.

Oh, and being a guy who is pretty heavily tatted up, I can tell you that no legitimate tattoo parlor will ever tat someone who has been drinking. It thins your blood and causes you to bleed too much for the ink to take very well.

 

[Yander]

Sigarms, I have one son who also enlisted in AF, and I went to his graduation at Lackland. That base is a pain in the ass to navigate. I'm very proud of him.

I also have one son who got in a fight with his wife one night and told her he was suicidal, and she said The only thing you are going to die of is alcohol poisoning. That was the wrong thing to say to my son, who was drunk and very strong-willed. He took the beer stein in his hand and smashed it on the kitchen counter and used the handle to slit his wrist with it. It cut nerves in his wrist, and he was bleeding bad. He had his wife run him to the ER to get sewn back up.

He said immediately after he did it, he realized he didn't want to die and knew it was a big mistake. I am just as proud of that son as I am of my son in the AF. He was ok.

My point being, had he died from his choice to slit his wrist, I wouldn't have blamed myself for that—his choice. I wasn't a great parent; I know this, and I've spoken to both my sons about it. But at some point, choices are what direct our path, not our parents.

 

[Sigarms]

Every death of a child is different, but so similar in a way in the pain a parent feels no matter what the cause.

At first, you don't think anyone can know the pain. Then you come to understand that no matter what the circumstances are, sometimes I can't believe what other parents must go through and have it far worse than what we went through.

Luckily our marriage held up as the grief can take it's toll on a marriage due to the way people people grieve differently.

End of the day, I don't honestly blame myself for his death (we had rules in our home which he couldn't live by, and even child protective services told him the same thing after he made a child abuse claim, and they did a 4 hour home visit), but what hurts most is I told him numerous times that if he didn't start making smarter choices and trying to find better friends, he would end up killing himself.

Thing is our son used to play "good parent bad parent", and I was the bad parent at the time of his passing.

No one is promised tomorrow, no matter what your age.

Perhaps another reason why I'm proud of my other boy is the fact I know what he overcame per his past, and it seems like he's doing well... Both boys had a IEP in school when they came to live with us (which they were taken off of after 3 years in elementary school) and the Air Force was a huge pain in the butt per wanting his COMPLETE life's medical records, but he stuck it throughout the complete process because he knew what he wanted.

How much do I owe for the therapy session?

 

[Sigarms]

on graduation day when we all stood there, he had more medals on his uniform than even our chiefs had. I later found out that at the last minute the Navy allowed him to move into a deep sea diver position instead of a cook. I was happy for him.

I really wish my son would have explained to us that he was on an "open contract" basically allowing the military to put him in any job they wanted, but I do think he was mislead by his original recruiter and he didn't even realize it himself at the time (but figured it out after he was at his first duty station because he mentioned it himself).

I remember when I enlisted, and my dad told me do NOT trust a recruiter. Then again, I didn't listen to my dad either. Go figure...

First recruiter left before my son left for basic, he got another recruiter. That second recruiter screwed up his RAP time (Recruiter Assistance Program where my son worked with the recruiter after tech school) and couldn't get it corrected. Second recruiter didn't last long and was replaced by a 3rd recruiter. What took the second recruiter months not being able to fix the 3rd recruiter took my sons first text and had it corrected in less than a week.

The whole reason for this post is I remember summer of 2023 out in a hotel in Monterey California (family vacation before our son left for basic) when my son got his "job list" from the second recruiter. What we thought was it was 10 jobs that he could chose from per his ranking, but what it really was (I think) was 10 jobs that they could assign him to depending at the time of his graduation from Basic.

The one job he didn't want? Being a cook and he was so relieved that wasn't on the list.

BUT like I told him, even if he were working in the mess hall, take pride in your work, give 110% and work well with others, and he would be fine.

The military sure has changed over the last 50 years (in the air force, they now have bathroom stalls in the latrine for basic, as well as a phone to report ****** harassment, go figure), but I'm hoping what hasn't changed is you put in your first stint, do well where the military sees you as an asset vs a liability) and then the doors may open up if you want to leave and not re up because they (the military) wants to keep you. Long term planning vs short term planning IMO.

I remember when we were at his graduation at Lackland and him telling me his grandfather would be disappointed in the things they do differently now. I know I fell over dead when he told me they had stalls in the latrine for basic and a phone to report ****** harassment. Heck the military training instructors at Lackland are not even allowed to curse at the recruits.