Towing heavy on a 1/2 ton

   / Towing heavy on a 1/2 ton #21  
It happens around here - pickup trucks are getting stopped even if the load is secured. They will also issue warnings if your load is getting close to CDL territory...and fine you if you overload.

Personally I wish theyd stop more guys that are overloaded or unsecured. I recently saw a num-nut in a half ton rust bucket on the highway with at least two tons of scissor jack in the bed. Wheels would have been rubbing the wheel wells if they hadnt already rusted away. Accident waiting to happen and some poor sucker would be the victim.
The only time that I've ever heard of them doing that around here was when the price of scrap metal was high; they set up just before the junkyard and wrote all sorts of tickets. Some of the scariest loads that I've seen are on scrap trucks, or people who don't have a pickup or trailer, but just need to get that mattress or plywood home. So they put it on the roof, tie it down with clothesline, and reach out the window to steady it when the wind starts tossing it around.
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It's almost impossible to get solid data about payload and towing capacity from their website. There is one brief comment about 13600lb towing and 3600lb payload but I haven't been able to find any real specs. OTOH I stopped into a former coworkers house just as he was getting ready to unload some stone; he had hauled 3 yards of 1"stone in a borrowed dump trailer through town with his company half ton Silverado, with no trailer brakes. :eek: He said the stone alone weighed 8100 lbs.
 
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   / Towing heavy on a 1/2 ton #22  
The WDH’s make a world of difference. Add on some airbags and it’s even better.

Lots more involved than just HP for a towing vehicle. The HP would be the least of the items.
 
   / Towing heavy on a 1/2 ton #23  
First off, I can almost guarantee your truck is not rated to tow 12000 lbs. Look in your door jamb at the yellow sticker. I have a 2017 F150 and my sticker says 1940 lbs. That is fairly high for an F150 unless you have the heavy duty payload package, which is quite rare.
Why are you saying he's wrong - he indicated he bought it for the tow capacity as being a prime factor. The Ford document he linked to http://www.diehlford.com/images/pdf/2018_RV_Trailer_Towing_Guide_F_150.pdf has "Towing capacity 13,200 pounds Payload capacity 3,270 pounds" in big bold print. Did you even read his link? Note that the only truck listed with a 9K towing capacity has a 2,470 payload capacity.

So take my 1940 lbs, that痴 how much weight you can put on the truck. That includes a full tank of gas but no driver or passengers. I have got a tool box, that痴 200 lbs, me I am 240 say. Now that 1940 is down to 1500 lbs. Take a 14000 trailer and take 10% tongue weight, that makes 1400 lbs. In theory my truck can handle that tongue weight. What if the tongue weight is 15%? What is you payload sticker? What all do you carry in your truck? The other problem is my truck is rated at 9000 lbs tow rating.
So you've a truck with less capacity, are you jealous?

He missed footnote 2 (Maximum loaded trailer weight requires weight-distributing hitch) and an entire piece on page 6 of Hitch Receiver Weight Capacity.

Heck a 2020 F150 may be in my future.

But to the OP - rethink about using a WDH, I highly recommend the Equal-i-zer.
 
   / Towing heavy on a 1/2 ton #24  
It happens around here - pickup trucks are getting stopped even if the load is secured. They will also issue warnings if your load is getting close to CDL territory...and fine you if you overload.

Personally I wish theyd stop more guys that are overloaded or unsecured. I recently saw a num-nut in a half ton rust bucket on the highway with at least two tons of scissor jack in the bed. Wheels would have been rubbing the wheel wells if they hadnt already rusted away. Accident waiting to happen and some poor sucker would be the victim.

How can that rust situation happen..... in CANADA?
I thought there was an annual (or bi-annual) provincial inspection required for every vehicle?
 
   / Towing heavy on a 1/2 ton #25  
Why are you saying he's wrong - he indicated he bought it for the tow capacity as being a prime factor. The Ford document he linked to http://www.diehlford.com/images/pdf/2018_RV_Trailer_Towing_Guide_F_150.pdf has "Towing capacity 13,200 pounds Payload capacity 3,270 pounds" in big bold print. Did you even read his link? Note that the only truck listed with a 9K towing capacity has a 2,470 payload capacity.

So you've a truck with less capacity, are you jealous?

He missed footnote 2 (Maximum loaded trailer weight requires weight-distributing hitch) and an entire piece on page 6 of Hitch Receiver Weight Capacity.

Heck a 2020 F150 may be in my future.

But to the OP - rethink about using a WDH, I highly recommend the Equal-i-zer.

"But to the OP- rethink about using a WDH, I highly recommend the Equali-i-zer".

DITTO !!!
I use the 14K Equali-zer brand hitch with my loaded 12K equipment trailer, and I would not leave home without it.
 
   / Towing heavy on a 1/2 ton #26  
You need to do some research on tow ratings - and how they are REALLY figured out - the truck manufacturers are EXTREMELY loose with their specs.

For example - most 150/1500 class vehicles are advertised with say, 9600lb tow rating. FIrst, this assumes a SPECIFIC truck - which may not be YOUR truck - 4x4 usually reduces tow rating, as can some options (wheels/tires being a big one). It assumes you have the HD tow package as well. Most do not. My 01 ford had 4x4 and optional 17" tires - each reduced the tow rating 500 lbs - so I lost 1000lbs right there.

Second, they figure this on a base/stripped truck - the GCWR is say, 14,400 - so the TOTAL of truck and trailer, cargo, passengers, fuel rolling down the road. So you need to weight the truck - my 1500 came in at 5700 lbs. So the REAL towing capacity was 8700 lbs. BUT - they figure it with 150lb driver, 1/2 tank gas...add in a 250lb me, full tank and it's gonne be more like 8500. That doesn't include the hitch- a WD hitch can run another 75 lbs. If you added things (bedliner, tonneau cover, running boards, etc) consider that weight.

Now consider the tounge weight - 150/1500 trucks are almost all 7000lb GVWR (in PA if you're over that your license place annual fee doubles!) SO my 5700 lb truck (on a cat scale) plus me, wife, kids, dog (about 600lb) put the weight at 6300 lbs...leaving only 700 for tongue weight...on a 7000lb camper the tongue weight should be 700-1050 (10-15%). I was running at the limit.

And I could FEEL i was at the limit. Emergency maneuvers would be a concern...so I had to drive VERY defensively.

As to 5th wheel/gooseneck, 20% of the weight should be on the truck...check your tire/axle ratings. 150/1500's come with 4 ply P rated tires - they ride nice but load capacity leaves a lot to be desired. Over loaded tires get hot and blow out. All too easily.

I now have an F350..WOW, the difference. I've not had it on a scale, but estimates put it just over 6k. It's a gas base truck, so no dual cab or heavy options. GVWR is 10,500 - I've got TWO TONS of load capacity - vs 1300lb in a 1500 (2013 silverado). And E rated 10 ply tires - and a ride that, unloaded, is uncomfortably stiff.

BUT I also got HUGE brakes, axles, tires, lug nuts, thicker frame, heavier springs - there is NO comparison when it comes to towing with this beast vs the 1500 and ford expedition I had before.

***** concerns should be *****
wearing out your truck
breaking things on your truck
ANY emergency - swerve, stop, etc - your safety
And what should be first, i'm putting last - the safety of everyone else on the road. Should you have an issues and an accident YOU will be liable to the extreme if you are overloaded. Read the fine print in your car insurance - most exempt coverage for illegal activities...overloaded is illegal, so you may be denied your claim.

It's a tough situation - for the rare moves just hire it done. CUrrenly we need sawdust for the horses - light but bulky. Renting a dump truck (I have a cdl) is $400/day...dump trailers are cheaper and I can even borrow one, but without 4' tallsides it's multiple trips - at 10mpg and 40 mile round trip, and my time, that adds up. I can hire a triaxle to do the whole thing - $100. Duh, it's a no brainer.

I've got an F150 and am considering getting a 14K dump trailer. The F150 is rated, the way mine's configured, for a bit less than that (12-13K, IIRC), so I'd keep it under full to stay in range, but then, start doing a little more digging and realize that's only with a weight distributing hitch. Now, I haven't used a WDH in many years; but wow, they were a total PITA the last time I used one. Nightmare getting hooked up, dropped out of alignment at times, just bad. So, unless things have changed (if so, please educate me), I'm not too keen on fitting a WDH.

So, my other option is to get a gooseneck dump trailer and put the goose in the bed. I like towing a goose, and it's easy to hitch up (which is important for me, this trailer won't be an all day thing, I'll hook up, get something, drop it, and then perhaps hook up later and go get something else the same day, not running it "always connected" like some people do).

And, of course, there's the really expensive way to do this, get a F250/350 with a goose and call it done. :) Overkill for me, for sure, I probably haul about 5% of the time I'm in my truck, but that'll be the end of worrying about weights and capacity. Might as well go all out and get a 8 wheel dump trailer, that'll take me over 100K for the combo to move around some rock.

You know, reading the manual, it seems to say that any trailer over 5K on a F150 needs a WDH. What the heck is that?? I've never seen a WDH on a F150 in my life that's not a long distance car hauler setup. In fact, I don't think I've ever seen a dump trailer hooked up using a WDH. Is this just corporate CYA? Or do I need to really be concerned here? My truck has the max tow setup, brake controller etc, I tow my 7K landscape trailer (which, apparently, I'm doing wrong!) all the time with it.
 
   / Towing heavy on a 1/2 ton #27  
I doubt that very much - F150 and similar trucks are CARS.
I had a '14 silverado w/ HD tow package - GVWR was 7000lbs. Scale weight of the empty truck was 5700 lbs - a 1300 lb load capacity. It's a half tone truck...so yeah, driver, passenver and 1000lb cargo..but it's a4 door truck that seats 6...

My windstar minivan had a higher rated capacity at 1600 lbs!

My outback has a rating of 1300...and it's a far cry from a full size pick up truck.

I now have an F350 - no comparison to the light duty trucks I've had in the past - lugnuts, brakes, axles, frame, springs.

I'm curious about this as well. I've got a '97 F350 SRW (Powerstroke 7.3), and yes it's a 1-ton, but my guess is that a modern F150 can probably out-tow this in every way - tow capacity, braking ability - except raw weight (my truck is about 6,000lbs empty). I was considering the 14k trailer bit as well, until I realized that there's a reason why the 14k is heavier rated than the 10k - it's both longer and heavier built, meaning it's substantially heavier, and the truck's only got so much tow rating that that's eating into.
 
   / Towing heavy on a 1/2 ton #28  
The link with the sales brochure is not real world numbers. It is almost a joke. No I am not jealous. I would bet big money his truck IS NOT RATED at those numbers. Until he posts what his truck is exactly we will not know. The payload sticker is the critical number. A couple of people above posted real world numbers. They are hardly ever over 2000 lbs of payload and often much less. Find me a real world F150 with a 3200 payload and lunch is on me. That is more than a lot of 250 trucks.
 
   / Towing heavy on a 1/2 ton #29  
That's why a F250 gasser would be a better solution.
For MPG get a little Ranger or a Prius (j/k) lol....
 
   / Towing heavy on a 1/2 ton #30  
You need to do some research on tow ratings - and how they are REALLY figured out - the truck manufacturers are EXTREMELY loose with their specs.
<snip>

That became evident to me when I went to purchase my dually. Tow ratings jumped from 10K to 12K on some trucks just due to model year when there was no real difference in brakes suspension etc.

My wife had been wanting me to get a SMALL trailer for my VW Jetta TDI Sportwagen. It has a rated tow capacity of 1,000 lbs in the US. Same identical build can tow 2,000 lbs in England.

I'm buying a diesel Ford Transit Connect Short WheelBase (SWB). In the US it's tow capacity is 2,000 lbs. In Europe it's "Towing Limit" is 6,261 pounds (2840kg) InterVans - Buy a Ford Transit Connect SWB or OVER 3 TIMES as much!!

Now it would make a BIG DIFFERENCE to me if I could pull a trailer rated at 6K vs 2K.
 
   / Towing heavy on a 1/2 ton #31  
I drove a V6 94 Dakota, then went to a 2000 V8 Dakota and now a Duramax. For straight transportation, the fuel economy of all three was pretty much the same.
 
   / Towing heavy on a 1/2 ton #32  
I had a 91 and a 94 Dakota, they got lousy mileage and were the worst POS's that I ever owned. When I finally bought a different truck, the garage that kept them running started closing on Saturdays. I used to joke that it was because I had bought the Toyota, but it stopped being so funny when I started adding up my repair bills and realized that the '94 had averaged 4.5 hours/week in the shop for the 2 years that I owned it. :thumbdown:
 
   / Towing heavy on a 1/2 ton #33  
Except for bad gas that messed up the fuel pump on my 94, they never gave me a lick of trouble. I really loved that 94, but an 8 would have been nicer. The interiors in all trucks just got uglier and crappier after that it seems.

Picked this stuff up at HORST, to build a trailer. CLEARLY, I needed more truck!

DSC01457B.jpg

Just looking at the date. That truck got written off later that year, just minding my own business stopped at a stop sign, and I took advantage of the GM going out of business sale and got a free Duramax and Allison.
 
   / Towing heavy on a 1/2 ton #34  
You might have a hard time finding a dump trailer tongue that can accommodate a weight distributing hitch. They usually aren’t tube frame like a camper frame. They also don’t usually have a welded on coupler, but adjustable one. I don’t worry so much about the tow ratings of the truck, but more about the hitch ratings. But I’m also running a 2016 F350 SRW. I have a 2 1/2” hitch rated for 2k lbs in tongue weight. WD and WC. I pull a 14k dump and it does ok, but I have air bags. I think you’ll have bad luck with a 14k bumper pull dump on your F150. Go with a 10k dump and air bags and a beefier hitch. You’ll be fine.
 
   / Towing heavy on a 1/2 ton #35  
^^^^
Just out of curiousity, what are the weight ratings for your F350?
 
   / Towing heavy on a 1/2 ton #36  
No idea. It’s the 6.2 4wd, crew cab short bed with 3.73 axle. I only pay attention to gross axle weight rating and tire ratings. Combined the truck and trailer are 26k. (12k truck, 14k trailer). No CDL, but dot #’s and dot physical.

The truck has a GVWR of like 11300 or 11500. I have it registered at 12k.
 
   / Towing heavy on a 1/2 ton #37  
How can that rust situation happen..... in CANADA?
I thought there was an annual (or bi-annual) provincial inspection required for every vehicle?

Inspection in Canada varies province to province.
 
   / Towing heavy on a 1/2 ton #38  
My boss at the bus garage where I work got a dump trailer - like me, he has a class b CDL so we're restricted to trailers of 9990 or less, or else need a class a.
Since he's the expert on this (third generation driver) I'll assume he's correct.

Seems illogical that a professional driver is limited to a 10k trailer when a 'regular' person can have a 14k trailer.

Also, if it's an RV no special license is needed - even if it's 45feet long with air brakes as some Prevosts are.

No idea. It’s the 6.2 4wd, crew cab short bed with 3.73 axle. I only pay attention to gross axle weight rating and tire ratings. Combined the truck and trailer are 26k. (12k truck, 14k trailer). No CDL, but dot #’s and dot physical.

The truck has a GVWR of like 11300 or 11500. I have it registered at 12k.
 
   / Towing heavy on a 1/2 ton #39  
My boss at the bus garage where I work got a dump trailer - like me, he has a class b CDL so we're restricted to trailers of 9990 or less, or else need a class a.
Since he's the expert on this (third generation driver) I'll assume he's correct.

Seems illogical that a professional driver is limited to a 10k trailer when a 'regular' person can have a 14k trailer.

Also, if it's an RV no special license is needed - even if it's 45feet long with air brakes as some Prevosts are.

Everybody seems to forget that 10K trailer rating is tied to a single vehicle or combination of vehicles exceeding 26,001 pounds.
 
   / Towing heavy on a 1/2 ton #40  
Overtaxed,
Here is my two cents. A weight distributing hitch for what you are doing is going to be a PITA. Reason is after you load it you will have to install the torsion bars on the hitch and how they are adjusted is going to change based on your load. IMO I would not plan on using a WDH with a dump trailer.
I owned a 2004 chevy suburban and towed over the rating of "the vehicle regularly" Now before everyone has a fit hear me out. The hitch and all safety chains where rated for the load. I used a WHD keeping tongue load to within spec. Used a good brake controler and had disc brakes on the trailer. Key here is tongue load, that spec is for the weight on your rear tires. Tow ratings on vehicles change because of drive train engineering specs, driveline rear end ect. that is why you see minor changes year to year. I blew the brake line on the suburban if the brake light on the dash would not have come on you would not have known, as the trailer was doing all the braking.
With that said and based on what I have read of your post. Go with trailer you want forget the WDH load the trailer so that the back of your truck just starts to sag. Watch the loading on the trailer springs and the wheels in the wheel well, that they don't hit, when loaded. If you have to add sides and keep load in the middle of the trailer. Since you are loading same material and driving same route you will figure out what is best. You'll be OK.
Just make sure hitch, ball and safety chains are rated for the max load of the trailer. Get a good brake controler and don't go to fast. keep eye on tire pressure and as long as your careful you will be ok.
truck.JPG
That is with WDH I use that same trailer and truck for my skid loader takes everything right to the max. I however go slow and not far, works. The Suburban has been replaced with the truck on the trailer and have purchased larger deck over trailer.
Have dumptrailer that I have pulled behind that suburban we load it as discribed and it worked ok. Suburban didn't like it....... but it worked. That is why we went to the 3/4 ton. My guess is we will have that to the max in less that a year....
 

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