Smooth loader bucket vs stump

[gladehound]

I wrestled with this stump for about a 90 minutes. Half of that was with pick and shovel to see what was holding it in. I learned that I need to dig much deeper than I thought. Never had a stump with a tap root like this one before.

 

[deezler]

time for a tooth bar, man!

 

[KiotiKowboy]

Bought myself a stump bucket ..

 

[4570Man]

That looks like a maple stump. A hickory has a Way bigger tap root. I like the FOPS in your tractor.

 

[gladehound]

I have always been a fan of tooth bars and am having one made for this tractor as I write. However, I was surprised that I noticed no deficiency in digging power without the tooth bar. Digging was really easy even in clay! Now I doo have a small bucket (65"). I could push the bucked right under the surface roots and it wouldn't stop until it hit the tap root. What the tooth bar will really help with is reinforcing that front bucket edge! (and all the other useful things those little fingers can do!) I bowed the bucket edge a little. loader is really strong. I asked my dealer to check that hydraulic pressure for the main system and loader were at the max allowable spec before delivery. I'm sure they are and maybe a little more because the loader will lift the rear of the tractor with me 250 pounds, FOPS 200 pounds, Rear blade 500 pounds, and 1000 pounds of fill in read tires! All together the rear must be over 4000 pounds and can still get it off the ground (maybe why I bowed the bucket).

I've been looking at stump buckets for a while and would love to have one. I like the really long ones that you can use basically as a pry bar on the loader (I realize the deficiencies of the extra length and thing the benefits outweigh them if you understand the physics)

 

[arrow]

Bought myself a stump bucket ..

View attachment 421075

KK how are these for digging shallow trenches if you've tried that?

 

[gladehound]

That looks like a maple stump. A hickory has a Way bigger tap root. I like the FOPS in your tractor.

No idea what kind of stump so I'll take your word for it. I do love having a FOPS in the woods!

 

[4570Man]

My tractor will lift the back up with the same kind of weight. The backhoe and subframe weigh almost 3,000 pounds. The fluid in the rear tires weighs 900 pounds. 4,000 pounds of ballast holds the rear down good, but the loaded tires and box blade isn't enough. How much is the loader on your tractor rated to lift?

 

[gladehound]

Bought myself a stump bucket ..

View attachment 421075

I was also wondering about how well this has worked for any tasked you have tried with it. I see the picture but which brand is this?

 

[KiotiKowboy]

KK how are these for digging shallow trenches if you've tried that?

I've done "some" digging with the bucket. It worked well where I was digging. I'd say my biggest limitation is needing more front-end weight to really get this thing shoved into hard/rocky ground. I suspect that problem affects all kinds of buckets.

Bear in mind, the bucket is wider in the rear than the front - so your trench will show that.

 

[KiotiKowboy]

I was also wondering about how well this has worked for any tasked you have tried with it. I see the picture but which brand is this?

Mine is a Titan. Do a quick check on Ebay and you can see a lot of varying designs and prices.

 

[4570Man]

Bought myself a stump bucket ..

<img src="http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/files/owning-operating/421075-smooth-loader-bucket-vs-stump-stumpbucket-jpg"/>

How does this work compared to a backhoe? I have a backhoe, but the loader pushes harder and lifts more.

 

[KiotiKowboy]

I don't have a backhoe - but .....

My thought would be a backhoe would be far more effective in most cases. Consider the the cost vs benefit of the two ... $600 vs $$$$$$$.

-edit-

My need was to tackle a bunch of 4"-6" stumps and a patch of surface rocks that were just too much work to tackle by hand. The stump bucket was a pretty good solution for me.

 

[nybirdman]

KK how are these for digging shallow trenches if you've tried that?

I had one;about useless!Can't see what you are doing,if you are digging a trench you have to straddle the trench and back out.Sold for half what I paid and was happy to get rid of it.

 

[arrow]

I've done "some" digging with the bucket. It worked well where I was digging. I'd say my biggest limitation is needing more front-end weight to really get this thing shoved into hard/rocky ground. I suspect that problem affects all kinds of buckets.

Bear in mind, the bucket is wider in the rear than the front - so your trench will show that.

Probably not the best tool for this then and nyBirdman seems to prove that out.. Thanks

 

[CalG]

I tried digging and pulling a couple of maple stumps not many years ago.

Lesson learned, A FEL is NO MATCH for a well anchored stump! ;-)

So I lashed together a simple A frame using a pair of 7 foot long 4X8 maple timbers and a few short lengths of chain.
When a chain is "pulled over" the A frame in such a way that the A frame goes over center. The stumps come up, or the ground around it get's pushed down.
So much easier going for the tractor this way.

I did "lengthen" a section of chain using this rig though ;-) ( It was probably non rated anyway)

 

[Xfaxman]

--------------------------------

I've been looking at stump buckets for a while and would love to have one. I like the really long ones that you can use basically as a pry bar on the loader (I realize the deficiencies of the extra length and thing the benefits outweigh them if you understand the physics)

I agree on the length and leverage, narrow is good too.

Blue Diamond is one of the best.

I sure like mine. :thumbsup:

 

[CalG]

The problem with that photo is

there is not a stone or rock maple root within 100 miles ;-)

 

[gladehound]

I agree on the length and leverage, narrow is good too.

Blue Diamond is one of the best. I sure like mine. :thumbsup:

View attachment 421267

I've been looking at the blue diamond stump bucket and others for about 6 months and agree it has the best design that I've seen for several reasons.

1. I looks like the first 2 feet of the bucket are an even width so you don't have the problem with trying to push a wedge into the dirt.
2. It's very long. So if you push the first 2 feet in under a stump or rock, you still have nearly 3 feet to the pivot pin. If you understand the physics of this you can generate a lot more lifting force. Let me explain: The bucket will be like a pry bar. With the tractor you lift the front off the ground to push down on the pivot point (don't use a counter weight on 3pt to get the most pressure on the pivot point). On my tractor the front end is ~3000 pounds at the front wheels so figure 2000 pounds at the pivot point. Since you have a 3:2 leverage on your pry bar (stump bucket) the weight of the tractor alone gives you 3000 pounds of lift at the bucket edge. Add to that whatever curl force your loader can generate at 24" past the pivot pins. For me that is in the neighborhood of 3000 pounds. So now I have 6000 pounds of lift force at the bucket edge which is double what I can get with a traditional bucket shoved 2 feet into the dirt. With the standard bucket, I was able to rip out the 18 inch diameter Maple with a 4 foot deep tap root in the first post. I imagine I could do a lot more with twice the lifting (prying) force.

I think that people who are down on stump buckets are down on them for a few reasons.

1. got a wedge shaped model (bad design)
2. got something slightly longer than standard bucket but not long enough to effectively use as a pry bar (reduces lift at bucket tip rather than increasing it)
3. started with a loader with poor curl performance to start with.

I have noticed that everyone who loves their stump bucket has a long narrow one and a big machine.

 

[Xfaxman]

The problem with that photo is

there is not a stone or rock maple root within 100 miles ;-)

Small stump, viewed from the seat in the V417.