Subsoiler adventure

[daugen]

Had a great deal of fun ripping up a field in prep for a garden. The ETA/Fred Cain subsoiler is very heavy duty and worked fine. Likely I need some adjustments to the three point hitch to fine tune. Would like it to raise up higher but also go lower but I think I'm limited by the range of motion of the tractor hydraulics. This little 25 hp tractor pulled it fine, though it would have worked a lot better with 4wd. Had to step on the diff lock a few times to get myself unstuck, but I expected that. Rocky clay soil. Seemed to have patches of rocks, and other areas I just zipped through. The ETA video is right on, if you aren't hitting too many rocks, you hardly leave a trail if you run the tire over it on the next pass. Not sure I can figure out how to lay plastic pipe with it yet.

Now I plow this bumpity garden and rough it up even more with a middle buster-potato plow, and then I rototill with my pull behind DR Rototiller behind my Gravely. The Gravely weighs half the weight of the tractor, so my thought is tread lightly on the final pass.

I'm thinking I'll use the little potato plow to make furrows for corn, but on a garden this small, probably just as easy to do it by hand. If all grows well, the garden will probably double in size next year.

The subsoiler did its job beautifully, and I'm glad I bought the heavier duty one, because it became quickly clear that nothing I hit in this field was going to faze this subsoiler one bit. Stop the tractor yes, bother the plow, no.

So this is an update on the Happy Ending thread. Drew

 

[rockshaft]

Excellent. How deep were you able to rip with that set-up?
I'm planning on fabricating one of those, probably not as heavy duty- we'll see.

 

[daugen]

looking at the worn off paint, I'd say I was 12-14 inches down, not the max 18.
I'm going to fiddle with the links and try to get it lower. Sometimes it would sort of suck itself down lower and other times it would ride higher. Sometimes it skidded on the surface of the field grass before biting in too. Again, not sure of my adjustments, but once it started to dig in, it usually stayed in.

I'll probably have another go at it though I've really accomplished what I wanted which is to get down a little deeper than I have any chance at plowing.
The land slopes off in two directions, so first I went one way, then I went at an angle down the other slope. Probably drains fine anyway, but I thought a little aeration and decompaction would do a lot of good.

I think I may have the piece with the mfg name on it upside down, now that I look at the pics. Not sure it makes a difference though. If it does, I hope someone chimes in.

 

[whirly]

... I think I may have the piece with the mfg name on it upside down, now that I look at the pics. Not sure it makes a difference though. If it does, I hope someone chimes in.

You have the working ends right. Just rotate it 180 degrees so the name in the photo is on the left side and Fred Cain will be happy:thumbsup:

 

[daugen]

thanks, that makes sense to me. No one wants to ride around upside down...

 

[GPintheMitten]

Looks good.

This just a guess, but it seems to me, that if you shorten your top link, the angle will change to be more upright than as you have it, and it might pull itself deeper.

 

[cttractor]

I, too, pull a subsoiler with a small (24HP) tractor and it does it quite well. I do have MFWD and it does make it better. However, the main limitation will be rocks. Hit some bigger ones and we'll stop dead, even with all wheels pulling. It's just a matter of the size of the rock(s). For that reason, I pull slowly. I don't want a big rock to stop me dead and break something on the tractor because of the inertia of moving too quickly.

As for limited range of hydraulic motion, I have the same problem that you mention. Other than shortening the length of the device's shank, I haven't found any other option -- we live with it or we modify it.

If I adjust the 3PH for full height, I get about 3 inches of ground clearance. That's not a lot and I'm very careful when driving onto or off my driveway so I don't take a chunk out. If I want to plow deeper, I have to adjust the 3PH down lower. I wish there were a better way, but small tractors don't seem to have as much hydraulic range as we would like for one of these devices. However, used within their limits, I am happy with how well the subsoiler has worked for me.

 

[daugen]

shorten your top link,
thanks, I'm going to try that. My dealer gave me a freebie top link and it doesn't seem to adjust very far. And I haven't used a three point hitch before so I'm learning. I put the top link on the lowest hole of three, or furthest away, now I'll take whatever other slack is in there hopefully out. But not sure it's going to get me much. Would extending the side links help? Not much adjustment left there either.
I plow slow
second gear, low range, about 2000 rpm or less, have to throttle up when going uphill for sure. But I was happy to bump, bump along slowly, as you say, making sure nothing expensive gives out first.

 

[GPintheMitten]

Do your bottom 2 links go to the ground with no implement on? If so, I think you may be able to get deeper by adjustments.

 

[Baby Grand]

<snip>

As for limited range of hydraulic motion, I have the same problem that you mention. Other than shortening the length of the device's shank, I haven't found any other option -- we live with it or we modify it.

If I adjust the 3PH for full height, I get about 3 inches of ground clearance. That's not a lot and I'm very careful when driving onto or off my driveway so I don't take a chunk out. If I want to plow deeper, I have to adjust the 3PH down lower. I wish there were a better way, but small tractors don't seem to have as much hydraulic range as we would like for one of these devices. However, used within their limits, I am happy with how well the subsoiler has worked for me.

My transport solution - allows you to adjust hitch for full depth subsoiling in the field and then drive back to the shed without ripping up a gouge in the lawn, driveway, and everything else in between:

 

[rambler]

Typically a 3pt has the top link vertically straight up from the bottom links. For some reason Fred tipped the top link connector out forward a lot.

That will do some interesting things on rotating the point as you raise & lower the thing.

I'm working it out in my head as to what.... But the point at the bottom will follow an arc, with that configuration, as you raise & lower it.

That angled flat point at the bottom will help suck the chisel down into the ground, keep it down. Changing the angle of it (by moving the top link) will change how much it wants to pull down, or rise back up.

If you put in a longer bolt on the bottom behind the point, and put a clevis the bolt as well, you can pull a pipe along behind - attach to the clevis. Never had a need to burry anything only 15 inches deep, so never got a 3pt chisel, but looking at yours, always wanted one, might have to look up their order info - I remember where you got yours.

Thanks for the pics, neat. Your tractor has good tires on it, those make up for the lack of front wheel assist, nice square high lugs.

--->Paul

 

[The It]

Had a great deal of fun ripping up a field in prep for a garden. The ETA/Fred Cain subsoiler is very heavy duty and worked fine...The subsoiler did its job beautifully, and I'm glad I bought the heavier duty one...So this is an update on the Happy Ending thread. Drew

I didn't see what happened before they removed the original thread. You seem happy with how it all worked out. I'm glad to see you posting and getting some good community support. All the best.

 

[daugen]

If you put in a longer bolt on the bottom behind the point, and put a clevis the bolt as well, you can pull a pipe along behind - attach to the clevis

I'm not visualizing this too well; do you lay the pipe out in front of the tractor?
Or does someone walk along and kind of feed it in? Wonder if anyone YouTubed this. I have a friend who wants me to try laying some small plastic pipe with this so I really do need to understand this. thanks.

 

[cttractor]

My transport solution - allows you to adjust hitch for full depth subsoiling in the field and then drive back to the shed without ripping up a gouge in the lawn, driveway, and everything else in between:
View attachment 255747

Interesting solution! I'll have to try it to see if it can work on my tractor. I don't know whether or not it will rotate forward and clear everything or if there will be an obstruction.

Thanks for sharing!

 

[cttractor]

If you put in a longer bolt on the bottom behind the point, and put a clevis the bolt as well, you can pull a pipe along behind - attach to the clevis. --->Paul

I'm not visualizing this too well... Wonder if anyone YouTubed this. I have a friend who wants me to try laying some small plastic pipe with this so I really do need to understand this. thanks.

Yeah; I need to see this to better understand it also. Do you have a photo or simple drawing that might explain what you mean, Rambler? Thanks!

 

[xtn]

Paul is describing a method of burying pipe by dragging it into the ground behind the unit. As you drive forward, the pipe would be snaking into the ground at the original insertion point. This method should work fine for limited distances. The pipe is being dragged through the ground for the length of your pull.

The other method is feeding the pipe at the unit's location as you drive forward. In this cast you might lay the pipe out in front of you, maybe off to the side a bit, and it enters the ground as you go through a larger diameter feed pipe attached to the back of the unit. This feed pipe would usually start vertically above ground and have a 90 degree bend facing the rear down at chisel level. This would be better for longer distances as the pipe behind you isn't being dragged through the ground its whole length.

 

[daugen]

ok, the guide tube makes sense, not sure I wanted my hands in there....I suppose I could temporarily plastic/wire tie the guide tube in just above ground level. I sure don't want to drill that fat piece of steel, but if I did enough of this, it would be worth it to make an on-off bracket. Am wondering how you get the pipe started.

So, 50 or 100 feet, you drag it from the rear, or feed it from the side, slowly I'm sure. And if longer, it goes out front? I think I'll experiment with some old pipe in a field before I guinea pig my friend's back yard. Thanks for all suggestions here.

 

[cttractor]

XTN, thanks for explaining! I've installed underground cable with my subsoiler before, but not pipe. For the cable, I've attached a piece of 1.5" conduit to the back of the subsoiler (see drawing). The cable is first laid out on the ground along the intended path. At the starting point, enough cable is pre-routed through the conduit, out the bottom, and tied to some strong point near, but beyond the ground entry point. That can be a building, a stake, or a heavy piece of a equipment (another tractor, a weight box, a box blade, etc.) You just don't want the starting end of the cable to be dragged along with you.

To start, you drop the subsoiler into the ground and it starts to dig while paying out the cable behind it. The cable goes in the top of the conduit which it facing forward and slightly to the side the cable is on. It helps if there's a person walking along beside the tractor and feeding/guiding the cable into the conduit. Within a couple of feet of lateral movement, the cable should be at the intended depth (10 - 15 inches) and you're installing it as you move along.

The beauty of this approach is that the cable is automatically installed and there's almost no backfilling to do because the soil falls back onto the cable and even the sod falls back on top. Just drive over the trench after you've laid the cable and you're done. And unless you hit an obstruction, (e.g. a big rock), you can lay 300 feet of able in 5 - 10 minutes -- it's fast! Drive over the trench once and the cable's is buried. It works great!

I don't know if you can use this method to bury pipe. But if the conduit or guide is big enough and the pipe you're laying is flexible enough (e.g. 3/4 - 1" PVC pipe), it just might work.

I hope this helps at least give you some ideas, Daugen.

 

[Dishpointer]

This is an example of plowing pipe. The machine is this video is a vibratory plow but your subsoiler will work as well. A simple hole and a cable finger (Chinese finger cuff) will hold your pipe as it gets pulled through the hole.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HEbmy2xmdxI]Ditch Witch 410 Pipe Pull - YouTube[/ame]

 

[The It]

Daugen:

Thanks for the pm about how the issue was resolved amicably without any remuneration asked for or given. It's too bad they removed the original thread immediately, because Ted's response deserved to have sufficient airtime to demonstrate to the many community members who read the thread that you were happy with it.

Happy plowing!