Fencing Help

[chi6488]

Ok, so I am new to all this farming and property owning stuff.

I plan to do some fencing work. 3 board fencing.

Do I use round or square posts? I prefer square posts b/c they are easier to nail baords to.

What size auger bit should I get? I plan to get the 3 point auger attachment at TSC but don't want to buy the wrong size auger bit and have to buy a second one.

I think I will use 4x4 posts if square and round 6" posts.

I see this black stuff on the fencing also. What brand or type should I buy?

 

[Smallplot]

You can use either square or round posts but have you thought of the half rounds?

As far as what size auger to get that will all depend on what size post you will be using. I would suggest getting a auger 6 inches larger (minimum) in diameter than your post for several reasons. The larger the better.

* One, The larger hole you make the easier it is to "fine tune" the post before you set it.
* Two, The larger the hole, the less precise you have to be when you initially locate and drill it.
* Three, The larger hole will allow you access while tamping the dirt around the post while back filling the hole giving you a solid and sturdy post set.
* Four, Make sure you dig deep enough to get below the frost line.


Sorry don't know what the "black stuff" is you are talking about.

 

[David s Von Gieserbrechta]

Measure a 4" post on the diagonal and then measure a 6" round, pretty much the same same. Get a 6" auger and if the round posts are a little snug just use the loader to press them in, better a little tight than too loose. Ramming dirt around posts is no fun. When I was a kid we had some sixteen miles of pasture fence that was all hand bored with a post hole auger and then rammed with the flat end of a crowbar so believe me when I say ramming dirt around posts is NO fun.

David

 

[David s Von Gieserbrechta]

You can use either square or round posts but have you thought of the half rounds?

As far as what size auger to get that will all depend on what size post you will be using. I would suggest getting a auger 6 inches larger (minimum) in diameter than your post for several reasons. The larger the better.

* One, The larger hole you make the easier it is to "fine tune" the post before you set it.
* Two, The larger the hole, the less precise you have to be when you initially locate and drill it.
* Three, The larger hole will allow you access while tamping the dirt around the post while back filling the hole giving you a solid and sturdy post set.
* Four, Make sure you dig deep enough to get below the frost line.


Sorry don't know what the "black stuff" is you are talking about.

Sorry but I have NEVER heard of anyone putting fence post down to the frost line. Now I don't know where the OP lives But where I live the frost line is around eight and a half feet and would make for some pretty interesting fencing not to mention where one would get twelve foot fence posts.

David

 

[KYDan]

How many feet of fence are you planning on building? Do you have any further uses for the PHD & auger? Where are you located and what type of soil do you have? If it is not a lot of fence it might be more cost effective to hire it done. If you have heavy clay soil and significant rainfall per year a 4" post will decay quickly even if treated.

 

[billybobjimmyjoejack]

Either square or round is more of a personal preference if you are using the same size. The 6" round is a larger post than a 4" X 4" post even if the square post is rough and not nominal sized. Both posts have advantages, square is easier to nail to and is more readily available, round would be easier to line-up. A 9" auger bit seems to be the most common for 3pt. PHD it works well for a square post up to 6" X 6" with a little extra hand digging if needed and it will work well with the round posts. Hand tamping is part of wood post fence building unless you have a post driver. Here is a website that has tools and materials you might need and they have some good videos that might help also. Electric Fence, High Tensile Fencing Supplies

 

[wixthedog]

I would suggest round posts, for some reason they last longer. I don't know why but I have seen several examples of this happening. A 9" auger will do you just fine and allow you to true your fence a little easier. All of my line posts are 6" and I have done a million of them with a 9" auger bit. Buy a San Angelo bar to tamp with, it will be your best friend and most hated foe by the end of the day!

More than likely the black stuff you are seeing is either creosite or post tar. You can buy a gallon, or 5 gallon, pail of the post tar at TSC. It is supposed to be applied to the part of the post that is in the ground to form a water barrier. It is also applied to the tops to keep water from rotting the post from the top. I don't use the stuff and have not seen where I needed to unless it would be a post in a creek bed. I always top my posts even with an angke to aid in watershed anyhow.

 

[BeezFun]

I'd get or rent a post pounder. I bought a PHD and it's a lot of work to drill a hole, especially if you hit rocks or clay. My neighbor has a pounder that I've used, it can pound in a 6x6 post in about 15 seconds.

 

[Smallplot]

Sorry but I have NEVER heard of anyone putting fence post down to the frost line. Now I don't know where the OP lives But where I live the frost line is around eight and a half feet and would make for some pretty interesting fencing not to mention where one would get twelve foot fence posts.

David

Well I don't know where he OP Lives either but If your frost line is 8 and a half feet deep, you must not have very much time to tan in the summer or build fence

The reason I said this is simple and I shall explain. Guessing it is more of a decorative piece that also offers functionality. Going below the frost line and having about 6 inches of rock under the post will allow moisture to drain away from the post allowing longer post life. Another benefit of the post being below the frost line is the posts will remain more stable. They will not move as much with the freeze and thaw causing all them straight nice looking lines to turn into crooked looking fence as quick.

As far as 12 foot fence posts, you can get them anywhere around where I live. I think I read somewhere the average frost line depth being between 4 to 5 feet in the US. We always used 12 footers for end posts and packed them in concrete 5 to 6 feet deep, just saying.

 

[whistlepig]

Ok, so I am new to all this farming and property owning stuff.

I plan to do some fencing work. 3 board fencing.

Do I use round or square posts? I prefer square posts b/c they are easier to nail baords to.

What size auger bit should I get? I plan to get the 3 point auger attachment at TSC but don't want to buy the wrong size auger bit and have to buy a second one.

I think I will use 4x4 posts if square and round 6" posts.

I see this black stuff on the fencing also. What brand or type should I buy?

Round posts are easier to line up and nail to but square posts are prettier.

I have never heard of a 6" round post. Round line posts are 4" and round corner posts are 7".

In my experience a 9" auger works best for 4"x4" square poles and 4" round poles. For 7" round corner poles I use a 12" auger.

Its better to go with pressure treated boards than the black stuff. Pressure treated boards are easier to find sealant for if you want to re-treat the wood later.

 

[Smallplot]

You are getting varied opinions on the size of auger to use. Let me just caution you on this. If you were a seasoned fence builder you could get away with a smaller auger or even a post driver but you have to be precise in your measurements or you will have to get out the old fashioned hand diggers or spade and go to town. By the way it sounds, you have never built a fence and therefore it is safe to say you will not have the experience of some of the other posters. Believe me it is way easier to tamp in dirt than it is to enlarge a hole using hand tools. Just buy on the side of caution.

I will have to say with setting the posts in line, a lot of the positioning troubles come if the ground is sloped or uneven.

Once you dig a hole with the post hole digger it is very difficult to nearly impossible to dig another one with the digger centered anywhere inside the previous hole. You will usually have to reposition the auger just outside the previous hole.

 

[whistlepig]

Its easier to take more effort in the stringing of your post alignment by string line, bubble leveling, and the measuring your post placement. More time spent doing this will eliminate a lot of tamping and re-digging of holes. Anyone can dig a post hole if they are only digging one.

 

[MossflowerWoods]

If you have heavy clay soil and significant rainfall per year a 4" post will decay quickly even if treated.

Dan,

This is my concern. I have some clay, but what I have is a very high water table. It is GREAT for my crop of pine trees, but I suspect it will be TERRIBLE on my fence posts, PT or not.

The wife wants a pretty fence along the driveway borders of the horse pasture.

Are the half rounds PT? I like the look of the 6" half rounds and 3 board.

As to the black stuff, lots of people around me here in VA paint their entire fences black with some heavy tar/paint. I'm not particularly a fan of it, I would prefer a redwood stain, white paint, or just let the wood silver and age.

David

 

[BotaBigot]

...lots of people around me here in VA paint their entire fences black with some heavy tar/paint...

Noticed that. Across the Potomac, we tend to do ours in white. I like opaque white stain...looks like paint, but weathers off rather than peel like paint...easier to recoat...

 

[EMB5530]

Buying fence posts???
That sounds like expensive farming:laughing:

I guess where im from we are just blessed with the best fence posts around by cleaning up old pasture and fence lines.(hedge)Dont care what ya put it in its gonna last a long time. Lasts even longer if ya keep the water from workin in from the top. Just dont wanna let it age to long before ya drive the staples in cuz it can be a real bear.

And as far as looks go there is nothin better lookin than a good tight all hedge fence(and i mean all hedge no T-post)

we all have our opinions dont we

 

[grsthegreat]

Ive been putting up fence for WAY longer than i ever want to remember. I ended up installing 3 rail white vinyl fence out front ... about 1,200 feet of it if i remember correctly. LOVE that stuff. did it about 8-9 years ago.. still looks like new.

For the rest, i used to use 4x4 treated posts till 3 years ago when a very heavy snow year SNAPPED over 30 of my 4x4 posts.... snapped them like a toothpick.

Now i will only use 6x6 posts. I drill 9" holes 36" deep, then widen them slightly with a hand digger. I tried digging 12" holes but my ground is so hard, i never was successful. I also set all my treated posts in concrete and mound the concrete up at the top to prevent water sitting on the post.

Moose seem to like the fence and drinking fountain...er fountain too

I have friends that swear by 6" round posts, and some even have hydraulic post pounders to set them. I really don't think that they end up going very deep with them though.

I HATE wooden split rail fences, as ive had them in the past and their a maintainance nightmare. Had to paint them every other year to keep them looking half way nice. Split rail fencing just turns black in a few years. Lets face it... real wood sucks for maint.

 

[grsthegreat]

Buying fence posts???
That sounds like expensive farming:laughing:

I guess where im from we are just blessed with the best fence posts around by cleaning up old pasture and fence lines.(hedge)Dont care what ya put it in its gonna last a long time. Lasts even longer if ya keep the water from workin in from the top. Just dont wanna let it age to long before ya drive the staples in cuz it can be a real bear.

And as far as looks go there is nothin better lookin than a good tight all hedge fence(and i mean all hedge no T-post)

we all have our opinions dont we

what is hedge wood? any pics

 

[RobertBrown]

I've used round posts, and i can tell that the joint between boards has to land EXACTLY on the center of the post or you have to cut the board.
If the joints don't line up, top to bottom, and both boards don't end on the center of the post, it don't look good. It looks like an after thought.
Consider using a smaller post at the center of the boards, unless you are going to stagger the joints. Staggering the joints makes a slight stronger fence but it's more difficult to install.

 

[EMB5530]

what is hedge wood? any pics

Sorry bout that
hedge is what we call it round here
Its actual name is Osage Orange

No I dont have pics but I can have the wife take some of our fence out front
(built around 1980's) older than me and still looks good. Just have to fix broken wire and popped out staples(and like I said before wow old hedge is hard as a rock to drive the staples into) basically normal fence maintaince especially since the privious owner really let things go around here(and that is a whole nother story) but yea that is what all good fence is made of around here (Kansas) but most run anywhere from 1 to 3 metal Tee posts for every wood post which works great for keeping cattle in but as far as asthetics ya cant beat the strong beautiful look of an all wood and wire fence line. IMHO

But back to your matter

as far a maintence goes
Out of all the Osage Orange that is on my property (which is about 70% of my fence) there are 2 I have replaced and maybe 8 more that need replaced.
Which is not bad for fence that is 30+ years old. I am currently in the process of cleanin and repairing all my fenceline and want to replace all the Tee posts and other wood posts with Osage Orange/hedge.
Any other wood posts that are not made of hedge are completely rotted including RR ties on the back of the property which as you know are full of creosold which is nasty stuff. The only thing that has been done to the hedge is I have started to cap the tops of the posts to keep water from soaking in during the winter and freezing thus splitting the posts.

In summary of all my bla bla bla
If YA GOTS IT USE IT!
If not plant hedge apples and wait 20 years for your line posts and much longer for your corners oh yea did I mention that the wood also grows thorns. That adds to to fun of the harvest. haha
But with all good things a little BLOOD and sweat equity must be invested.

Eric

 

[boggen]

if you said, just woven wire, and 2 to 3 things of barb. it would not be a big deal.

but if are putting boards up. then "prep" work is important. and in that, is leveling things out nice and smooth. and removing any hill areas. and if you do have to deal with hills. then redo things, so there very small height to length ratio. other words not very steep hills. but very gentle inclines.

if you do not, then there a good chance, your fence boards will look like a zig zag as you follow the ground.

give yourself some wiggle room. meaning you can set your posts. but remember you can come back later with a saw, and cut tops off the posts off once you have the boards in place. so you can get the height of posts right after all said and done vs while you are putting up boards.

use string, or perhaps the eletric hot fence strips (not the wire, but the wider strips) as a quick temp doing to see how fence would look.