DK45 FEL capacity issues?

[k0ua]

I am not bragging or anything about being a superior operator. (Ok maybe I am) but I pay attention to how the tractor is reacting and modulate the HST pedal to not load the engine down. I push in to the pile and let off of the pedal, curl and lift and then slightly drop the lift, and the upper portion of the pile that you cannot lift anyway will often break off and slide toward the nearly full bucket giving you a super filled bucket. It is harder to describe than do, but it is a coordinated movement of pedal/curl/lift for maximum load. I did not learn how to do this overnight or even for the first few years.. It took a lot of time to get good with a loader, and each tractor takes a different touch for optimal results. I don't really mean this a a brag guys, I am just saying that you get better at this loader game over a period of years.

James K0UA

 

[IslandTractor]

I am not bragging or anything about being a superior operator. (Ok maybe I am) but I pay attention to how the tractor is reacting and modulate the HST pedal to not load the engine down. I push in to the pile and let off of the pedal, curl and lift and then slightly drop the lift, and the upper portion of the pile that you cannot lift anyway will often break off and slide toward the nearly full bucket giving you a super filled bucket. It is harder to describe than do, but it is a coordinated movement of pedal/curl/lift for maximum load. I did not learn how to do this overnight or even for the first few years.. It took a lot of time to get good with a loader, and each tractor takes a different touch for optimal results. I don't really mean this a a brag guys, I am just saying that you get better at this loader game over a period of years.

James K0UA

You are right but it is still easy to stall when rushing or suddenly hit a patch of extra lush grass or anthill. Some of us just tolerate the occasional stall to keep RPMs at 1800 instead of full PTO. Not a good idea to stall regularly but once in a while is no big deal.

 

[Coyote machine]

Is stalling different than shutting the engine off via the keyswitch?

 

[IslandTractor]

Is stalling different than shutting the engine off via the keyswitch?

Yes, it is different. Frequent stalling means you are probably lugging the engine a lot which is bad for it. I don't know if sudden stalls cause any damage though it isn't a great idea.

The reason lugging is bad, AFAIK, is that it creates more strain on reciprocating parts and may reduce lubrication due to lower rpm of internal components.

Shutting an engine off with the key just cuts fuel supply. An alternative in some diesels is to release compression to stop the engine. My old Yanmar 3GM boat motor was stopped that way.

 

[Coyote machine]

So, are you saying that stalling at 1800 RPMs is worse than shutting it off at idle of 1000RPMs?
Not looking to argue, just understand the thinking about how reciprocating parts come into play in one instance and not the other....and how reduction of lubrication occurs.

 

[IslandTractor]

So, are you saying that stalling at 1800 RPMs is worse than shutting it off at idle of 1000RPMs?
Not looking to argue, just understand the thinking about how reciprocating parts come into play in one instance and not the other....and how reduction of lubrication occurs.

Stalling doesn't cause a problem with lubrication. Lugging might.

Stalling does put maximum pressure on internal components however (though presumably they are designed to handle it). Shutting off from idle is quite a different matter as the fuel is just shut off so the engine stops after a few revs made possible by flywheel inertia.

 

[Jesse masterson]

Don't really know your issue , but I can say from owning a Dk 45 power is not the problem , either you have mechanical issues or operator error, my Dk has never stalled( though I do have shuttle shift) if I am paying attention to the job at hand, I can understand blaming power and ability if you used to operating 100 hp tractors, the Dk is not, as I am not an Albert Einstein .

 

[sdef]

I am reporting back with my findings. It took me awhile to figure out the four different hydraulic couplings types- 1/2" ISO 5675 (Ag- rear remotes), 1/2" ISO 16028 (skid steer flat face at the grapple), 3/8 ISO 7241-1 series A (joystick-FEL disconnects) and ISO 7241-1 series B (WR Long 3rd function FEL disconnects).

The Kioti shop manual specifies 2702 PSI at the rear remotes at maximum throttle (2850 RPM on mine). Test data:

1000 RPM- 2300 PSI
1500 RPM- 2300 PSI
2000 RPM- 2400 PSI
2500 RPM- 2500 PSI
2850 RPM- 2600 PSI

For some reason I was thinking I would be getting maximum hydraulic pressure at 2000 RPM, which is not true per my data. The 5000 PSI gauge accuracy is 2.5% at full reading. So I assume the gauge is accurate at my test PSI and my relief is set a little low. Now I need to figure out how to increase the relief pressure. Does anyone have any first hand experience with Kioti DK tractor hydraulics?

I also measured all four outputs at the joystick-FEL couplings and they had similar pressure reading between the tested 1000 RPM - 2000 RPM. I did not test them at any higher RPM.

The 3' long, 1/4", 5800 PSI hose extension for the gauge is a valuable addition, as it allows me to test any coupling location and still view the gauge from the tractor seat. I also have a 18" long, 3/8", 5000 PSI hose to use as an extension, should that be necessary, along with the couplings and fittings that may be needed.

 

[IslandTractor]

What did that testing rig cost you altogether?

 

[murphy1244]

Nice Rig, where did you buy it?

 

[SSdoxie]

The relief valve is in the FEL control valve by the inlet pipe. It has an adjustment screw with a jam nut. Loosen the jam and turn screw in to increase pressure. Turn it about 1/4 turn at a time then retest pressure until you get correct setting.

 

[MotorSeven]

Good info...keep it coming!

 

[sdef]

What did that testing rig cost you altogether?

I have a lot more in it than necessary as I jumped the gun and ordered the wrong fittings the first time around and would purchase a few other things differently. Plus I had to pay relatively expensive shipping multiple times. It could also be built less expensively if only used as a dead head device. But I wanted to build one that could be used as dead head or operational pass through, to cover all bases. And also the reason I ordered couplings for all types on my tractor.

The only design change I would make is to use a gauge with a back mount fitting instead of the bottom mount. This would allow use of a 90 degree swivel that seems to swivel independently in place when installed. I am currently using a straight swivel from Northern Tool who's position can only be adjusted by loosening the fitting- moving the swivel and then re-tightening.

Pricing listed below is what I could build another one for with my new found experience level. Most of the items came from Discount Hydraulic hose, except the hoses which were from Amazon.

Basic pricing now I have built one and know what fittings to use:

36" Abbott 1/4" 5800 PSI hose: $17.10 (4000 PSI versions are less expensive at many places)

Bottom mount 5000 PSI gauge: liquid filled: $17.31
3/8" T fitting: $7.90
Each pair of ISO hydraulic couplings: ~$17 - $20 (ISO 16028 coupling pairs are more like $75)
Swivel fitting: $13.30
Misc. fittings, adapters, etc: $35 - $50
Shipping: $15.00+

 

[sdef]

Nice Rig, where did you buy it?

Made it. Posted price info on a different post. When I put this together, I decided to use Permatex hydraulic pipe dope instead of the yellow Teflon-type tape I usually use, as quite a few knowledgeable folks in TBN hydraulics recommend dope/liquid vs. tape, although it was not this particular brand. I have never had any problems using Teflon tape. I had nothing but trouble with this pipe dope and small leaks- nothing that would effect pressure readings though, and now have to take it all apart and reinstall with tape. Grrrr....

 

[IslandTractor]

I have a lot more in it than necessary as I jumped the gun and ordered the wrong fittings the first time around and would purchase a few other things differently. Plus I had to pay relatively expensive shipping multiple times. It could also be built less expensively if only used as a dead head device. But I wanted to build one that could be used as dead head or operational pass through, to cover all bases. And also the reason I ordered couplings for all types on my tractor.

The only design change I would make is to use a gauge with a back mount fitting instead of the bottom mount. This would allow use of a 90 degree swivel that seems to swivel independently in place when installed. I am currently using a straight swivel from Northern Tool who's position can only be adjusted by loosening the fitting- moving the swivel and then re-tightening.

Pricing listed below is what I could build another one for with my new found experience level. Most of the items came from Discount Hydraulic hose, except the hoses which were from Amazon.

Basic pricing now I have built one and know what fittings to use:

36" Abbott 1/4" 5800 PSI hose: $17.10 (4000 PSI versions are less expensive at many places)

Bottom mount 5000 PSI gauge: liquid filled: $17.31
3/8" T fitting: $7.90
Each pair of ISO hydraulic couplings: ~$17 - $20 (ISO 16028 coupling pairs are more like $75)
Swivel fitting: $13.30
Misc. fittings, adapters, etc: $35 - $50
Shipping: $15.00+

Thanks. That is very helpful.

 

[sdef]

The relief valve is in the FEL control valve by the inlet pipe. It has an adjustment screw with a jam nut. Loosen the jam and turn screw in to increase pressure. Turn it about 1/4 turn at a time then retest pressure until you get correct setting.

Thanks Dennis. I will look around there. But there is not much room to view or adjust if it is located anywhere other than on the bottom of the FEL control valve.

 

[SSdoxie]

It's on back side/rear of the valve. Easy access.

 

[sdef]

View attachment 347143

It's on back side/rear of the valve. Easy access.

Perfect. Thanks.

Greg

 

[k0ua]

Perfect. Thanks.

Greg

while you're down there making that adjustment take a look at the metallic pipe coming into the banjo bolt into the side of the valve. This summer I have that bolt loosen up and I lost a couple gallons of fluid in a couple seconds that's the feed coming from the pump check it out And put a wrench on it.

James K0UA

 

[GMIslander]

I am not bragging or anything about being a superior operator. (Ok maybe I am) but I pay attention to how the tractor is reacting and modulate the HST pedal to not load the engine down. I push in to the pile and let off of the pedal,

What he said. Question how much increasing the presure by 100 psi will help.
I've stalled mine a couple of times but technique is something learned.