Propane - Cutting & Welding - Tombstone ???

[crash325]

With the last fill up on my acetylene over $80 for a mededum size tank. Sure think I want to try Propane. Been looking at lots & lots of posts and parts on the web. Tips from $6 to $17 each, depending on the brand and who has them.

Sure would like to hear from some of you that are using propane. Going to try this first. Regular gauge, hose & tip. Some say that works fine. Others insist that "T" type hose is needed, special tip and regulator. May be able to borrow a propane regulator if need be. Some say normal regulator will not flow enough for a Rose Bud tip???

Can't weld steel?? Around 45 years ago, tried butane for silver soldering and it didn't work out so hot. If memory is correct it put a film on the work that kept the silver from sticking and flowing out.

Tombstone ??? Got an almost new stinger lead to replace the old one that is getting pretty bad. First how well do plug in connectors work?? If spliced with copper crimps, soft solder connection or don't do that?? Plan to use some of the old positive lead and add a few feet to the ground. Any problems with it being longer??

I am well blessed with cutting torches, 3 #2460,S & 1 #2410, both use the same tips. One of the 2460'S need repair. Think it may just be plugged up. Been on the shelf for a few years.

Sure like some of you folks ideas and opinions on these things.

THANK YOU VERY MUCH. - Jim

 

[IslandTractor]

Propane is cheaper for heating and cutting but you cannot weld steel with it. Doesn't burn fast enough to get a high enough temp even though I believe it has the same or more energy as acetylene. Same for MAPP.

Propane does require special hose and nozzles though. Makes most sense for someone doing a lot of cutting, preheating or bending. Otherwise just use the acetylene and avoid the hassle and expense of dual setups.

 

[Tobias Dunlap]

I use quick connectors on all of my leads. Makes it very easy to change lengths of lead by simply plugging and unplugging. The only problem I have ever had with them is in very high amperage situations, they tend to get hot if the connection isn't perfect. (450 amp or more) They are the only way to go in my opinion.

As for propane, the major drawback I have is having to have all of the specialized tips. Normal acetylene tips do not "feather" the flow of gas and can cause flashbacks when using propane. It is very important to use a propane tip with your cutting torch when using propane, even more to use a propane rosebud. The acetylene regulator and hose will work fine, I've never had any problems with mine.

Hope this helps,

Toby

 

[yomax4]

If you never " Weld " with your Oxy Fuel, You have no need to stick with Acetylene. When Heating and cutting? Propane is Hotter. ( Argue all you want ) Read the charts. Switch to a Propane tip whether 1 piece or 2 and do get a Grade T Hose. Regulator will still work but you cant get accurate readings after 15 psi. Just keep it under 25 or so. I know with Victor, The settings are almost the same with Acetylene and Alternate Fuel Gases. Personally I keep both but for the average user. Go with Propane.

 

[trouble007]

With the last fill up on my acetylene over $80 for a mededum size tank. Sure think I want to try Propane. Been looking at lots & lots of posts and parts on the web. Tips from $6 to $17 each, depending on the brand and who has them.

Sure would like to hear from some of you that are using propane. Going to try this first. Regular gauge, hose & tip. Some say that works fine. Others insist that "T" type hose is needed, special tip and regulator. May be able to borrow a propane regulator if need be. Some say normal regulator will not flow enough for a Rose Bud tip???

Can't weld steel?? Around 45 years ago, tried butane for silver soldering and it didn't work out so hot. If memory is correct it put a film on the work that kept the silver from sticking and flowing out.

Tombstone ??? Got an almost new stinger lead to replace the old one that is getting pretty bad. First how well do plug in connectors work?? If spliced with copper crimps, soft solder connection or don't do that?? Plan to use some of the old positive lead and add a few feet to the ground. Any problems with it being longer??

I am well blessed with cutting torches, 3 #2460,S & 1 #2410, both use the same tips. One of the 2460'S need repair. Think it may just be plugged up. Been on the shelf for a few years.

Sure like some of you folks ideas and opinions on these things.

THANK YOU VERY MUCH. - Jim

Propane works very good for cutting and heating as others have posted however it will not work for welding as the flame heats too large of an area, you can however braze with it. as for the Reg you can use your normal Acetylene reg and if you are just trying it you can use your normal grade of hose, however for extended use you should switch to T Grade and for the Tips you do need to buy the special propane tips for cutting due to the fact that they have a special counter bore on the tip that is needed to keep the flame going. but you can use a normal rosebud and welding tip for heating.

Hope this helps

Ryan

 

[Ken]

Jim when I was working in N.Mex. and Arizona replacing the compressor stations with turbine engine driven pumps. The old engines and building over them were cut into loadable scrap pieces with propane cutters never saw them try to weld anything.
Still hurts to see the engines cut up and scraped but could not get anyone to pay even scrap prices for running engines.
Ranches wanted the water tanks if could be dropped with out bursting the tank. legs were cut into 3 foot lengths. and loaded with the rest of the metal.

One way to learn if you can do it is to try with a cast or pipe strenth metal or steel.

Now a big line to a narural gas line. Clean energy.

Phelps Dodge at Morenci used a 8" line at 500 lbs to feed the smelter to heat copper.
The flow was 12"X12" pour into 500 lbs forms for loading onto the flat car to ship to El Paso.
Heat was intense.

How is the weather out there now.
ken

 

[N8ghz]

+1 for propane for cutting. I have had normal hose on a rig for decades and use standard guages. I usually use a small tip, so have never had 'flow' problems, although I have used bigger tips. The Propane tips (2-piece) have what amounts to, more preheat holes via the serrations in the inner piece. I recently put together another outfit for my truck, and did use the T class hose, but 25 years ago, I never heard of it.

 

[TRR]

For more information from professionals (not to say there aren't any here) on the use of propane, check out the postings on WeldingWeb - Welding forum for pros and enthusiasts This is a forum that is used by professionals, but they are supportive of hobbyists and they are willing to help out everyone.

 

[crash325]

Jim when I was working in N.Mex. and Arizona replacing the compressor stations with turbine engine driven pumps. The old engines and building over them were cut into loadable scrap pieces with propane cutters never saw them try to weld anything.
Still hurts to see the engines cut up and scraped but could not get anyone to pay even scrap prices for running engines.
Ranches wanted the water tanks if could be dropped with out bursting the tank. legs were cut into 3 foot lengths. and loaded with the rest of the metal.

One way to learn if you can do it is to try with a cast or pipe strenth metal or steel.

Now a big line to a narural gas line. Clean energy.

Phelps Dodge at Morenci used a 8" line at 500 lbs to feed the smelter to heat copper.
The flow was 12"X12" pour into 500 lbs forms for loading onto the flat car to ship to El Paso.
Heat was intense.

How is the weather out there now.
ken

Hi Ken - Good to hear from you. - And may thanks to all the other folks that have replied.

Here is the plan (at least for now ), Get a propane tip, try cutting & heating with it and a regular rose bud. Being the Fool that I am, just have to try welding some thin steel. Will also do some brazing. Brass loves zinc so anything plated well be brazed. I do have some extra hose's and a regulator, so dual set up not a problem.

Of course I reserve the right to change my feeble mind. :laughing:

One of the torches that I got in trade has regular air hose couplers on it. Any of you folks tried that or use them?? See picture.

Thanks again to all. Much appreciated. :thumbsup:

Ken will talk to you about Morenci in another post. Have a few stories about it.

 

[rjmack]

i bought a propane tip and regulator to cut up an old dump truck box that came with a 3 ton truck that i only wanted the engine out of. the truck was an old municipal plow/salt truck and was rusty.

i never had such a tough time trying to cut anything up in my life... swore i would never use propane again... and i won't.

others have had different experiences i guess, but my nightmare was real. propane doesn't have nearly the btu of acetylene, as such the preheat time is much longer. if you are running a gang torch or automated cutting table that's not really an issue because you are always cutting clean steel, but i found that it kept losing it's preheat. i would lose the cut and have to stop and wait for it to generate enough heat to start the cut again.

i have never seen propane used in the field and i'm pretty sure that's the reason. sounds like you are going for it, so i guess you'll find out for yourself.

 

[IslandTractor]

Being the Fool that I am, just have to try welding some thin steel.

Some people just have to pee on the electric fence to find out for themselves.:thumbsup::laughing:

Go for it but thousands have tried before and it doesn't work. On the other hand you could use some of that fancy brazing rod, Alumaweld, and that would "weld" your thin sheet metal together. Really would probably work just fine for many purposes but it ain't welding.

 

[monckywrench]

I run appropriate tips and preheat is no problem. I hold the torch further out from the work than with acetylene. No need for an LP regulator for most work (modern acetylene regs are typically compatible including Smith and Victor).

I love LP for mobile salvage work because of reduced hazard and no overdraw limit. BBQ cylinders last a long time and are very convenient to carry.

The biggest scrapping torches are LP/other non-acetylene fuels and don't even offer acetylene tips.

 

[crash325]

I run appropriate tips and preheat is no problem. I hold the torch further out from the work than with acetylene. No need for an LP regulator for most work (modern acetylene regs are typically compatible including Smith and Victor).

I love LP for mobile salvage work because of reduced hazard and no overdraw limit. BBQ cylinders last a long time and are very convenient to carry.

The biggest scrapping torches are LP/other non-acetylene fuels and don't even offer acetylene tips.

Haven't tried cutting yet. But have been using the rose bud. Seams like it really needs to be cranked up. If used it like that with acetylene it would turn the metal into a puddle.

 

[IslandTractor]

Haven't tried cutting yet. But have been using the rose bud. Seams like it really needs to be cranked up. If used it like that with acetylene it would turn the metal into a puddle.

Remember that the hottest part of a propane flame is different from acetylene. Acetylene flame is hottest right near the inner cone very close to the nozzle while propane flame is hottest a few inches away. Holding a propane torch close to the work like it was acetylene is very inefficient.

 

[Gary Fowler]

Tip to work distance was likely the problem RJMACK had. I have never used propane, but have used MAPP gas and it does seem to take a bit longer to preheat prior to cutting, BUT according to all literature, propane has MORE BTU than acetylene but burns a bit colder which is likely the reason we take a bit longer to preheat to point of melting prior to cutting. I think when my bottle of acetylene runs out, I will try the propane. Investing in a LPG tip would not take a lot of money. If it works ok, may spring for the type T hose as my old hose is pretty old anyway, although when we used the MAPP gas on construction site, we used the same hoses for acetylene. I wonder if that was why they occasionally popped a hole in them?

 

[jake98]

The guy at Airgas was telling me that propolene (however you spell it) is a better gas to use than propane.

 

[yomax4]

The guy at Airgas was telling me that propolene (however you spell it) is a better gas to use than propane.

Propylene is a good Alternate Fuel. The welding supply distributors sell any Alt.Fuel Except Propane because they know you can buy Propane anywhere. They want your business so they all have a favorite Fuel that you have to get from them. Propylene, Chemoline, Lingas,Chemtane, Mapp etc. can only be bought through certain distributors. You can buy propane at any gas station. Home Depot, Lowes etc.
Propane is the lowest cost and runs just as well as the other Alt.Fuels.

 

[IslandTractor]

Propylene is a good Alternate Fuel. The welding supply distributors sell any Alt.Fuel Except Propane because they know you can buy Propane anywhere. They want your business so they all have a favorite Fuel that you have to get from them. Propylene, Chemoline, Lingas,Chemtane, Mapp etc. can only be bought through certain distributors. You can buy propane at any gas station. Home Depot, Lowes etc.
Propane is the lowest cost and runs just as well as the other Alt.Fuels.

Amen.

 

[deereman75]

Propylene is a good Alternate Fuel. The welding supply distributors sell any Alt.Fuel Except Propane because they know you can buy Propane anywhere. They want your business so they all have a favorite Fuel that you have to get from them. Propylene, Chemoline, Lingas,Chemtane, Mapp etc. can only be bought through certain distributors. You can buy propane at any gas station. Home Depot, Lowes etc.
Propane is the lowest cost and runs just as well as the other Alt.Fuels.

Air liquide actually does sell propane...

 

[crash325]

Remember that the hottest part of a propane flame is different from acetylene. Acetylene flame is hottest right near the inner cone very close to the nozzle while propane flame is hottest a few inches away. Holding a propane torch close to the work like it was acetylene is very inefficient.

Thanks for the advice. will give it a try
Jim