Linear actuator for power SSQA?

[aeblank]

I think this is what I'm going to do...........

I measured the travel on my SSQA. On mine, the bottom bolt that attaches to the spring/pin etc. travels "exactly" 4". It is a 12x1.25x25mm bolt, according the the parts diagram.

As such.....

8" travel 100lb force actuator from here: Linear Actuator IP66 | Progressive Automations for $149
Replace the bolt that is there with a longer bolt and a nut (mcmaster numbers 91180A731 ($7.48) and 91415A235 ($9.41)).
Probably some washers 98023A033 at $6.00 or locally by the pound.

Seems like this should be able to be cheaper, but some tubing 7767T53 @ $45.16 (or, for another $100 they will make me a custom length shaft). Maybe some black pipe or something? Needs to fit over the 1.1" shaft without "much" slop.

Cost: 149+7.48+9.41+6+45.16 = $217
Still need wiring, plugs, and switches.

See mockup of one end mounting below:



Notes:

• 
  There isn't a quick-removal if the thing screws up. That was one goal I had originally, to be pinned on for easy removal.

• With the 8" actuator, I am maximizing my leverage. As such, I'm pretty comfortable using the lower force (and faster!) longer travel actuator. I just didn't like where the 6" travel actuator needed to mount.

• I don't have to drill holes, tap, or anything.

• I DO have to lengthen the threaded section of the new bolt, I think. A tap is $6.

• I am using the intended mounting (including fastener size) of the actuator

Thoughts?

EDIT: A chunk of 1" schedule 40 black pipe will work out real nice cause the O.D. is a bit less than my mcmaster number'd pipe above. Just need to drill/ream/flapper wheel the I.D. a little bigger to slip over the actuator's shaft. Likely easy enough. It's 1/2 the cost of the pipe listed above. Both prices from mcmaster. I think I need a 16" length, so this 18" piece for $8 is even better... LDR Industries 1 in. x 18 in. Black Steel Schedule 40 Cut Pipe-306 1X18 - The Home Depot

So the price would be more like $180.

 

[Fallon]

I'm happy with the speed on my 400lbs actuator. Given the only difference between 100lbs & 400lbs is the gear ratio & resulting speed/strength, I'd go for the 400lbs. My current actuation time on the 400lbs is 6-7 seconds I think, which is plenty fast in real world use. I flip the switch when I'm 10' from where I'm dropping an implement & the pins are fully retracted before I'm even half way there if I'm moving fast. I'm rarely even more than a couple feet backing up before the pins are extended when picking something up too.

I'm working on the code for my coop automation project & have the original actuator sitting right here. The label on the actuator says 1500 newtons push & 1200 pull (337lbs & 270lbs) although depending on what advertisement you looked at, it was as low as 200lbs or so, so without measuring it, I have no idea what it will actually do. It was making sounds like it was really working when it was trying to lock the pins.

Your extra leverage from mounting further down the lever & using a better quality actuator with trustworthy ratings might make that work with a weaker/faster actuator. I'd have to go out through the sloppy snow to to the barn & look at my tractor to be sure, but I'm pretty sure I know where you are talking about mounting, directly on the top of the pins & spring mechanism. Offhand it sounds like it would probably work.

 

[aeblank]

As much as anything, I'm gunning for the 100lb limit (i.e. I don't want to break anything). The speed is a side benefit. Don't forget though, the longer the actuator gets, the more the speed becomes a concern.
Before I pony up, I'll *try* to measure on the handles and do the math to make sure I don't need the strong one. I'm *guessing* I could return the one actuator for the stronger one if I needed and I managed to keep it pristine.

Yours is still working well? I want to do this so bad, but will probably have to wait till birthday or christmas to get the actuator. oooh, maybe father's day. I dunno, we'll see. I feel like I have a good plan moving forward. Actually........maybe I need to get my pallet forks first. I only have the bucket right now. DOH.

 

[Fallon]

Mine is working great.

As far as protection, the actuator will pull 15 amps at full load (presumably 400lbs or higher). Mine has a 10amp fuse on the circuit, so in theory the fuse will blow if the actuator ever encounters more than 2/3rds of the max load. While I'm sure those numbers aren't really accurate, they are in the right ballpark.

Longer would be slower, but I don't think an extra 2 seconds would be an issue. The 15 seconds or whatever on the undersized actuator wasn't a problem in my testing. Hopefully the extra travel & leverage would offset things, but measuring the force required would be best. A bottle jack & scale maybe?

I'd get your forks first. A power SSQA is cool, but of minimal use with only 1 implement. My forks probably get more use than my bucket.

 

[aeblank]

Looking at the lever, I may be talking myself into the 400lb version.....

The lever is probably 3x as long (or longer) where I pull on it, vs. where the actuator will be. I've had to put some oomph into it before.
Then again, that was cause one of the pins needed grease.

I'm torn........

 

[aeblank]

Mine is working great.

That's really good to know. The viability seems pretty good.
As an aside, kubota does offer a hydraulic version. I've seen the brochures. I wanted to know how/where they attached so I could mimic it, but it doesn't show much detail.

I'd get your forks first. A power SSQA is cool, but of minimal use with only 1 implement. My forks probably get more use than my bucket.

Was supposed to have them by now.....

 

[k0ua]

Looking at the lever, I may be talking myself into the 400lb version.....

The lever is probably 3x as long (or longer) where I pull on it, vs. where the actuator will be. I've had to put some oomph into it before.
Then again, that was cause one of the pins needed grease.

I'm torn........

View attachment 421340

I was always told in engineering things, to go with a 4 to 1 ratio to what might just barely work to what has lots of margin. When you stress things they often fail prematurely. In English, get the bigger one. Take this advice as you see fit.

 

[aeblank]

I was always told in engineering things, to go with a 4 to 1 ratio to what might just barely work to what has lots of margin. When you stress things they often fail prematurely. In English, get the bigger one. Take this advice as you see fit.

As an engineer (with a dozen years experience, holy crap), I can't particularly disagree. 2x-4x, probably...

However, in this case, which is which? If the levers were the bridge and the actuator is the semi-truck, shouldn't the truck be 1/4 the capacity of the bridge?

To guarantee that you have enough force and not "strain" the actuator, the 400lb one all the way.
To guarantee that I do not F-Up my tractor, well, the 100 pounder.

All that said, I've made myself concerned enough that I think I'll do the 400 pound and under-fuse it, like the OP. I have enough discover miles to pay for it on Amazon too. Hmmm.......

 

[aeblank]

This is how Kubota does it. They modified their handles to put another mounting hole in for the cylinder.

Handles are like $200 each, if one wanted to convert. Obviously spendy.
Couldn't find any info on the cylinder travel.
Not that this changes anything (for me anyway).

View attachment PartsInfoPdf 1.pdf
View attachment PartsInfoPdf 2.pdf

 

[Fallon]

Popped a fuse the other day. Didn't jiggle the bucket enough & the pins hit just below the holes. Everything worked as intended, fuse blew when it started straining a little. Popped in a new fuse & it was working fine. If I were to do it over I might get a $10 automotive circuit breaker & just run a wire up to the battery rather than tie into an existing circuit. Probably not motivated enough at this point to pull the dash apart & wire in the breaker now though.

Still dam happy with how it works & glad I did the project. I always dump the bucket/forks/plow before putting it up for the night now. Saves room in the shop & less work to grab the right implement at next use, as I'm guaranteed to have the wrong one on.

 

[aeblank]

That's awesome. I'm excited to do mine based on your experiences.

 

[Xfaxman]

Popped a fuse the other day. Didn't jiggle the bucket enough & the pins hit just below the holes. Everything worked as intended, fuse blew when it started straining a little. Popped in a new fuse & it was working fine. If I were to do it over I might get a $10 automotive circuit breaker & just run a wire up to the battery rather than tie into an existing circuit. Probably not motivated enough at this point to pull the dash apart & wire in the breaker now though.
------------------------------------

You may not have to rewire, depending on clearance, replace the fuse with a plug in circuit breaker.

 

[Fallon]

You may not have to rewire, depending on clearance, replace the fuse with a plug in circuit breaker.

View attachment 422620View attachment 422621View attachment 422622View attachment 422623

I looked at those briefly a day or 2 ago. The micro style breakers are auto-resetting & really tall. I'm not sure if they would clear the cover for the fuse box. I'm also not a fan of auto-resetting in this use case. If I forgot the switch down, or didn't notice it jammed, the breaker would continually reset itself every so often then immediately pop again negating some of the value. It's handy to have my bucket cam on the same circuit as it will turn off at the same time.

 

[Sysop]

I wonder if this will work as well if the tractor and attachment set outside for a few weeks. I find that if mine gets muddy and sets out for a while, it will get a little rusty, and I have to get a hammer to open or close the latches.

It doesn't have a couple grease nipples to keep it lubed up and water out?

 

[aeblank]

It doesn't have a couple grease nipples to keep it lubed up and water out?

Mine does. When I got the tractor, I had to beat one of the handles loose. But now (and with grease), they move easy.
I can't imagine any other manufacturer NOT having grease points.

Aside from that, I love being able to park my stuff inside. Adds years to its (cars, trucks, tractors, log splitters, whatever) life, I'm convinced.

 

[Complete Turf Care]

It doesn't have a couple grease nipples to keep it lubed up and water out?

It does, but sometimes the attachment may stay attached for a few months. And if I don't remove it, I just don't think about greasing it very often. And, my tractors may stay parked for a month or more without ever getting used.

It's my fault for not greasing them as often as I should. I'm just saying that on more than one occasion, I've had to get the hammer out to attach or remove the attachment.

 

[aeblank]

As I mentioned when I posted on my v2 build... The bar was a bit to long & the 15@ rated linear actuator ended up pushing both brackets into the loader arms. The 10@ fuse promptly popped. I was watching for this possibility, so it popped pretty quick, before I could throw the switch.

What size wire did you use? I'm planning on 12ga. Could probably do it with 14ga too, given it's so intermittent and only at ambient temperature.

I do notice you mounted yours where I'm going to mount mine. But you're using 6" of travel and not closing all the way instead of the 8" I'm planning on....

 

[Fallon]

What size wire did you use? I'm planning on 12ga. Could probably do it with 14ga too, given it's so intermittent and only at ambient temperature.

I do notice you mounted yours where I'm going to mount mine. But you're using 6" of travel and not closing all the way instead of the 8" I'm planning on....

I don't remember offhand, but it was a lot thicker than the wire coming out of the actuator itself. I looked up the amp rating & it was over 15@. Much better to go bigger than smaller.

Full throw on my levers where the actuator hooks up is 7.5" if I remember, so not quite enough to go for an 8" actuator. Given how the levers go way over center the pins are fully extended when the actuator is well under 6". Pins get full actuation, but the levers do not. As the pins are the important part it works fine. Different tractors will have different implementations of the SSQA actuators, so it wouldn't surprise me if there are a lot of different measurements or configurations that will work.

 

[aeblank]

I also have the kubota QA. To the best of my measuring abilities, it is 8". Or, within 1/16 of that, anyway. Hard to measure the center of a bolt head that big. I think when I do it, we're doing my dad's kubota too, so I should probably have him measure his just to be sure.

Thanks for the info. Awesome it's working well.

 

[Fallon]

I also have the kubota QA. To the best of my measuring abilities, it is 8". Or, within 1/16 of that, anyway. Hard to measure the center of a bolt head that big. I think when I do it, we're doing my dad's kubota too, so I should probably have him measure his just to be sure.

Thanks for the info. Awesome it's working well.

Not that I'm the best source for measurement advice... Don't measure to the center of the bolt, measure to the side of the bolt. As long as you are measuring from the same edge to the same edge (drivers side of the bolt to drivers side of the other bolt or what not) you have a good hard surface to measure to rather than guesstimating what is the center. Easier with round pins than a hex bolt head, but it should be close. If you are within 1/4" or so & want to go with an 8", you could just oversize the mounting holes a bit so there this some slop to eat up that extra distance at the end or beginning of the stroke.

It wouldn't surprise me if there was some variation between loaders of the same or similar model, much less different model loaders even from the same manufacturer.