About this pedal thang

[Steppenwolfe]

How about some details as to why for the OP to ponder.

I hated it... that good enough? I didn't like I had to run it at full throttle for the most part, I didn't like having to lift my leg to find the back peddle, I didn't like I had to release the forward pedal to gain power, and because it was the Kubota two pedal setup, my legs never got comfortable. At 6'3" it killed my leg if I was going back and forth grading and such. I really liked the size of the tractor and the quickness and power of the fel, but I really made a mistake going with the hst. I'm looking to replace it with a larger B with gear drive and maybe a cab this time.

 

[Steppenwolfe]

As others have mentioned- brakes are almost never used (on the hst models you are considering) other than to hold it when parked.
I have a 120' elevation drop on 335 acres and seldom touch the brakes on my 3301 hst.
If you have any plans to use a loader, it's a no brainer.
I've had several geared and hst machines. About the only place I prefer gears is with ground engaging attachments.
3301 is the sweet spot for me. 3901 won't do much the 3301 can't. 6ft goods are too big for both imo.

I agree on the capabilities of the 3301, it is a great little tractor for 5 ft implements. I have the geared which I love.

 

[Corkpuller]

Appreciate all the input fellers.
Will be headed to the Kubota shop Friday to see how this pedal gizmo thang operates.

 

[timswi]

I've had a BX23 for 14 years...The treadle is very easy to get used to and I love it for loader work. Had an 8N prior to the BX. I'll stick with the HST. I don't do any crop work though, so that might influence your opinion. As others stated. the brake pedal is almost unnecessary due to the braking ability of the HST.

 

[MossRoad]

I hated it... that good enough? .....

Nope. But the rest of your post was worth something. :laughing:

 

[Newby first timer]

I've had a BX23 for 14 years...The treadle is very easy to get used to and I love it for loader work. Had an 8N prior to the BX. I'll stick with the HST. I don't do any crop work though, so that might influence your opinion. As others stated. the brake pedal is almost unnecessary due to the braking ability of the HST.

The only time I have used my brake was when I am headed down hill and want to stop or have a precision stop for safety.

As stated the cruse control on my MX is just a lever that will hold the petal down at a specific speed setting and ya have to pull it back manually to stop the tractor the brake has nothing to do with it at all. If ya fell of the tractor it would go until it hit something or ran out of gas.
I use it when I am on a long haul with my loader and it works great. I suppose I could unlock the double brake peddle and do a bit of brake steering but the tractor turns so sharp I have never had to try it yet.

 

[k0ua]

My thoughts. I have owned several Gear and Several hydro tractors. I will never own another gear tractor. Hydro has many advantages. Especially in a compact tractor. As a field tractor pulling a plow,. um not so much. Gear is more efficient. And when you put several hundred hours pulling a plow or something on a larger field tractor, those hours add up to fuel savings with gear. Besided hydro adds nothing to that equation.

Now back to what we all use compact tractors for. Loader work, mowing, grapple work, working with forks, the hydro is superior in all of those task. Much more precise control. Much less operator fatigue. Slightly less fuel efficiency, slightly more heat generated (and compensated for by and extra radiator up front in larger models or a fan in small models). The hydro cannot be beaten by any other system for more directional changes per hour with less fatigue. The hydraulic shuttle comes close. But these system are more complicated than hydro, and usually in larger tractors, with some exceptions.

Hydro is much easier for a person to learn on, as totally unskilled personnel (think spouses and minors) can jump on the machine and starting doing useful work in seconds. AND doing that work in a MUCH safer manner than a gear/clutch tractor. No foot to accidently slip off of clutch and run someone working in front of the tractor over.

As for treadle pedal vs twin pedal. That is a matter of personal preference and acclimatization. I have owned two treadle pedals and one twin pedal which is my current Kioti. The twin pedal is easier for people to understand and be comfortable with right away. The treadle pedal is slightly faster as one poster noted when dipping your front wheels into a pond or ditch. BUT you must learn how to operate the treadle pedal effeciently. There are times (most) to NOT put your foot on the top of the pedal, and there are times to do so.

The twin pedal setup on the small Kubotas, that Steppenwolfe hates DO suck and suck bigtime. They are not spaced side by side, but more front to back. But I suppose you could get used to them. Apparently he could not. But he is know for being rigid and set in his ways.

Bottom line, you pays your money and you takes your choice. Also bottom line, the hydro's cost more to buy, and sell for more when used. NO ONE (practically) wants to buy your used gear tractor. Very few people do anyway. Women and men now that have never driven a gear anything don't want them and will avoid them like a snake. It might be useful to keep thieves from stealing them though I understand that most thieves now will not steal standard transmission cars, because only a percentage of them know how to drive them.

So if gear makes you happy, by all means get that. I am just expressing my opinion (I have a lot of them ) Get the hydro and don't look back. You will be glad you did.

 

[k0ua]

Now on to the turning brake thing. My opinion on the subject differ from many of the hydro lovers that have expressed that they never used them.
I use them a fair amount. I own a Kioti. They thoughtfully put the twin hydro pedals on the right and the two brake pedals on the left side. It makes for happy operation.

What do I use them for you ask? Many things. I often use them instead of the differential lock to slow down a spinning wheel and apply torque to the non moving one. I use them when crossing an icy sloped driveway to maintain my line of travel when pushing snow/ice. You cannot do that with front steering wheels alone, you must crab the tractor sideways to go in a line. You do that by applying uphill braking and with chains on the rear tires the tractor will crab uphill and gravity will continue to pull it downhill, but the result will be a more or less an integrated straight line.

I use them when working dirt up against a footing. It is more precise than moving by steering with wheels alone. I use them to decrease the turning radius of the tractor when in the woods.

Does the tractor turn sharp by its wheels? Sure, but it will turn sharper with application of steering brake. Even in 4wd. Can you "seesaw" the tractor with the hydro very fast? You sure can, and I often do that. Without having to stomp a clutch and swap gears from forward to reverse, it is much faster to work around an obstacle. But that doesn't preclude you from using steering brakes as an aid also.

So overall, I like and use steering brakes. Not totally necessary, but darn handy. My last kubota, the L3400 had them but they sucked. They were on the same side as the treadle pedal. To use them you either had to become a ballet dancer and put on a tutu, and try to cross you feet over and hit them (I aint that coordinated) OR you could use the "cruise control" lever with left hand and use the right foot to stomp the appropriate brake. HOWEVER, I usually prefer to keep the steering wheel in my left hand and the FEL joystick in my right hand. After all, I am actually doing something or I would not be there to need the brake steer.

Nope the L3400 sucked a bit on several counts. I understand many newer Kubotas have brakes on the left now and the pedal on the right. Some John Deer'es have a single brake pedal on the right up high above the twin pedals, and dual steering brakes on the Left!. Cover all your bases I guess!.

Reckon I have pontificated enough about the virtues of brake steering.

 

[Corkpuller]

Reckon I have pontificated enough about the virtues of brake steering.

I ain't smart enough to know what pontificated means, but I appreciated the ability of brake steering on a tractor and with your pontificating, maybe those that say it's not needed or those that knew nothing about it, will have learned some. Thanks.

pontificated ?? I'd a prolly said preached..... or dogmatized, semonized, moralized, or lectured...

 

[Deere Dude]

I have twin brakes on my JD3750 and only used them a couple times in the 8 years I had the tractot. That was mostly just playing around, but I could see value for me getting stuck against a tree where I needed some awkward movements.

I grew up on an old Allis and a Ford 8N pre-hyrdo days. I liked the ford, the Allis not so much. One concern I have but maybe unwarranted, is the dead man control of gear shifts. What I mean is that if you get into as bind such as the front raising up with a hydro tractor you just back off all the controls and all motion stops until you get your bearings. With a gear shift you need to do a positive action by pushing in the clutch and then the brake to get stopped. Panic stops need to be very naturally set in your muscle memory.

Unless gear shifts changed in the last 50 years, that is my view. No gears for me, man.

 

[CobyRupert]

I ain't smart enough to know what pontificated means, but I appreciated the ability of brake steering on a tractor and with your pontificating, maybe those that say it's not needed or those that knew nothing about it, will have learned some. Thanks.

pontificated ?? I'd a prolly said preached..... or dogmatized, semonized, moralized, or lectured...

I think it means he wore a dress and a sharp pointy hat and offered his ring for people to kiss.

....however he actually has experience with steering brakes when giving advice about steering brakes....so....maybe not real pontificating...

 

[k0ua]

I ain't smart enough to know what pontificated means, but I appreciated the ability of brake steering on a tractor and with your pontificating, maybe those that say it's not needed or those that knew nothing about it, will have learned some. Thanks.

pontificated ?? I'd a prolly said preached..... or dogmatized, semonized, moralized, or lectured...

Maybe "rambled on?"

 

[k0ua]

I think it means he wore a dress and a sharp pointy hat and offered his ring for people to kiss.

....however he actually has experience with steering brakes when giving advice about steering brakes....so....maybe not real pontificating...

These mental images we are creating are getting worrisome. Whether the one I created of the tutu wearing ballet dancer trying to do the Kubota shuffle, or the pope decked out in his Sunday best holding a rapt audience hanging on to his every word. AND I doubt seriously the pope knows a thing about steering brakes.

 

[Steppenwolfe]

Nope. But the rest of your post was worth something. :laughing:

Glad I could oblige you...

 

[Steppenwolfe]

My thoughts. I have owned several Gear and Several hydro tractors. I will never own another gear tractor. Hydro has many advantages. Especially in a compact tractor. As a field tractor pulling a plow,. um not so much. Gear is more efficient. And when you put several hundred hours pulling a plow or something on a larger field tractor, those hours add up to fuel savings with gear. Besided hydro adds nothing to that equation.

Now back to what we all use compact tractors for. Loader work, mowing, grapple work, working with forks, the hydro is superior in all of those task. Much more precise control. Much less operator fatigue. Slightly less fuel efficiency, slightly more heat generated (and compensated for by and extra radiator up front in larger models or a fan in small models). The hydro cannot be beaten by any other system for more directional changes per hour with less fatigue. The hydraulic shuttle comes close. But these system are more complicated than hydro, and usually in larger tractors, with some exceptions.

Hydro is much easier for a person to learn on, as totally unskilled personnel (think spouses and minors) can jump on the machine and starting doing useful work in seconds. AND doing that work in a MUCH safer manner than a gear/clutch tractor. No foot to accidently slip off of clutch and run someone working in front of the tractor over.

As for treadle pedal vs twin pedal. That is a matter of personal preference and acclimatization. I have owned two treadle pedals and one twin pedal which is my current Kioti. The twin pedal is easier for people to understand and be comfortable with right away. The treadle pedal is slightly faster as one poster noted when dipping your front wheels into a pond or ditch. BUT you must learn how to operate the treadle pedal effeciently. There are times (most) to NOT put your foot on the top of the pedal, and there are times to do so.

The twin pedal setup on the small Kubotas, that Steppenwolfe hates DO suck and suck bigtime. They are not spaced side by side, but more front to back. But I suppose you could get used to them. Apparently he could not. But he is know for being rigid and set in his ways.

Bottom line, you pays your money and you takes your choice. Also bottom line, the hydro's cost more to buy, and sell for more when used. NO ONE (practically) wants to buy your used gear tractor. Very few people do anyway. Women and men now that have never driven a gear anything don't want them and will avoid them like a snake. It might be useful to keep thieves from stealing them though I understand that most thieves now will not steal standard transmission cars, because only a percentage of them know how to drive them.

So if gear makes you happy, by all means get that. I am just expressing my opinion (I have a lot of them ) Get the hydro and don't look back. You will be glad you did.

Way too much pontificating...

 

[foggy1111]

I've owned a few tractors with gears and with hydros. I will NOT go back to gears.....especially for a compact tractor. I am coming off a JD 3320 e-hydro.......which I liked allot. Now with my Kubota....it has the brakes on the left and the treadle on the right....which is similar to my old JD....but the Kubota has an extension on the treadle....which allows you to "pull up" with your toe.....for reverse. Seems I use that all the time......and find it somewhat annoying to use the heel to toe pedal.....as compared to my old Deere set-up. I seldom need the brakes.

I do get along with the Kubota "treadle" set-up.....but do prefer the twin pedals as found on the Deere. I'm getting better at it.....but still prefer the Deere twin pedals. Glad Kubota put that toe extension on the model I have....as I hate the heel / toe treadle set up. I can live with what I got now.. All things said.....I would buy a hydro again in one heartbeat. Simply a must-have with loader work and with positioning my stump grinder....grapple work.....as well as many other functions.

 

[Recoveryhill]

My flat pastures are edged by steep and deep drop-offs with aggressive trash trees and tropical vines and Guinea Grass. Running parallel to the drop is suicidal especially since the grass, first to get tall, blocks a view of where the edge lies. If left unattended, the jungle marches into the pasture. I use the hydro on an L3700 to back the bush hog at and over the edge at a 90 degree angle. The location of the rear relative to the edge is easy to see. At five feet per pass, edging the whole place takes a lot of back and forth, easy with the hydro pedal. An added benefit is that when the rear gets as far as I want it to go, no need to brake, the transmission holds it in place until I go forward again.

Bottom line: For numerous changes in direction, back and forth, a hydro is the only way to go. For pasture work there is no downside. Were I plowing large plots perhaps a geared tractor might be the best.

 

[dalola]

My flat pastures are edged by steep and deep drop-offs with aggressive trash trees and tropical vines and Guinea Grass. Running parallel to the drop is suicidal especially since the grass, first to get tall, blocks a view of where the edge lies. If left unattended, the jungle marches into the pasture. I use the hydro on an L3700 to back the bush hog at and over the edge at a 90 degree angle.

Yowza! Seems like a really high pucker factor! :shocked: Do be extra careful!

 

[CobyRupert]

My flat pastures are edged by steep and deep drop-offs with aggressive trash trees and tropical vines and Guinea Grass. Running parallel to the drop is suicidal especially since the grass, first to get tall, blocks a view of where the edge lies. If left unattended, the jungle marches into the pasture. I use the hydro on an L3700 to back the bush hog at and over the edge at a 90 degree angle. The location of the rear relative to the edge is easy to see. At five feet per pass, edging the whole place takes a lot of back and forth, easy with the hydro pedal. An added benefit is that when the rear gets as far as I want it to go, no need to brake, the transmission holds it in place until I go forward again.

Bottom line: For numerous changes in direction, back and forth, a hydro is the only way to go. For pasture work there is no downside. Were I plowing large plots perhaps a geared tractor might be the best.

True. The flip side is:

IF you did drive parallel to the edge and had a front tire start to drop over the bank, you might want a tractor where you could use your steering brakes to get away. Just saying....

I do have a similar bank like that where I can't see the edge in tall summer grass. You really have to go slow and give it the Helen Keller method. Uncharacteristically, I also don't tempt it and try squeeze every last inch. But I have gotten into lesser but similar ditches and ruts where you just can't steer out of them. Tires just scrape the edge and falls back down, only hard 1 wheeled braking changes the angle of attack enough to climb back up and out.

 

[Diggin It]

My flat pastures are edged by steep and deep drop-offs with aggressive trash trees and tropical vines and Guinea Grass. Running parallel to the drop is suicidal especially since the grass, first to get tall, blocks a view of where the edge lies.

Perhaps a sickle bar mower? Or some of mower that swings out to the side?