Ford 1700, introduction, part deux

[Fawken]

It's almost like there needs to be a Ford Shibaura forum. I realize my 1100 is quite a bit smaller than the 1700, but the machines are so similar (1100, 1200, 1300, 1500, 1700) that Ford saw fit to put them all in the same service manual. I bought this thing new in 83 and it now has over 4000, very hard hours on it. The first 25 years was kept out in the rain, but after repainting and putting on new decals she's earned a spot in the garage. Water pump, hoses, starter, thermostat, head gasket, lift seal, PTO seal, sediment bowl, muffler, oil pressure sender, tires, batteries, fuel injectors, and of course fluids and filters. Not bad for 32 years.

 

[ZR WON]

Fawken:

I have a mechanical oil pressure gauge on my 1700 as the sender went bad. Do you have a source for an original so I can get the 'idiot' light to work again? I'd actually probably 'y' that oil pressure port and put a sensor AND mechanical gauge on (I like numbers when it comes to important things like oil pressure). Speaking of oil pressure, what is 'good' oil pressure for a 1700? At operating temperature, mine is around 35psi at a 800rpm idle and around 50psi at 2500. Seems plenty for only 2500rpm, but wonder if there is a range for 'normal.'

Brian A.
1979 Ford 1700 2wd

 

[Fawken]

Fawken:

I have a mechanical oil pressure gauge on my 1700 as the sender went bad. Do you have a source for an original so I can get the 'idiot' light to work again? I'd actually probably 'y' that oil pressure port and put a sensor AND mechanical gauge on (I like numbers when it comes to important things like oil pressure). Speaking of oil pressure, what is 'good' oil pressure for a 1700? At operating temperature, mine is around 35psi at a 800rpm idle and around 50psi at 2500. Seems plenty for only 2500rpm, but wonder if there is a range for 'normal.'

Actually, I got that sender unit about this time last year direct from NH. Pricey, but they can get them. I was tilling about a 1/2 acre and the oil light started blinking. That's a scary feeling since the tiller puts more strain on my machine than anything including the backhoe. The service manual is at the shop, but those pressure numbers sound low to me. I'll look it up.

 

[Fawken]

Well, darn it. I guess Ford (or I&T) didn't think oil pressure data was too important. No specs given for any model. They do say that all models have an oil pressure relief valve that can be adjusted. I would warm the engine good, pull the valve cover and observe oil flow to the top-end at idle. Should be a nice steady dribble (not spurting) out of each push rod.

 

[ZR WON]

Fawken:

Do you have a Ford part number for the oil pressure sending unit? I searched the NH parts store with little luck. I found a used one at Wenger's for ten bucks, but that's just running on borrowed time, IMHO.

Brian A.
1979 Ford 1700 2wd

 

[Fawken]

http://www.ebay.com/itm/FORD-Shibau...46010-SBA185246011-SBA185246050-/250931675119

$18.95 which is about half what I paid at NH a year ago. It looks the same, BTW. I assume you are going to the official New Holland parts look-up site Official New Holland Online Parts Store and Online Parts Catalog for New Holland and Ford Tractors.
which is where you start and you can get the part # there (SBA #) every time. Apparently, oil pressure senders are no longer on the agenda at New Holland as they don't show a price. Welcome to the world of Shibaura Fords. Use that part number and just paste it into your browser. You'll find the part, I promise. These tractors are some of the most durable ever built and Shibaura marketed those engines to a variety of equip mfrs world-wide. The oil pressure sender is one of those parts that cross-references to a ton of engines. The one on E-Bay seems reasonable to me.

 

[ZR WON]

Fawken:

That is the NH website I was perusing indeed, but I obviously don't know how to search as I still can't locate the number! Ha! The oil pressure sender you listed from eBay certainly is reasonable, but the connector doesn't look right to me (understand I don't have the original unit, only the wire that goes to it). It looks to me that the connector end on my tractor (a 'c clip' where you tighten a screw around it to secure) wouldn't work on this unit. Obviously snipping the wire off a bit and putting on a new connector is no issue, just wanted to make sure that my original wiring harness hadn't been tampered with in the past (doesn't appear to have been). If this eBay unit is the cross referenced part for the 1700, it sounds like I don't have much of a choice but to change the wire connector. Given my obvious inability to search the NH parts website correctly ( ), which of the three part numbers listed on the eBay ad is the correct one for the 1700? Given the price of a new one at $18.95 vs. $10 for an old one from Wengers that will undoubtedly fail in the (near) future, the choice seems clear.

Brian A.
1979 Ford 1700 2wd

 

[Fawken]

What I found over the years, Brian, is that Ford often had different part numbers for an identical part. i.e. this sender probably works on all the 1000 series Shibauras, but Ford gave a different part number to each. Did you try searching the NH web site for a 1500 sender? The other question is have you called your NH dealer directly? I know for a fact I bought that sender at NH so maybe I just called the dealer- can't remember.

 

[rayikeo2]

Fawken:

Do you have a Ford part number for the oil pressure sending unit? I searched the NH parts store with little luck. I found a used one at Wenger's for ten bucks, but that's just running on borrowed time, IMHO.

Brian A.
1979 Ford 1700 2wd

ZR WON, I have the part number for the original equipment.

Part #SBA185246011 sender unit. Original unit has a screw terminal on the end to use a wire with a round connector(or C clip).

This is a place on the west coast that has practally every part for Ford/Newholland parts.

Brim Tractor BRIM EQUIPMENT

Part is listed under engine parts: #12 Official New Holland Online Parts Store and Online Parts Catalog for New Holland and Ford Tractors.

They may have everything you would need for your 1700.

I ordered 1 in 09/2008 and it cost then $20.79

At the same time I ordered a seal for my 3 point lift for $11.98

 

[Fawken]

I paid $39 for the sender last year at NH and about $30 three years ago for the lift seal also at NH. Inflation? Or were they sending a message that they really do not want to stock parts for these machines? Also, check these guys out if you need something major: Southern Global

 

[ZR WON]

Rayikeo2, Fawken:

Thanks so much for the links. I didn't have a chance to contact either over the weekend but will try Brim and Southern Global regarding the parts I'm searching. On another subject, while mowing Friday, I *may* have been imagining this, but don't think so. It would seem while mowing, the lever (to the right of the seat, by fender) that controls the 3-point height seems to be raising on it's own?!?! Not a lot (maybe 1/2"), but you both mentioning a lift seal makes me wonder if I have a seal failing, causing this symptom!? Logic would tell me a leak would cause the 3-point to fall, not go up, but perhaps that depends on which seal is leaking?!? Again, it's possible I was imagining this (I do raise a lower the deck quite a bit while mowing), but wondered if anyone else has experienced this!?!? Thanks as always.

Brian A.
1979 Ford 1700 2wd

 

[drakefamily2]

Mine does the same thing, don't know what causes. I put the lever below the stop now when mowing.

 

[Fawken]

Rayikeo2, Fawken:

Thanks so much for the links. I didn't have a chance to contact either over the weekend but will try Brim and Southern Global regarding the parts I'm searching. On another subject, while mowing Friday, I *may* have been imagining this, but don't think so. It would seem while mowing, the lever (to the right of the seat, by fender) that controls the 3-point height seems to be raising on it's own?!?! Not a lot (maybe 1/2"), but you both mentioning a lift seal makes me wonder if I have a seal failing, causing this symptom!? Logic would tell me a leak would cause the 3-point to fall, not go up, but perhaps that depends on which seal is leaking?!? Again, it's possible I was imagining this (I do raise a lower the deck quite a bit while mowing), but wondered if anyone else has experienced this!?!? Thanks as always.

Brian A.
1979 Ford 1700 2wd

There is a pressure relief ball valve on the back of the position control valve (right side under seat). Sounds like your pressure is to high. You need a gauge to adjust it. I suppose you could loosen it one thread at a time to find the right balance. Usually they do the opposite as the spring loses tension and the arms drift down. There is also lever friction adjustment you could tighten up which would be the easiest.

 

[ZR WON]

Rayikeo2, Fawken:

Called Brim Monday afternoon, spoke with a Mike regarding the oil pressure sensor and the correct rear tail lamp (the one I ordered elsewhere was square, obviously not original). I was beginning to wonder if he was going to call me back, but sure enough, did about an hour ago. He assured me the oil pressure sensor he had was the screw type that would work with the OEM wiring harness. Also, he cross referenced the rear tail lamp, verified the part number that was listed on the NH site (where I got it) was for a square tail lamp (not original). He found the correct new part number (unfortunately, I didn't ask what it was but will post once I receive the part and verify it as correct) representing a round tail lamp. Pricing was $38 for the sensor and $78 for the tail lamp. If both are OEM or exact reproductions, I'm fine with the slightly elevated cost.

Brian A.
1979 Ford 1700 2wd

 

[Fawken]

Glad you found what you wanted. I just put the round ones from TSC on mine. They look a lot like the original and are about $10. Not real sure why you insist on OEM for these guys. I love 'em. They're workhorses, but (IMHO) they'll never be classics or collectors items. To me they're just another tool- a darn fine one- but just a tool.

 

[ZR WON]

Fawken:

Can't argue with your logic. But my Grandfather was a fanatic about maintenance and keeping things nice (I definitely got that from him! ). Coming from nothing, he grew up very poor so everything he bought was kept as nice as possible, as he worked so hard to get it. Guess I'm just trying to keep things as nice as reasonably feasible, in remembrance of him. Regarding classics, no doubt.... If his old 1700 wouldn't have been available, I would have purchased a Golden Jubilee,

Brian A.
1979 Ford 1700 2wd

 

[ZR WON]

All:

Hope all is well. Things have been going well over the past month with the 1700; been getting to know the tractor, have noticed something new that I'm hoping for some assistance on. One of the small fuel return hoses (goes from the rear injector to the top of the tank) is cracked to the point that it's actually seeping diesel fuel when the engine is running. I cannot seem to locate a fuel rated hose that small anywhere, is this something you can only get at a New Holland dealer? I've tried to attach a photo but don't think it worked.

Also, I've been searching for a Ford 770a or b front loader (what's the difference between the two?), with little success. Are there other loaders ('bolt on') that work with the 1700? I have read that a 2wd can have trouble turning with a front loader, is the front axles robust enough to support the added weight of the loader (and the contents of the bucket)? Thanks as always!

Brian A.
1979 Ford 1700 2wd

 

[barbqranch]

How big is the hose? McMaster Carr shows a fuel hose down to 3/16 inch.

 

[JC-jetro]

Brian,

Mine were cracked about 10 years ago. The return line are not exposed to high pressure. I simply used some 1/4" black runner hose that is normally used on Pitot tube and manometers. It has held up just fine for the last 10 years. Additionally I bought some 5/16" clear plastic tubing to replace my fuel sight glass/tube. It has held up just fine for the past 10 years.

JC,

 

[Fawken]

Any auto supply will have a capable replacement. Buy a foot so you can be ready for the next little drip. Won't affect your performance in the slightest.