Tractor Sizing How important is rear diff lock on CUT?

[TJP89]

The technology with HST is fine, but how well does it work in extreme cold? And also how is the power loss in the system?
Looked into it when buying new tractor, but the price difference was considerable, - and the determining factor.

My idea of extreme cold is double digit negative temps. NO issues with the HST there. Power loss? I haven't driven a CK35 shuttle so I don't know for sure if there is a loss, but I've never wanted for power, maybe traction, but not power. Price difference here is about 1K, negligible over the cost of a new machine, and well worth it even if it's not.

 

[jonnmero]

My idea of extreme cold is double digit negative temps. NO issues with the HST there. Power loss? I haven't driven a CK35 shuttle so I don't know for sure if there is a loss, but I've never wanted for power, maybe traction, but not power. Price difference here is about 1K, negligible over the cost of a new machine, and well worth it even if it's not.

Fair enough, but here the price difference would have been closer to 10K equivalent.

 

[vtsnowedin]

Both machines in the picture are hydrostatic drive as all the rollers behind them so there is no size limit on where a hydrostatic drive can be useful.

 

[vtsnowedin]

Also a 750 John Deere dozer among others is hydrostatic.
John Deere 750 Crawler Tractor

 

[SPYDERLK]

The technology with HST is fine, but how well does it work in extreme cold? And also how is the power loss in the system?
Looked into it when buying new tractor, but the price difference was considerable, - and the determining factor.

My idea of extreme cold is double digit negative temps. NO issues with the HST there. Power loss? I haven't driven a CK35 shuttle so I don't know for sure if there is a loss, but I've never wanted for power, maybe traction, but not power. Price difference here is about 1K, negligible over the cost of a new machine, and well worth it even if it's not.

I think the issues would be amply dealt with by a little up front prep using contact heat on the trans case and synthetic oil n the HST. The fact that the HST is less efficient is usually only important where your fuel costs are a deal breaker. Long term high force use like in plowing the soil would be better with gear. Greater fuel use ... and heat from losses could damage an HST that wasnt amply sized for the continuous drive hp required.

 

[Garandman]

I've used the differential lock quite a bit in the woods, makes a big difference.

Also a 750 John Deere dozer among others is hydrostatic.
John Deere*750*Crawler Tractor

And M1 Abrams tank steering - hydrostatic.

 

[k0ua]

I think the issues would be amply dealt with by a little up front prep using contact heat on the trans case and synthetic oil n the HST. The fact that the HST is less efficient is usually only important where your fuel costs are a deal breaker. Long term high force use like in plowing the soil would be better with gear. Greater fuel use ... and heat from losses could damage an HST that wasnt amply sized for the continuous drive hp required.

You won't get much argument from me on using a gear drive system for plowing. Not that I don't think hydro's can do it, and be safe and cooled properly for this task, but the question becomes why hydro for a plow tractor? None of its advantages will shine through, and its shortcomings as in the noted fuel usage would indicate a gear tractor to me.

 

[vtsnowedin]

Cold temperatures are not a problem for an HST beyond the usual getting the engine started and running issues common to all diesels used in the North. The hydraulic oil gets warmed up from being forced through the pumps and drive heads and could even be used to heat the cab if needed.

 

[jonnmero]

Cold temperatures are not a problem for an HST beyond the usual getting the engine started and running issues common to all diesels used in the North. The hydraulic oil gets warmed up from being forced through the pumps and drive heads and could even be used to heat the cab if needed.

In many respects it would be better for my use to have HST but for cost. One alternative to the Foton would have been a Kioti with HST, which also has diff lock, kioti ck35-hst/ but then there was the price difference! Even the occasional scraping in the shuttle is tolerable when compared.

 

[vtsnowedin]

In many respects it would be better for my use to have HST but for cost. One alternative to the Foton would have been a Kioti with HST, which also has diff lock, kioti ck35-hst/ but then there was the price difference! Even the occasional scraping in the shuttle is tolerable when compared.

Don't get me wrong. I am not advocating for HSTs over gear transmissions. I prefer Gears in most situations due to fuel efficiency and time proven designs. But some of the arguments against HSTs have little basis in fact and I prefer to debate the facts not the rumors.
For example I once worked a job where they were cutting out three feet of clay from a two to one cut slope on an interstate highway and back filling it with three feet of seven inch minus ledge. The John deer 750 Hydro. could work up and down the slope in the clay, stop, start , work sideways on a slant and push rock where needed. A Cat dozer with traditional gears and clutches could work straight up and down the slope but not side to side and once it stopped mid slope could not restart up mid slope and had to return all the way to the bottom. On the flat building fills and spreading base courses the Cat did more work per gallon of fuel but on that slope the 750 danced circles around it.

 

[TJP89]

Fair enough, but here the price difference would have been closer to 10K equivalent.

OK, HST is not worth 10K to me. I would have gone gear in that case.

 

[onelostdogg]

OP here. Just an update...I have 2.2 hours on my EX3200 and already got into a diff lock situation on some rutted ground. No regrets at all. . Thanks for the advice.

 

[SPYDERLK]

OP here. Just an update...I have 2.2 hours on my EX3200 and already got into a diff lock situation on some rutted ground. No regrets at all. . Thanks for the advice.

Trying to visualize. ... I anticipate split braking would have been more appropriate for that. Was steering involved? Side slope?
larry

 

[scoutcub]

QUOTE=onelostdogg;4213774]OP here. Just an update...I have 2.2 hours on my EX3200 and already got into a diff lock situation on some rutted ground. No regrets at all. . Thanks for the advice.[/QUOTE]

:thumbsup: :thumbsup:

 

[scoutcub]

Trying to visualize. ... I anticipate split braking would have been more appropriate for that. Was steering involved? Side slope?
larry

:stirthepot::hissyfit::muttering: :laughing::laughing::laughing:

 

[Fawken]

OK, this is an old thread, but for me diff lock has saved my arse more times than I can remember. Mind you my Ford is really small and didn't always have an FEL which has also gotten me out of some slimy, yucky, muck that I should not have ventured into in the 1st place. I've always imagined (right about the time I start sweating bullets) that big heavy, 4wd machines never get stuck and therefore don't need diff lock.

 

[vtsnowedin]

I've always imagined (right about the time I start sweating bullets) that big heavy, 4wd machines never get stuck and therefore don't need diff lock.

Imagination will get you in trouble someday. A bigger machine just needs a deeper snow drift or mud hole to get stuck in but there are plenty of big , really big mud holes out there.

 

[jonnmero]

Imagination will get you in trouble someday. A bigger machine just needs a deeper snow drift or mud hole to get stuck in but there are plenty of big , really big mud holes out there.

As pointed out, a bigger machine will just get you into bigger problems if you're not considering the limits of your equipment. And it is easier to get into a sticky situation when you think that all the different gadgets will always get you out.

 

[RalphVa]

Very important. Many times, you'll get one wheel out of contact with ground. Tractor won't go without diff lock then.

Ralph

 

[LD1]

Very important. Many times, you'll get one wheel out of contact with ground. Tractor won't go without diff lock then.

Ralph

It will go if you have split brakes