DON'T FREEZE UP

[KiotiDave]

Hi All,
As everyone is well aware, we are going to get very cold this week.
Don't forget to add anti-gel treatment to your diesel fuel. About the only thing that will keep your KIOTI from starting in the cold is gelled fuel.
Kioti also allows a 20% kerosene mix istead of treatment.
I normally double what the bottle suggests, for example: Howes Lubricant says 1 oz treatment to 2 gallons of fuel. I put 1oz per gallon, it will not hurt anything and it is cheap insurance against your fuel solidifying in your filter, tank and lines. If it has ever happened to you, you know how much work it is to correct the problem.
I just wanted to remind everyone as we have had a couple of customers with a no start caused from the cold.
Good luck and keep warm.
KiotiDave

 

[rimshot]

The weatherman is claiming -30* tonight. Today I put in about 5 oz. of 911 in the 6 gal full tank even though my tractor is in a slightly heated garage (38*).

I believe that would be sufficient for working in the snow with my rear blower.

What do you think, should I still add Power service as well. So far no troubles with fuel but then it hasn't been this cold yet either.

rimshot

 

[BJN644]

911 is what you put in when it's already gelled, you should not use it on a regular basis because it contains lots of alcohol. Use the Powerservice in the white bottle for routine use in the winter.

 

[novi408]

Any hints on starting them in this type of weather? I cycled the glow plugs 3 times on my CK20S last night and it started with a little bit of sputtering and took maybe 10-20 seconds to smooth out. Not terrible, but I didn't know if there was a better way or if I would be causing any damage. Temp was probably about 13 degrees. The tractor is in an unheated garage. I have been using the Powerservice with every tank.

 

[LBrown59]

911 is what you put in when it's already gelled, you should not use it on a regular basis because it contains lots of alcohol.
*Use the Powerservice in the white bottle for routine use in the winter.

*I do year round.

 

[PILOON]

I was blowing snow this PM and it BRRR was rather chilly.
-27 C.
Needed to 'help' the battery a little but she started OK. (just a bit of sputter sputter)
Did cycle the glow plugs 3 times.
Since I worked last night with lights on I probably did not have a full charge.
Sure nice to have a heater in the cab!

 

[KiotiDave]

Hi,
As far as starting in the cold, you can cycle the glow plugs several times as suggested. Once the engine starts and sputters, Kioti has a feature that lets you turn the glow plugs back on manually. As soon as the engine starts you can turn the key slightly toward the start position and the glow light will come on. If you hold it there for 15 or 20 seconds the engine will smooth out rather quickly and you can bump the throttle up to about 1200 rpms. After a minute or two you can lift the loader and let it back down to start to circulate the fluids a little. Don't rush it...let the tractor warm up a good 10 minutes in this cold weather.
Good Luck
KiotiDave

 

[VictorW]

You may just want to watch the fuel also.
This summer I started using off road diesel to save fuel costs. It's a reputable dealer and supplies many farms. I always use additive. Plowed snow the other day and added 5 gallons of just bought fuel before I parked the CK30. Today around 20', started the tractor, waited for warm up, and started plowing. After about 15 minutes, the tach was all over the place no matter where the throttle was. The engine had a mind of its own and wouldn't run steady at all. I'm talking 1,000rpm to 2,500 rpm like it had a governor on it. One time it died but I got it to restart. Limped it in my garage, no power when rpm's would slow down, and found no gelled fuel, 5 hours on a new filter, and the fuel did flow when I pulled the feed hose off. Figured it must be the fuel I added and I drained everything except for the fuel in the steel lines going to the injectors. Put in 5 gallons of new on road fuel, where I normally used to get it, and it ran perfect. Plowed for over an hour and the engine never missed a beat.
So is my idea right and is was bad fuel or are there gremlins lurking under the hood?

 

[novi408]

Hi,
As far as starting in the cold, you can cycle the glow plugs several times as suggested. Once the engine starts and sputters, Kioti has a feature that lets you turn the glow plugs back on manually. As soon as the engine starts you can turn the key slightly toward the start position and the glow light will come on. If you hold it there for 15 or 20 seconds the engine will smooth out rather quickly and you can bump the throttle up to about 1200 rpms. After a minute or two you can lift the loader and let it back down to start to circulate the fluids a little. Don't rush it...let the tractor warm up a good 10 minutes in this cold weather.
Good Luck
KiotiDave

Thanks. I have used the additional glow plug feature you mentioned. It has seemed to help. MichiganIron told me about this feature when he delivered the tractor. I was just worried cycling the glow plugs 3 times would be bad for the tractor. I have also been letting it warm up for 10 minutes or so. Usually for 5 minutes and then cycle the front plow and then let it run a few more minutes.

 

[LBrown59]

You may just want to watch the fuel also.
This summer I started using off road diesel to save fuel costs.
It's a reputable dealer and supplies many farms.
I always use additive. Plowed snow the other day and added 5 gallons of just bought fuel before I parked the CK30. Today around 20', started the tractor, waited for warm up, and started plowing. After about 15 minutes, the tach was all over the place no matter where the throttle was. The engine had a mind of its own and wouldn't run steady at all. I'm talking 1,000rpm to 2,500 rpm like it had a governor on it. One time it died but I got it to restart. Limped it in my garage, no power when rpm's would slow down, and found no gelled fuel, 5 hours on a new filter, and the fuel did flow when I pulled the feed hose off. Figured it must be the fuel I added and I drained everything except for the fuel in the steel lines going to the injectors. Put in 5 gallons of new on road fuel, where I normally used to get it, and it ran perfect. Plowed for over an hour and the engine never missed a beat.
So is my idea right and is was it bad fuel or are there gremlins lurking under the hood?

I doubt it was the fuel.
If it was all those farms would have had the same problem too.
Depending on their tractors is more inportant to them than you depending on your tractor is to you; so I'd say they would not be buying fuel they did not have faith in.

 

[TBDonnelly]

So is my idea right and is was bad fuel or are there gremlins lurking under the hood?

I had similar symptoms this past weekend. I talked to my dealer and he's had several phone calls with similar issues and all of them have been traced back to bad fuel.

Similar discussion taking place in this thread:

http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/kubota-owning-operating/135525-bx-problem-need-help.html

Don

 

[Gittyup]

You guys scared me into putting in some Power Service. Got home tonight and put it right in. Started on the 3rd short try. Engine seemed to perk up a bit right after I put the PS in. Coincidence or not, at least now I have peace of mind that my fuel won't gel and muck things up.

I noticed that the glow plugs stayed on by themselves for a few seconds after starting. First time it's done that. Temp = 16 F.

 

[rfmr]

In additon to the PS (white container) can you also use dry gas in the tank if you think there may be a water/condensation problem?

 

[dqdave1]

Only use additives made for use in diesels.

 

[VictorW]

I doubt it was the fuel.
If it was all those farms would have had the same problem too.
Depending on their tractors is more inportant to them than you depending on your tractor is to you; so I'd say they would not be buying fuel they did not have faith in.

I do realize that all the farms are more important than me just clearing snow but I have no other answer for it as of now. I never had any problems the past 4 Winters until I changed where I get my fuel.

I read the thread that Don mentioned, thanks Don, and I haven't found any algea in the tank either. My filter housing is clear and the filter looked good. Also, when I drained everything, I had taken the filter out for closer inspection. Saw nothing. No black residue, nothing slimey like clear algae. When I pulled the line from the tank to the pump, the fuel ran out fast leaving me to believe that I have no debris in the tank. Also, when I fuel up, I use a funnel with a fine screen but I guess something might have snuck in. I didn't see any ice crystals in the fuel either but that may be hard to notice.

It was -6 last night and 0 now. That might be a good test for the new fuel and how she runs.

I hope everyone else is running. PITA when it acts up and you have work to do.

 

[LBrown59]

*I do realize that all the farms are more important than me just clearing snow but I have no other answer for it as of now.
**I never had any problems the past 4 Winters until I changed where I get my fuel.

*But it would seem odd if they weren't having problems with the fuel but you are the only one one haveing a problem with it wouldn't it?
**I just wonder if you would still of had the problem even if you had not changed to another fuel.

 

[chopper1usa]

Kioti Dave, I use just the 911 in the tractor I bought from you. I use about 5 oz. to a 6 gallon can. Is what BJN 644 is saying true? Can or will the alcohol content cause trouble down the road in my CK20? What is your recomendation concerning this product and/or what should we use? Thanks Dave great machine! Mike in perkinsville,VT

 

[coobie]

Good read here!!Do a search for the spicer lubricty test.It is a independent study on diesel fuel addtives.I use schaeffers winter diesel treat or stanadyne performance formula in my cummins diesel,kioti tractor,kubota RTV 900,and kubota ZTR,year around.coobie

 

[VictorW]

Four hours on the tractor since the draining of fuel and refilling with fuel from a different source. It hasn't missed a beat even in 2' weather.

Maybe as LBrown59 mentioned, it might not have been the fuel but it runs great now.

 

[TBDonnelly]

Four hours on the tractor since the draining of fuel and refilling with fuel from a different source. It hasn't missed a beat even in 2' weather.

I used my tractor for 2 hours today and it ran fine. Our area went through a freeze cycle, then it went up to 60 degrees, then it was back down to freezing. I had left the fuel tank low on fuel. Next time I used the tractor is when it acted up. I then added some PowerService and topped the tank off. Today was the test and the tractor did fine.

I think some condensation developed in the tank by leaving the fuel level low during the freeze/heat up/refreeze cycle. But, then again, my last two 5 gallon cans of diesel where from a station I had never bought diesel fuel from before. Hmmmm...

Don