Real Data needed on commuter vehicles

[skylarkguy]

I'm looking for some actual data on mpg for a commuter vehicle.

The back story: my wife commutes 70 miles round trip. She currently drives a 91 Honda CRX. We have logged nearly every gallon of fuel that has gone into this car and it gets a solid 40 MPG. But this car is at about 270K on the odometer and starting to get long in the tooth. Add to that some particularly heinous fatal head on accidents in the vicinity with similar vintage cars and we are starting to think about other options.

But here is the rub. When you start looking at efficiency ratings there isn't a whole lot very promising that can meet or exceed the crx in fuel economy. Granted a newer car will have airbags and meet a more modern crash test standard but I really don't think an mpg rating of 32 on the highway is all that impressive. Most of the data I can find thus far is mostly based on government estimates...and they miss the mark on the 91 crx so I don't have a lot of faith in estimates of more modern cars.

Toyota Prius can hit the 40-50 mpg mark, most of the time. (Generation 2 cars drop off quickly after the battery starts to fail) Generation 3 more easily gets 50 mpg more often...so it seems. There are lots of them and the asking price seems way out of this world for used ones.

VW 2.0 liter Diesel in the Jetta or golf can get 50 mpg apparently...but there might be some issues with all the test data fabrication nonsense.

Apparently the Honda Fit might squeak out 40 MPG with a stick shift and driven right.

The first generation Honda Insight can get 60 mpg or higher if driven right...but this car is pretty idiosyncratic.

So I'm looking for some real world numbers from the TBN population on what they drive and how good the fuel economy has been. Info on maintenance or other repair problems are welcome as well.

I usually buy used cars, but wouldn't necessarily rule out a new car purchase. But i have the following criteria....

It needs to get at least 40 MPG (real honest numbers with no crazy driving techniques).
No older than a 2006 model year
Can be stick or auto trans...she can drive either.
I'd consider straight gas or diesel, hybrid or EV...but the EV need to have sufficient range to make it 35 miles with no range anxiety.
I'd like to spend 10k or less.

I have No brand loyalty to speak of...I have had Buicks, Toyota, Honda, Chevys,...and to bring it back to tractors...a Ford and Mitsubishi tractor....but it would be a terrible commute on the NAA:laughing:

Thanks in advance

 

[fordmantpw]

Try Fuelly - Track and Compare your MPG. Best source of this type of info.

 

[terryknight]

my wife has had two honda civics and 04 and an 06. 06 having four doors was the reason for the change. both autos, both driven the same way. the 04 would get high 30s everytime 38-39 and sometimes she could get 41-42 when the conditions were right. the newer one gets mid 30s 34-35, and everyonce in a while can get 38-39. this won't help you since they are older, but my uncle had two 95 VW passats, TDI and 5 speeds would always get mid to upper 50s. he has recently changed to a 2010 model. I do not know what his MPGs are anymore

 

[RalphVa]

The overall average on our 2010 Jetta TDI is just over 40. It does 47-49 on interstates where the hwy is mostly level and 44-46 across WVa to Columbus, OH.

I've been scouting out cars to buy when VW buys back our TDI. Not going for a TDI because would be totally unsure of the history of any new TDI (and they currently don't have any). It could have been stored somewhere while VW has been trading back and forth with the judge. Also, the false "check engine" lights firing up are a pain.

So, I set my goal on cars with stick shift (wife cannot drive an auto) that do 40 mpg hwy or better. My experience is our overall average is just above the EPA hwy value; while hwy mileage is quite a bit higher (an anything but a vehicle that pushes a whole lot of air like the current pickups and SUVs; it is NOT on my Tacoma pickup).

I found about a half dozen, but only about 2 or 3 have all the equipment (basically what our TDI has plus a rear view camera and fog lights that it wasn't offered with). These are a VW Jetta 1.4T, a Mazda3 sTouring with the 2.0 liter. Most of the other makes only offer stick shift in the very basic of models. You cannot get them equipped very well and still keep the stick.

I drove a Mazda3 about 5 years ago in Florida and got 40 mpg on it. Think this was before their current batch of cars. They basically use some technology similar to what's in hybrids plus other computerization without going to turbo charge and hybrids.

Ralph

 

[MossRoad]

Our 2013 Impala gets an honest 30 on the hwy and is a heck of a lot more fun to drive than any of those! hahahahahaaha

Anyhow, I have a friend that has an original Prius and he averages over 40 in combined city and hwy. He had to replace the battery pack at about 11-12 years old, but its still going strong. Several hundred thousand miles. Its a dorky looking thing, but when I'm pumping 40 gallons into my 93 Suburban every two weeks and he puts 10 in Prius..........

I tried on a Jetta... I couldn't fit in it. I'm only 6' tall. My right leg rubbed the console and my shoe had MAYBE 1/2" between the edge of the brake pedal and the console. Winter boots and I wouldn't have been able to push the gas pedal! Maybe look at the Passat.

 

[Qapla]

My wife and daughter each have Hyundai Elantras. The both get 36-40 mpg with normal driving, running the A/C in Florida. This is actually my wife's second Elantra and my daughter has had three (they got great "trade in" deals).

For a smaller car, they are quite roomy and comfortable. Great acceleration, smooth ride and nice amenities.

New they run around $16,000 - not sure what used prices are in Oregon.

 

[newbury]

We have a Honda Civic hybrid, 2004. Honda Fit, 2006, VW JSW TDI, 2009, Hyundai Elantra 2011(?)

The Civic is on it's second battery, has an emissions warning light on but still gets 40MPG.
The Fit returns about 40MPG if I don't play with the paddles, but it's my daughters car.
I am starting to suffer withdrawal pains because I'm going to have to put the JSW down. But VW is due to pay me about $16K for it.
The Hyundai gets good mileage, but my son runs it so no telling.

Of all the cars the VW JSW TDI is the BEST. I drove it several times a year from DC to Tupelo, MS in a one day drive, about 850 miles. Running light I've gotten up to 47MPG at an AVERAGE speed of 65, before I put a cargo box on top. It is basically irreplaceable for the $16K they may give me and they are going to destroy it

If you can get a good condition newer one that they can "fix" I'd highly recommend it.

 

[Btown]

If you can find one that is not beat and has service records. You cannot beat the 1999-2003 VW TDI's with 5 speed gearbox. You can try to see if you can get it under 40 mpg. I had a 2000 beetle. Lowest tank was 42 mpg. Highest was 50. The golfs and jettas got the best mileage. Good luck. I now have a 2013 Passat TDI took it to Florida from Massachusetts twice it got around 47-48 mpg. The car was loaded and we went no slower than 70. That car loves loooooong trips.

 

[Diamondpilot]

My vote is for a strait old Honda Civic. It may not get the best MPG but it will return the best cost per mile over the long run.

Chris

 

[MossRoad]

I'm sold on more safety features on newer cars VS older cars that get better mileage. Anti lock brakes, traction control, stability control, etc... are important to me since my kids and wife drive the car way more than I do. While I enjoy older vehicles more than newer ones, if given a choice for a daily driver, I'd take the newer one for safety and reliability.

 

[HHR]

I would highly recommend the Toyota Prius C. Our 2014 model has 64,000 miles and has provided 54+ mpg (48 in the winter in snow tires). The car is used for a 110 mile commute on mostly 2-lane highways (60 mph). Excellent 1st and second row leg and headroom and absolutely no problems, recalls or quality issues. Only downsides are a slightly stiff ride and small cargo area.
New ones go for around $18,000 to $20,000. Should be able to find 2012 model for around $10,000. If you shop around.
Level 2 model is the best compromise for decent features and low price.

 

[newbury]

I would highly recommend the Toyota Prius C. Our 2014 model has 64,000 miles and has provided 54+ mpg (48 in the winter in snow tires). The car is used for a 110 mile commute on mostly 2-lane highways (60 mph). Excellent 1st and second row leg and headroom and absolutely no problems, recalls or quality issues. Only downsides are a slightly stiff ride and small cargo area.
New ones go for around $18,000 to $20,000. Should be able to find 2012 model for around $10,000. If you shop around.
Level 2 model is the best compromise for decent features and low price.

Plus for a relatively small investment in an inverter and wiring sundries a handy DIY person can use the Prius as a very reliable 3 KW emergency standby generator.
Or you can buy an assembled kit for $1.5K which is virtually plug and play.

 

[Renze]

Nothing of this vintage sold as Diesel in the US i believe, but on my daily commute i nowadays get 19.2km out of a liter of diesel, with my 1999 Volvo S70 TDI. Which is 45 miles per gallon. Not bad if you concider the amount of traffic lights and jams i meet underway, and the fact that i hit 150kmh on the highway to make up for lost time In light traffic i can get to work in 45 minutes, but on rush hour it takes an hour. Two weeks ago i rounded the 400.000km mark and i intend to keep it at least another 200.000km. (There was a guy in a Dutch car mag who got a free tacho from the Sweden factory, after a complaint that his V70 TDI tacho stopped counting at 999.999km )

As for crash safety, the 850/S70 set the standard in its era, and smaller family cars only recently can touch that... And when watching this Youtube video i understand your safety concerns about the 1991 CRX... My friend had 2nd gen like your wifes, and two 3rd generation CRX, but when he got kids, this Youtube video made him want a Volvo to transport them safely ...

[video=youtube;Xneu-TYyzvA]The Indestructible Volvo Safest Cars In The World - YouTube[/video]

 

[MossRoad]

I wonder how flat that roof would be if there wasn't a safety cage welded in around the driver as seen at 2:24 in the video. Still, pretty impressive.

 

[tlj87]

My vote is for a strait old Honda Civic. It may not get the best MPG but it will return the best cost per mile over the long run. Chris

I'll second this. We bought an 07 Civic in 2010 with 36k on it. It now has 150k on it. This car has been a complete gem! Honda has been great with any recalls. For instance, The hood, roof and trunk lid were repainted at no cost to me due to a paint defect. The only issue other than regular PM was a sensor on the transmission. I calculated the cost per mile on this car to be about 19 cents per mile. Compare this to 40 cents per mile for our 07 Silverado. This makes sense because the civic gets an average of 35 mpg and the Silverado about 17. This cars replacement will almost certainly be another Honda, though we may try the CRV which now gets in the low 30 MPG range.

 

[motownbrowne]

I've got an '09 Fit. Sold our '01 civic to buy it. Both were 5 speed manuals. The fit gets a little better mileage, but not much, and the ride is worse. We drove my BIL's '13 Fit over the weekend, which I thought had a much better ride, and maybe a little less road noise. I'm sure some of that is the tires. Both are Sport models. On our last road trip, the Fit got 38 average with the AC on and driving about 75 MPH most of the time.

Honestly, I'd never drive a VW. I've got lots of friends who fell over themselves to buy them because of the fuel economy, and the darned things are in the shop way more than they should be. Also, they suffer from a tendency to have little stupid things go wrong that don't really warrant repair in many cases, but add up to a quirky car. Also, these cars are pretty expensive compared to the Hondas and Toyotas.

Yeah, the diesels will get a little better mileage, but I think it's silly to look at that solely. Diesel has cost more over the last 5 years. Between my last three cars, I've put about 160,000 miles on Hondas with hardly a trip to the shop. I did the timing belt/water pump on our civic at 100k, and did the front wheel bearings. I had the rotors turned on the car before that, a '93 accord that my dad now drives. That's it. By the way, that accord has 285,000 miles on it. The clutch is original. His previous accord, a '92 had 275,000 on the original clutch when he parked it due to rust issues. All of these vehicles have been dead reliable. I'd happily trade a few mpgs for the reliability of a Honda versus a VW.

Going from a CRX to any of these cars will be an incredible upgrade, but I'd still say to try several to find one that rides the best. My preference would be for the simplest car, I.e. a basic gas manual hatchback. They however will ride worse than a Prius or diesel VW, because they are lighter cars with smaller tires. I'd be looking pretty hard at corollas, yaris, fit, and civic.

 

[RalphVa]

Go to Edmunds.com and do a search for cars getting better than 30 mpg. Edmunds uses the average of the hwy and city EPA values. If you input 40 mpg as your search, you'll only get hybrids.

There are probably 6 maybe 8 models that have EPA hwy values equal to or greater than 40 (generally 40-41). Toyota, Nissan, Honda, Chevy and Ford all only offer sticks in their very basic models.

Look up Consumer Reports issue on new cars. You should be able to get it at the library. They have an area that covers fuel mileage they measured. They also have the service histories. VW Jetta is still on that list, but last because of their service and TDI issues. Mazda3 is near the top.

Ralph

 

[Copperhead]

I would take a look at diesel varieties from various OEM's. I have heard and read some interesting mpg numbers on the diesel cars that rival or exceed hybrids and with diesel being roughly same price as gas now, it might be a viable option even with the higher initial price. More likely than not, the engine will outlast the car. Given the pricing of hybrids, not sure there would be a hit in buying a diesel car.

 

[dodge man]

Just me thinking out loud, but I wouldn't focus on cars getting more than 40 mpg. I'd focus on getting the best car for the money, and if it gets 35 mpg, I wouldn't rule it out.

 

[motownbrowne]

Just me thinking out loud, but I wouldn't focus on cars getting more than 40 mpg. I'd focus on getting the best car for the money, and if it gets 35 mpg, I wouldn't rule it out.

Yes, exactly.

My Fit would get 40+ if I drove 60 on the highway, and kept my foot out of it getting up to speed. It's more fun to wind it out, though, so I happily sacrifice a few MPGs.