Compact tractor advice please

[bruceha2000]

It sounds like the snow removal is an immediate concern. Can you hire that out for this winter, and make the tractor decisions in the spring?

That would depend on what the lady with the horses needs and when she needs it. She comes before work but I don't know what time that is. Will find out soon Add to that the need to leave the house by 5 AM 4 mornings a week. Would need a RELIABLE early bird who would be careful around the fences and 130+ Y/O barns. This isn't just a driveway thing. Though I have to say, the idea of getting up early enough to do the minimum required snow removal in time to leave by 5 doesn't seem pleasant.

As to a backhoe, rentals around here are $250 day/$750/week. And that is for the real deal, a Deere 310- 4x4 ext. hoe, 93 HP. It can do more in an hour than the "toy" ones can do in a week.[/

Quick web check locally - I see that they are available, but no prices. Of course I know as much about real backhoes as I do about tractors I don't suppose they expect you to prove any ability before they rent to you I imagine if I had my act together and planned everything out, much could be done in not too many days.

 

[DAY]

I don't suppose they expect you to prove any ability before they rent to you

Hey, have you been watching the debates?:laughing::laughing:

 

[Chilly807]

The more you tell us, the more expensive it's getting.. have you noticed that :laughing:

I have about 250 feet of actual driveway, plus parking area for the barn and cars in front of the house. The L3400 with bucket and rear blade takes about three passes to plow the driveway, plus a few more passes to clean it up. That's 4wd with rear ice chains, so there's no struggling to get through moderate drifts, not much wasted time. You soon learn to do it in a definite pattern, otherwise you spend more time and waste fuel.

Before the barn addition this year, clearing out after a "normal" storm took me about 1/2 hour if I was serious about getting it done. I expect the barn will nearly double my time, so if I wanted to be out the door by 5 AM, I'm looking at getting up at 3 AM, getting dressed for snow while the tractor is warming up, then spending an hour plowing out. Allowing a few minutes to put machinery away, I'd be scampering around jamming some breakfast in and then getting changed to go to work. A serious dump of snow takes a little longer, and a bad Nor'easter is another thing altogether.

If your area is as large as I think it is, Jay is right, don't even consider the B series Kubotas. In fact, the L series may be on the light side for Vermont snow unless you have some more time. You may want to look at the MX series simply because the job would get done faster. More HP, bigger bucket, etc.

A snow blower will help a lot, you only move the snow once if you plan ahead. Front mount blowers on bigger tractors eat up cash in a hurry, rear mounts are more reasonable, but you have to get what you personally need to do the job.


The price jump between B to L to MX isn't as steep as some think if you take it one step at a time. Personally, for what you have planned overall, the B isn't really an option except for a second machine to tidy up with. I have a smaller operation than you do, and the L3400 is as small as I'd want to go. I'm only speaking to the Kubota line-up, since that's the one I'm most familiar with.

Do you have any plans for hay supply, since there are horses involved? If you need to buy and move round bales, you need to pay close attention to lift capacity on the loader. A typical round bale of horse hay will run from 600 to 1000 lbs depending on size and density, and that's a serious handful for a compact tractor. We use square bales only, but can handle small rounds if we had to.

Sean

 

[bruceha2000]

You're barking up the wrong tree with almost all of the tractors listed. 'B' sized Kubotas are too small for you. Get an 'L' frame tractor, and shoot for 35-40HP. Also, prices listed for the used machines are high across the board. I think you might be able to get new for just a few thousand more - a friend of mine just bought an L3400 w/ loader for $18k delivered. Negotiate hard if you are interested in any of these machines.

I have not NECESSARILY tossed the idea of new but figured it was going to be BIG $$ and maybe something used might work out. I just listed all the 4WD HSTs I found on the Vermont Craig's list recognizing the small ones were probably too small. If there is nothing suitable on Craig's I don't plan to buy one of them just because that is "all there is". I'm sure stuff comes and goes and I can expand west and south, etc.

And thanks for your comment, the purpose of the original post was to have you KNOWLEDGEABLE people shoot holes in the "no way" tractors based on size and/or price because I don't know enough to know what I don't know.
I see the local Kubota dealer has a 2009 L3400HST with loader on their web site for $14,950. Doesn't say how many hours. Like I said, I've only had time to hit the Massey dealer last Thurs (and nothing has shown up in my email yet). Hope to hit others soon.

 

[bruceha2000]

The more you tell us, the more expensive it's getting.. have you noticed that :laughing:

Isn't that pretty much the way it ALWAYS is?

If your area is as large as I think it is, Jay is right, don't even consider the B series Kubotas. In fact, the L series may be on the light side for Vermont snow unless you have some more time.

In my favor is the 'lack' of driveway. If you look at the picture on the first post, you can see that the house and barns are close to the road, it is only about 100' road to barn. I figure I only NEED to get a path from the road to the house and barns plus whatever is needed for the horses before 5. I can skip the north entrance to the parking area all winter if I like. The wife can do more if needed when she gets back about 9 AM. I shouldn't have ALL the fun!!

A snow blower will help a lot, you only move the snow once if you plan ahead.

That is part of my reasoning, move it once, blow it where you want. No damage to the fences or foundations and no piles to move later or wing.

Do you have any plans for hay supply, since there are horses involved?

My understanding is she takes care of the horses AND all fences related to them 100%. I'm guessing she has square bales delivered to the barn since she would have no way to move anything larger. There wasn't any hay when we looked at the house (July/Aug) but she has only 2 horses and a pony on about 4 acres of pasture so I guess they get enough out there in the summer.

 

[bruceha2000]

Massey quote just in:

2011 MF 1532 HST, L100 loader with 60" skidsteer bucket. Includes tire loading and delivery, not tax/title. $18,850

RF6000 finish mower $3,435 - yeah, I know, we are still figuring out if a tractor of this size is too big for mowing a small lawn. If that is the case, probably get a hog for the fields instead but either can wait for spring.

10" Meteor 3PT blower $2,950. I replied asking for a front blower price (plus mid PTO if not standard) so I can compare to other dealer's offers.

 

[Grandad4]

RF6000 finish mower $3,435 - yeah, I know, we are still figuring out if a tractor of this size is too big for mowing a small lawn. If that is the case, probably get a hog for the fields instead but either can wait for spring.

For that price, it's either made from some kind of precious metal or it's a really big one. Kidding aside, that's very pricey for such a mower. You could buy a pretty nice riding mower for that money, which would probably be better suited to your mowing situation anyways, based on that picture.

 

[RoyJackson]

For that price, it's either made from some kind of precious metal or it's a really big one. Kidding aside, that's very pricey for such a mower. You could buy a pretty nice riding mower for that money, which would probably be better suited to your mowing situation anyways, based on that picture.

Yeah...that is at least 30% too much for what I think is a 60" mower.

 

[bruceha2000]

Yeah...that is at least 30% too much for what I think is a 60" mower.

Very good point made by both you and Grandad4. Have to keep remembering to look at the forest AND the trees.

If tractor mower is cheap (but well built) - buy it. But if as much or more than a purpose designed riding mower that would be easier to handle on a house lawn (i.e., not golf course fairway) it makes no sense at all.

Signed all the papers yesterday - now prior owner says he has a Kubota 22 HP BX series. Like you, he said to buy something bigger. Clearly his wife thinks he doesn't need it any more, went from 26 acres to 1/2 acre (which includes the house and 3 bay garage). He says he has a lot of snow to clear, she says he has a snow blower
Guess she doesn't understand you can take a man off the farm but you can't take him off his tractor!

 

[dodge man]

I'd say the most important thing to do is set a budget. As is the case in so many of these posts, people are pulling you in all sorts of directions. It all comes down to money. How much are you willing to spend?

Someone said to look at Kubota L series. "A friend got a L3400 for 18K." Add a front mount snow blower, a backhoe, some kind of mower and look at that price. The nice thing about the Kubota website is you can build the tractor on line and see how much it will cost brand new list price.

I have no doubt you could get a lot of work done with a BX tractor on your place. I also have no doubt you could get even more work done with a Kubota M series tractor on your place, it all comes down to budget.

 

[kiotiken]

When you're looking for all the pieces that you are, I agree with many here, new is probably the best bet. Everything on your list is going to be way more than you want to spend on a used tractor once you get it set up as you described.

I also agree that the BX and B series tractors are too small for you. They're great at what they do for the jobs they were meant to do, but it sounds like you need something a little bigger and capable.

After shopping everything I could find within a reasonable distance to my place, my list was whittled down to the Kubota L3200 and the Kioti CK 30, both HST, both with BH. In the end, I went with Kioti because I felt it had more features, was physically bigger and heavier, was more capable and the dealer was willing to work with me to take my JD on trade and get the deal done.

The snowblower is the big one for you IMO. You seem stuck on the front blower, which is fine, but you also seem to have your eye on the bottom line, as we all do. Those two don't go well together, you'll spend $6K on a front blower vs $2.5K on a rear blower. Have you considered an inverse rear blower? That would still allow you to drive forward and allow you to get right up to a barn/shop/house. You can always knock down a big mess at the end of the driveway with the FEL. Also, a CUT under 40-45 hp will only handle up to a 60" blower (there are some 62" and 68" blowers that may work), and those are in much shorter demand when you're looking for used.

 

[bruceha2000]

Have you considered an inverse rear blower? That would still allow you to drive forward and allow you to get right up to a barn/shop/house. You can always knock down a big mess at the end of the driveway with the FEL.

I just saw those online recently - they are the ones that are 'front facing' tow behinds?

I was wondering how well they work on the snow you pack with the tires before the blower gets to it. Have some dumb@ss thoughts about little front mount 'blades' that angle in front of the front tires enough to funnel the snow either outside the tires (inc rears) or under the tractor so the tires wouldn't pack it to ice.

 

[kiotiken]

Well, I have to admit, I don't have an inverse blower, YET. There's no question that's what I'll do once the wife cools down enough from me buying the new tractor.

You have it right though, you do drive over it before it reaches the blower. I currently use a rear blade to clear snow. It can't weigh more than 200 lbs (I'm guessing less) because two of us easily lifted it up into the bed of a pickup. I have no problem at all with snow packing down, not being cleared and turning to ice. I have a paved driveway, and it stays clear and ice free all winter. The extra weight of a blower would make it that much better at scraping the snow that you drive over.

I'm in Ottawa and we get tons of snow. The snow contractors who do residential driveways (very big business here) only use inverse snowblowers. They are using 90+ hp tractors with 96" or 102" blowers, but I've seen them clear a long laneway with 12" of snow without slowing down.

If you do consider a used inverse snowblower, they seem to be VERY hard to find in the 60"-68" range, which is all a 35hp tractor will handle. They seem to come up more frequently in the 72" range. New, I've been quoted in the $3K - $3.5K range vs $2K - $2.5K range for the regular rear blower, but Canadian prices are usually a lot higher. They are still almost half the cost of a front blower from the prices I've seen.

 

[Dr_Zinj]

Don't get too hung up on tires. Turff's will do just fine in the woods.

I wouldn't be too sure of that. Being a New Englander myself, I know what the woods can be like. Lots of rocks and boulders, lots of downed logs, all wet and slippery. Nothing at all like the woods in Europe where they look like people come and sweep them on a weekly basis.

Turfs are about the most delicate of tires you can use. They don't like rolling over hard, sharp, pointy rocks; and do best on level, groomed fields with guys carrying a bag with clubs and banging a little white ball around for hours.

And trying to get traction on wet greasy rocks and logs with turfs is a non-starter unless you spend $$ for chains.

 

[LD1]

I wouldn't be too sure of that. Being a New Englander myself, I know what the woods can be like. Lots of rocks and boulders, lots of downed logs, all wet and slippery. Nothing at all like the woods in Europe where they look like people come and sweep them on a weekly basis.

Turfs are about the most delicate of tires you can use. They don't like rolling over hard, sharp, pointy rocks; and do best on level, groomed fields with guys carrying a bag with clubs and banging a little white ball around for hours.

And trying to get traction on wet greasy rocks and logs with turfs is a non-starter unless you spend $$ for chains.

I agree:thumbsup:

 

[RoyJackson]

I wouldn't be too sure of that. Being a New Englander myself, I know what the woods can be like. Lots of rocks and boulders, lots of downed logs, all wet and slippery. Nothing at all like the woods in Europe where they look like people come and sweep them on a weekly basis.

Turfs are about the most delicate of tires you can use. They don't like rolling over hard, sharp, pointy rocks; and do best on level, groomed fields with guys carrying a bag with clubs and banging a little white ball around for hours.

And trying to get traction on wet greasy rocks and logs with turfs is a non-starter unless you spend $$ for chains.

I agree too...I have turfs and I couldn't get up a fairly mild slope (15 degrees) with wet leaves under me. That was in 4WD, BTW.
So, the OP has got it from three TBNers...stay out of the woods with turfs (or art least be prepared to tow your tractor).

 

[DAY]

Turfs are NOT the first choice, but if they come with the (used) tractor, so be it. Someone here said the ones on my 850 are "1970's style". They spend lots of time in the woods, and I haven't gotten stuck (yet)
My right heel knows exactly where the dif lock is, though:laughing:

 

[MrSteve]

Turfs are NOT the first choice, but if they come with the (used) tractor, so be it. Someone here said the ones on my 850 are "1970's style". They spend lots of time in the woods, and I haven't gotten stuck (yet)
My right heel knows exactly where the dif lock is, though:laughing:

I would say they are great, look how that tractor is hugging the side of that hill

 

[bruceha2000]

It all comes down to money. How much are you willing to spend?

Someone said to look at Kubota L series. "A friend got a L3400 for 18K." Add a front mount snow blower, a backhoe, some kind of mower and look at that price. The nice thing about the Kubota website is you can build the tractor on line and see how much it will cost brand new list price.

Money? You need MONEY to buy a tractor?
I went to the local Kubota dealer yesterday. Like some of you, he went with the "forget the backhoe, too expensive" thought process. This place happens to rent a lot of equipment. He said they rent big excavators for $2,500 a MONTH delivered and picked up. They have weekly rates of course but he was giving an example for my argument of having a backhoe when you have time. So, yeah, if you plan your projects, it does seem like the $8K for the backhoe is pretty expensive. Gotta love a salesman who says DON'T give me your money. :thumbsup:

As I went into the store, I passed a BX. You all are right. I'm sure it is a great machine for mowing and blowing, but it would look like a grasshopper out in the fields and up in the woods. He also skipped over the B's for the same reason. So, yep up to the L's. But since I want a front blower, it has to be a Grand, can't get a mid PTO on the other L's. He had a 3240 (after passing more Bx's and B's) in the parking lot so I could see it, sit on it, get explanations for everything, etc. He quoted a 'their price' for the Grand L3240, quick attach loader and front blower at (ouch) $31K. By comparison, the Massey salesman came back with a front blower setup - 1532 instead of the 1533 ('cause he has one on the lot so I can drive it he says) Tractor, quick attach loader with 63" front blower installed for $24K. That is a lot of change between the two. Don't know if the 1532 is 'equivalent' to the Grand 3240 or even if the 1533 is (nor pricing on the 1533). And maybe the 1532 can do what I want and maybe it can't. Need to look at the specs for everything. Need to sit on the 1532 (it was near closing and dark when I went to Massey), didn't see a 1533. And of course there are the other brand dealers to visit.

I guess I am making progress. I do have the land now and am learning about tractors. Thanks all!

 

[DAY]

I guess I am making progress. I do have the land now and am learning about tractors. Thanks all![/QUOTE]

I think you are now well enough that you no longer need to attend our daily group therapy sessions:thumbsup:

On a more serious note, it sounds like you have a good dealership/salesman there. See if you can talk him into a used "loaner" to try out on your property, or at least rent one for a week, and put some hours on it, at various tasks. Kind of like dating, before marriage. . .:laughing: