Want to buy a dump trailer, kinda torn here.

[CADplans]

I bought my 10' dump trailer when i bought my '99 Silverado 2500.
The trailer is rated 10K gross weight.

I had to buy new receiver hitch tubes when I bought my '18 Silverado 2500,,
the new truck uses 2 1/2" tube, instead of 2" ,, it is quite a bit more heavy duty,,

Both trucks are 6.0, both have 4.10 axles. both are snow plow upgraded trucks.
(I have never had a snow plow,, that is just the way the trucks came)

I would not even bat an eye at hauling a 7 ton load in my dump trailer with either truck.
I have had the trailer heaped up loaded with creek rock, so , I would guess that was 7 tons.

 

[Hay Dude]

A class B with air brakes, but for personal use I didn’t think it mattered.

I havent seen outside of a large RV, where someone can do something requiring a class A getting an exemption for personal use.
Don’t think it’s a matter of personal use, but a matter of training/safety

 

[Bearsixty7]

Here in Texas You can derate a trailer at the DMV if you want, it doesn't matter what the manufacturer rates it at.
I have a 20' cargo/box trailer I had made with 5K axles and 16" wheels & tires as I hate 3500lb axles and 15" tires for trailers.
The Manufacturer rated the trailer at 10,400 and if the GVWR is over 10K the annual registration almost doubles.
I will never be over 9K total so I just had them register it for 9990 and save about $80 annually.

This way I have a trailer strong enough for anything I'll haul in it yet it doesn't cost any more to register.

 

[Jackstack76]

I bought my 10' dump trailer when i bought my '99 Silverado 2500.
The trailer is rated 10K gross weight.

I had to buy new receiver hitch tubes when I bought my '18 Silverado 2500,,
the new truck uses 2 1/2" tube, instead of 2" ,, it is quite a bit more heavy duty,,

Both trucks are 6.0, both have 4.10 axles. both are snow plow upgraded trucks.
(I have never had a snow plow,, that is just the way the trucks came)

I would not even bat an eye at hauling a 7 ton load in my dump trailer with either truck.
I have had the trailer heaped up loaded with creek rock, so , I would guess that was 7 tons.

Nice! My 2017 came with the 2-1/2 inch reciver but there’s a sleeve in it for 2 inch, just hkw it came.

 

[Jackstack76]

I havent seen outside of a large RV, where someone can do something requiring a class A getting an exemption for personal use.
Don’t think it’s a matter of personal use, but a matter of training/safety

I see a lot of people towing these massive fifth wheels, you know most of them don’t have a CDL

 

[Hay Dude]

I see a lot of people towing these massive fifth wheels, you know most of them don’t have a CDL

Right, I said “outside of a large RV”.

 

[bdog]

Depending on your state you may not need a CDL but in most states you need a class A license (commercial or non commercial depending on circumstances) to drive a vehicle with a combined GVWR over 26k with a trailer over 10k GVWR. Some states don’t offer non commercial licenses so if you are over the threshold you have to get a CDL.

Either way in the vast majority of states if not all you can’t just drive a combo over 26k without some sort of upgraded license. In the eyes of the law once you cross 26k you are treated exactly the same as an 18 wheeler. Now there some exemptions such as military vehicles, RVs, firefighters, and farm use but the farm use definition is pretty strict and refers to only hauling livestock and commodities from your farm to market. Each state is a little different but definitely look into the refs before buying something over 26k.

Also with the DOT it is guilty until proven innocent. If you are trying to use some sort of non commercial exemption from having a DOT number, etc they will try every way possible to wrap you up in their commercial net. I have heard of team ropers deemed commercial hauling their horses to rodeos because they can win money at the rodeo.

 

[Jackstack76]

Here in Texas You can derate a trailer at the DMV if you want, it doesn't matter what the manufacturer rates it at.
I have a 20' cargo/box trailer I had made with 5K axles and 16" wheels & tires as I hate 3500lb axles and 15" tires for trailers.
The Manufacturer rated the trailer at 10,400 and if the GVWR is over 10K the annual registration almost doubles.
I will never be over 9K total so I just had them register it for 9990 and save about $80 annually.

This way I have a trailer strong enough for anything I'll haul in it yet it doesn't coat any more to register.

I did the same thing with my 20 foot electric tilt, two 5200 pound axels but de rated it a hair.

 

[Jackstack76]

Depending on your state you may not need a CDL but in most states you need a class A license (commercial or non commercial depending on circumstances) to drive a vehicle with a combined GVWR over 26k with a trailer over 10k GVWR. Some states don’t offer non commercial licenses so if you are over the threshold you have to get a CDL.

Either way in the vast majority of states if not all you can’t just drive a combo over 26k without some sort of upgraded license. In the eyes of the law once you cross 26k you are treated exactly the same as an 18 wheeler. Now there some exemptions such as military vehicles, RVs, firefighters, and farm use but the farm use definition is pretty strict and refers to only hauling livestock and commodities from your farm to market. Each state is a little different but definitely look into the refs before buying something over 26k.

Also with the DOT it is guilty until proven innocent. If you are trying to use some sort of non commercial exemption from having a DOT number, etc they will try every way possible to wrap you up in their commercial net. I have heard of team ropers deemed commercial hauling their horses to rodeos because they can win money at the rodeo.

Well if I have to upgrade down the road so be it, already have a class b and airbrakes for work.

 

[Hay Dude]

Well if I have to upgrade down the road so be it, already have a class b and airbrakes for work.

But you’ll need a class A
Class B with air brakes is for straight truck with air brakes

 

[4570Man]

Pretty much any trailer that needed a CDL to begin with needs a class A. A class B only covers straight trucks with a 9999 pound or less trailer.

 

[nikerret]

In regard to required DL’s, most States follow the CDL class requirements for non-CDL classes. A whole bunch of fifth wheel RV’ers are supposed to have Class A (non-commercial) DL’s, but almost none do.

Here is a good guide, though, I can only attest to it being accurate in one State:

AAA Exchange – Advocacy. Communication. Education.

drivinglaws.aaa.com

 

[bdog]

Here in Texas You can derate a trailer at the DMV if you want, it doesn't matter what the manufacturer rates it at.
I have a 20' cargo/box trailer I had made with 5K axles and 16" wheels & tires as I hate 3500lb axles and 15" tires for trailers.
The Manufacturer rated the trailer at 10,400 and if the GVWR is over 10K the annual registration almost doubles.
I will never be over 9K total so I just had them register it for 9990 and save about $80 annually.

This way I have a trailer strong enough for anything I'll haul in it yet it doesn't coat any more to register.

Derating it at registration time can definitely save you money on the registration fees but it has absolutely no bearing on what class of license you need which is determined by the manufacturers GVWR.

 

[Jackstack76]

But you’ll need a class A
Class B with air brakes is for straight truck with air brakes

Im aware of that

 

[Rock Crawler]

Your math is a bit off. If you have a 14k GVWR trailer that weighs 4,500 lbs, that leaves 9,500 lbs legal payload. Quite a bit less than the 13,000 you listed.

The GVWR is the most that vehicle is rated to weigh, at any time. Even alone, unhooked. A lot of companies account for tongue weight by building the trailer to handle more than just the axle capacities added together, but not all do.

For example, my 16’ Diamond C has two 7k axles, but has a GVWR of 14,900 lbs. The sticker on the side lists my trailer weight at 4,500 lbs. I’m not sure how they got that number, because it actually weighs around 5,160 lbs, empty, as it left the dealership. Sone if that increase is likely from the HD ramps I optioned. It weighs even more, now, since I also carry chains and boomers.

In hindsight, I should have got the 8k axles. I didn’t for a few reasons, but the main one was I didn’t want a gooseneck and the highest rated ball mount and ball I could find was rated for 16k. Going to the 8k axles moves the GVWR to 18k, on these trailers.

The reason I didn’t want a gooseneck was because of the types of jobs I was doing, at that time. I wanted to keep my flatbed clear, to carry attachments, bricks or other supplies, etc. Since then, my business has adapted and changed some. I’ve only used the bed two times in ways that would have interfered with the gooseneck. It would have been better to get the gooseneck and the 10k super singles, but those weren’t an option, at that time. There are other drawbacks to the super singles, but that’s another discussion. Another factor was a goosenecks tend to cut more of the corner, in forward turns, where bumper pull tends to track closer to the towing vehicle wheels. This was important, because most of my customers are residential single family homes. Of course, nothing is free. I‘ve paid Hell trying to get my bumper pull into a few places where a gooseneck would have been much easier.

If I was buying one, now, I would get the biggest I could, axle-wise, on a low-profile. It would be a gooseneck with a deck on the neck. But, that’s not what I have, so it’s not what I use.

That's a really long winded way to say that you have no clue what you speak of.

Day you buy a 14K gross 5th wheel... I have one.
It has 2 x 6K axles on it.... as do most all camper trailers.
Why? Because the pin weight is on the truck axle, so that trailer gross is 14K because once you set it in the truck the trailer transfers almost 3,000 of those 14K lbs to the truck.

The same concept with your dump. It's a 14K gross, weight bar is say 4K, 3K transfers to truck leaving you 13K to load on the trailer.

Argue back. Have fun. Be wrong. It's cool. You do you.

 

[nikerret]

Here in Texas You can derate a trailer at the DMV if you want, it doesn't matter what the manufacturer rates it at.
I have a 20' cargo/box trailer I had made with 5K axles and 16" wheels & tires as I hate 3500lb axles and 15" tires for trailers.
The Manufacturer rated the trailer at 10,400 and if the GVWR is over 10K the annual registration almost doubles.
I will never be over 9K total so I just had them register it for 9990 and save about $80 annually.

This way I have a trailer strong enough for anything I'll haul in it yet it doesn't coat any more to register.

Personal trailers, ie non-commercial trailers, are registered by weight. As long as the trailer alone is under the registered weight you’re fine. A non-commercial tie vehicle is registered under the weight it, alone, will stay under. Commercial trailers are not done the same. Commercial vehicles are done by the registered weight on the power unit. The power unit declared weight must be higher than the actual weight of the truck and any and all trailers.

 

[Hay Dude]

Im aware of that

Ok..... I thought you were thinking Class B had you covered.
Sounds like you know what you’re doing! Good luck!
Let us know what you end up with!

 

[bdog]

I will stand by my previous comments though. If you NEED to exceed 26k go for it. I sure wouldn’t just for a few k lbs and a possible need. One way or another most likely it will require extra crap on your part. Maybe one day you need your wife to drive your truck and trailer or whatever.
I have a class A CDL. A couple months ago I hauled my skid steer and several implements to the ranch on my semi. My wife was following in my 3/4 ton and dump trailer with materials. Had my dump trailer been a higher GVWR she would not have been able to legally drive it. I also have employees and none of them have a CDL and the haul my dump trailer all the time.

Another example is a couple weeks ago I made a trip to go get some wheel weights and a grain drill with my 3-4 ton and dump trailer. I went and came back in a day. If this rig would have been over 26k I would have had to been logging hours and I would have gone over.

Once you are over 26k many states deem you Commerical which means no alcohol in the vehicle. I’m not talking about drinking and driving it can’t be in there period. When I go to the ranch I take some beers with me for when I am there. Can get tricky if your vehicle is deemed commercial.

 

[Jackstack76]

Ok..... I thought you were thinking Class B had you covered.
Sounds like you know what you’re doing! Good luck!
Let us know what you end up with!

Thanks, I’ve been debating about getting my class A anyways. Still a tough choice, still leaning towards a 14 foot gooseneck, possibly upgrade to the 16K trim.

 

[nikerret]

That's a really long winded way to say that you have no clue what you speak of.

Day you buy a 14K gross 5th wheel... I have one.
It has 2 x 6K axles on it.... as do most all camper trailers.
Why? Because the pin weight is on the truck axle, so that trailer gross is 14K because once you set it in the truck the trailer transfers almost 3,000 of those 14K lbs to the truck.

The same concept with your dump. It's a 14K gross, weight bar is say 4K, 3K transfers to truck leaving you 13K to load on the trailer.

Argue back. Have fun. Be wrong. It's cool. You do you.

Well, if I am wrong, so is:

Curt Mfg:

How to Measure Towing Capacity, GVWR, GCWR - Towing 101

Towing capacity is the maximum amount of weight your vehicle can tow when pulling a trailer. It is determined by the vehicle manufacturer and takes into account the GVWR, GAWR, GTW and more. What does towing capacity mean? Very simply, it is how heavy your trailer can be.

www.curtmfg.com

This trailer dealer:

North Carolina Trailer Sales | Thomasville & Winston-Salem, NC

We are your premier trailer dealership offering you the best selection of sales, parts, service, & more! Visit our trailer dealership in Thomasville & Winston-Salem, NC.

nctrailers.com

Load Trail:

Home - Load Trail LLC

Building trailers for the long haul since 1996, Load Trail manufactures a wide variety of flat deck and open deck gooseneck trailers, dumps trailers, carhaulers, tilt deck trailers, landscape trailers and more.Based in Sumner, TX, Load Trail supplies trailer dealers with a wide variety of models...

loadtrail.com

Diamond C:

GVWR vs Payload - Diamond C Trailers

What's the deal with GVWR vs Payload vs Towing Capacity? We'll break it all down for you here.

www.diamondc.com

Jayco:

Understanding RV Weights and Their Meanings | Jayco Journal | Jayco, Inc

What is GVWR, UVW, GCCC? Here's your guide to RV weights so you can confidently purchase the RV that is right for you.

www.jayco.com

NATM:

Explaining Gross Vehicle Weight Ratings to Customers

Dealers should educate their customers on the importance of understanding a trailer’s gross vehicle weight rating (GVWR) and tow vehicle towing capacity. All too often, customers are not familiar...

www.natm.com

This trailer dealer:

Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ's) | Best Choice Trailers & RVs | Locations in Pittsburgh & Harrisburg Area

Example C:  (TRAILER DE-RATE DUE TO CDL, OVER 10000# TRAILER, NEWER 1 TON DUAL WHEEL TRUCK).  Assuming a customer is looking to maximize payload while staying within a 26000# GCWR, a good choice might be to "de-rate" the trailer.  Basically, let's assume your 2007 Dodge 1-ton crew-cab dually...

www.bestchoicetrailers.com

The State of Virginia:

https://select.dmv.virginia.gov/select/help/vlic/vlic4520.pdf