Is there a hydraulics primer?

   / Is there a hydraulics primer? #1  

Nelstomlinson

New member
Joined
Aug 28, 2014
Messages
21
Location
Juneau, AK
Tractor
Kubota/M4800SU
I want to learn about tractor hydraulics. Is there a primer somewhere that explains the controls and hydraulic circuits which are commonly used in tractors? I understand the basics of hydraulic systems; things like pressure * area=force and how flow rate translates into speed. What I'm lacking, I think, is an understanding of what sorts of control valves are available and how they are commonly used.
 
   / Is there a hydraulics primer? #2  
Im sure the internet is full of good reading on this subject. If not buy a hydraulic training book. I still have mine from college and look back on it every now and again for different stuff. Sometimes just ask on here if you need a little clarification on what works in the real world.
 
   / Is there a hydraulics primer? #3  
just ask on here if you need a little clarification on what works in the real world.
Ah, but without a basic primer first, many of us just confuse the situation by not knowing how to ask. :D

I'd like such a tractor-specific primer, too.
 
   / Is there a hydraulics primer? #4  
Here is a good general one: http://www.derijcke.com/dl/manual.pdf

I don't know of any just about tractors, but they are simple Open Center (most small to mid sized machine) or Closed Center (larger ag machines) systems.
 
   / Is there a hydraulics primer?
  • Thread Starter
#6  
Thanks, Kenny. That manual answers some of my questions. Maybe that will get me far enough along to come up with some more questions!
 
   / Is there a hydraulics primer? #7  
Come on now, I thought my replies were true to the fact and totally clear and succinct.

I try not to be wrong, and if I am, I will correct same and apologize.

If you can not find the data you want, just ask. There are many knowledgeable people here and on the Internet .

There are also many books, videos and CD's on hyd.

Many time you can ask the basic question on whatever in the search window, and generally find the answer.

I learn many thing just by reading the post that interest me and asking questions.
 
   / Is there a hydraulics primer? #8  
Thanks, Kenny. That manual answers some of my questions. Maybe that will get me far enough along to come up with some more questions!
Nelstomlinson, I also found this older thread here on TBN - mostly recommending John Deere educational stuff: http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/hydraulics/198400-book-hydraulics.html

JJ, hope I didn't get too personal mentioning you by name. I hold you in high esteem, you are rarely 'wrong'. But sometimes someone posts a picture of a valve assembly and you say "that is a 6-port valve" and all I can see is 4 lines... and I just know it is my lack of comprehension, not you saying the wrong thing. :laughing:
 
   / Is there a hydraulics primer? #9  
Im sure there are such things on youtube as well for visual learners like me.
 
   / Is there a hydraulics primer? #10  
Im sure there are such things on youtube as well for visual learners like me.
So, I tried a couple You Tube videos - some not bad. But the best I found so far was by an English guy - so the question arises...

Is a sub-plate and a manifold the same thing?

(if I needed an answer I would ask in the Hydraulics section here... this is more to point out why I need a basic primer) ;)
 
   / Is there a hydraulics primer? #11  
From a quick glance on what they are and what they are used for they are not one in the same. Manifolds can get pretty complicated and can have a whole hydraulic system all in one machined block. The subplates look like they are just what the name suggests, a plate for a control valve to mount to, I assume so you can actually hook fittings and such through it to use the valve as intended.
 
   / Is there a hydraulics primer?
  • Thread Starter
#12  
It might have been better to have posted this in the hydraulic forum, I guess. It wound up in build-it-yourself because I'm trying to figure out what I have to or need to do on my machine. When I get a little farther along, I'll post a schematic here with some questions. That army manual will be a huge help with that!
 
   / Is there a hydraulics primer? #13  
A manifold is a distribution device, and a subplate is a manifold for a solenoid valve.

A manifold can have different kind of valves attached, such as on/off valve, relief valve, solenoid valve, etc.

Manifold:

a pipe or chamber branching into several openings.
"the pipeline manifold"
"the exhaust manifold"
2.
technical
something with many different parts or forms, in particular.
 

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   / Is there a hydraulics primer? #14  
in ponding (back yard ponds) and aquiarums. a manifold is normally just a bunch of Tee's and valves. (plastic tees, and possible plastic or metal valves)

but when ya jump into hydrualics for tractors and pressures, it becomes a different world. more so with valves. your generic run of the mill valve you find at local hardware stores for, water, gas, and like. = no good. as in, physically not being able to open or close a valve.

hyd valves, have to pressure compensate, to make the valves real easy to move. and that is were the complication comes in, with all the "holes" that get drilled into manifold blocks, and valve bodies. simply taking a physical look at a valve body or manifold block, and you will get completely lost most likely. you don't really see the difference and what goes were, till ya look at a 3D drawing of a manifold or valve. though most companies downloadable 3D drawings stink. which then ya end up on "youtube" and searching for "animation hydrualic X" were x is a valve of some type or a manifold or some such.

my best suggestion, is get a pad and paper (myself use paint that comes with windows) and draw some stuff up, with simple on/off valves, like a kitchen sink, or garden hose. and start drawing in Tees and valves.
then draw in some connection rods to multi valves. so if you move one valve, another valve also moves (either open or close)

after ya do a few drawings above...
start moving valves closer together, so 2 valves are in same "manifold" or physical body.
then move on up to 3 and 4 and on up to 8 valves. all in a single motion. of one connecting rod, you open some valves and close others. and when ya move the connecting rod to all valves in opposite direciton, some valve close and others open.

once you get past the standard on/off valve for say a garden hose. and start to understand how a bathroom bathtub / shower combo work (water into bathtub valve, 1 cold valve, 1 hot valve, 1 shower head valve, 1 shower head on a hose (washing dogs) on a valve)

you can start moving into "spool valves" spool valves are the magic item in most hydrualic valves on tractors. though there are some poppet style valves used.

================
most of the big companies that sell valves and manifold blocks, just go download there brocheure for valves and manifold blocks, they normally give a huge PDF file, with a good amount of text, but not really a very detailed images of things and end up using a default schematic drawing symbols. again this is about time ya switch over to youtube and search for this or that, as ya follow through the type of valves and explanations.

================
what makes matters worse for folks when dealing with tractor valves, is normally there are pressure relief valves, power beyond ports, and extra features say, float or detent for a generic tractor valve, and ya don't simply start with an easy "on/off valve" but ya have a fairly advance valve to begin with. not to mention instead of a lever or 2 or 3, you may have a joystick, that complicates things even further.

and of course hydraulics has its own lingo... they simply do not state, "low pressure / tank" high pressure hyd cylinder, low pressure hyd cylinder, etc... they use A,B,C,D,T,P and possibly adding a number in there A1,A2,B1,B2, etc... to the letters.

and above is just for valves...
============
hyd pumps, hyd motors. that is a completely different subject all together. ya it gets a little daunting,
don't be afraid to hit some elementary school websites for simple math (doh) been there done that. and not remembering the yack yack bloody theorem of this or that.
 
   / Is there a hydraulics primer?
  • Thread Starter
#17  
Copperhead, that's really helpful. Thanks.
 
   / Is there a hydraulics primer? #18  
VICKERS Mobile Hydraulics Manual, would be a good book to start with, has 175 pages and includes lots of coloured diagrams.
 

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