First Day, New Boxblade, Broken
- Thread starter RFB
- Start date
- Views: 11041
N80
Super Member
I would not pay any attention to any titles concerning 'heavy' or 'extreme' duty. Look at specs. Look at construction. I don't think you have to spend $2500 to get a BB that will function on your tractor, but if you do get a $2500 BB it will porpbably last more than your lifetime.
Case in point: I bought a Bush Hog SB720 6' BB. This is their standard duty model. But compared to some of the off brand standard duty models it is far better built, heavier and better designed. It does cost more, but not much. I have a 45 HP tractor and I've used the BB hard with no problems. Again, this is just to say, don't look at the name or label, look at the specs and build.
Case in point: I bought a Bush Hog SB720 6' BB. This is their standard duty model. But compared to some of the off brand standard duty models it is far better built, heavier and better designed. It does cost more, but not much. I have a 45 HP tractor and I've used the BB hard with no problems. Again, this is just to say, don't look at the name or label, look at the specs and build.
N80
Super Member
Doh! Looks like its another American piece of junk. And I hate to say it guys, but American made junk is worse than Chinese made junk. It gives 'American Made' a bad reputation and it usually costs more than the same quality junk from China.
kthompson
Elite Member
- Joined
- Sep 12, 2008
- Messages
- 3,526
- Location
- South Carolina
- Tractor
- Kubotas B2710, M6800, L6060 cab, Volvo EC excavator, 2 ZTRs and various implements.
RFB, if your dealership is one you can trust ask them on the blade and their history with them. It could be a new line and they have no real idea. It is also possible there was a reinforcement part missed in making your unit. It happens.
I have a King Kutter scrape blade and it is US made and the most problem piece of equipment I have ever had. It is now waiting on about 5th repair. A dealer told me last night (at least of brands he knows) it was the next to bottom product line. I agree. Not the most accurate way to check quality but a quick check is the total weight.
I have a King Kutter scrape blade and it is US made and the most problem piece of equipment I have ever had. It is now waiting on about 5th repair. A dealer told me last night (at least of brands he knows) it was the next to bottom product line. I agree. Not the most accurate way to check quality but a quick check is the total weight.
greenbeanman in Kansas
New member
The more I read here the more I appreciate my sandy soil and not rocky ground.
Sounds like a responsible dealer and manufacturer.
Sounds like a responsible dealer and manufacturer.
Labels are easy to apply. Real quality is harder to put into the product.
Weight is one good measure. As is the thickness of the steel. HD boxes are in the 150-200 pounds per linear foot range. 84" = 7 foot so you should be expecting a real deal HD box to be in the 1000-1400# range. For example my 5.5' box is 950 pounds or so. Used to be stuff like boxes were in the $1- 1.25 a pound range, probably in the $1.75 to $2 a pound range with steel being up and the dollar down. (Mine was $1454 6 years ago - nearly the same price as the brushbull cutter)
wedge40
Veteran Member
- Joined
- Oct 8, 2007
- Messages
- 2,197
This reminds me of how I purchase pots and pans.. I lift them. If they feel light and have no heft, then I move the next brand. And like implements, heavier us usually better.
I got my BB with the tractor.. Not sure of the weight, and right now I couldn't even tell you the brand. But I've used it to do my driveway and to clear some areas in the woods for small buildings. I did manage to snap a pin, but the blade didn't have dent.
Wedge
I got my BB with the tractor.. Not sure of the weight, and right now I couldn't even tell you the brand. But I've used it to do my driveway and to clear some areas in the woods for small buildings. I did manage to snap a pin, but the blade didn't have dent.
Wedge
Bill Barrett
Platinum Member
- Joined
- Jul 11, 2006
- Messages
- 671
- Location
- midwest
- Tractor
- Kubota L3130, Satoh G650, Case 580, Case 446
I've been looking for some time at box scrappers. I have heavy clay and roots to deal with. I was going to get a KK, but after reading threads like this I bought a Land Pride last week, and they now are affiliated with Kubota dealers, with same paint. My dealer has woods also, I do believe the woods might be a tad stronger, same price. The Land Pride and Woods was just under twice that of KK and Farm Force. I do buy cheap alot, then rework them, just didn't want to spend the time, and didn't think I could redo a box blade for the money difference.
It's good that your dealer and manufacturer is backing you.
It's good that your dealer and manufacturer is backing you.
3RRL
Super Member
- Joined
- Oct 20, 2005
- Messages
- 6,931
- Tractor
- 55HP 4WD KAMA 554 and 4 x 4 Jinma 284
I think John Bud and others made some good points when they said your tractor is overpowering the boxblade. You need to look at the parent material thickness and connections to the rear of the box. Their are inexpensive ways to beef up your boxblade by adding some scrap steel in strategic areas to gain performance and thereby weight too. But the stock box has to be built well enough in the first place.
When you start checking out 84" boxes you'll see a significant improvement in material thickness. I have a medium duty 84" Howse that had a very good base structure. The 3pt connection is a solid plate of 3/8 pre-hardened steel that spans from 3pt to the rear of the box. I know it's it's heat treated because I machined it. All the steel is 3/8" minimum with 5/8" bars running to the rear of the box. There scarifier tube is heavy too.
Here is a picture of the stock 84" Howse boxblade. I paid 500 bucks for it 3-1/2 years ago.
When I first got that box for my 55hp tractor I got lucky because I really didn't have a clue as to how heavy duty the boxblade should be. I knew I didn't want to spend 2 grand or more for a boxblade though. It's been through some pretty tough granite, clay roots and rocks. In my case, the scarifier carrier tube was strong enough, but the scarifiers weren't. I bent and snapped several off with that boxblade, so there was no question the box itself was strong enough.
The first thing I did was get some scrap steel and made some supports for the scarifiers. This was not an expensive addition and save on scarifiers. I did the welding myself at my camp. You need to create a generous fillet when doing the final passes.
After that, realizing that I was moving the position of the scarifiers many many times for all the road and ground prep for my new home, I decided to change that too. It was just too time consuming with all I had to do. I made that same boxblade into a gear driven hydraulic model. It's given me years of trouble free work now. I did all the work myself to it and it was a little more expnsive than just adding the supports, but I don't think I have more than 400 bucks into parts total.
Now it's pretty heavy and pretty cool too.
So there ARE some things you can do to fix up a boxblade.
When you start checking out 84" boxes you'll see a significant improvement in material thickness. I have a medium duty 84" Howse that had a very good base structure. The 3pt connection is a solid plate of 3/8 pre-hardened steel that spans from 3pt to the rear of the box. I know it's it's heat treated because I machined it. All the steel is 3/8" minimum with 5/8" bars running to the rear of the box. There scarifier tube is heavy too.
Here is a picture of the stock 84" Howse boxblade. I paid 500 bucks for it 3-1/2 years ago.
When I first got that box for my 55hp tractor I got lucky because I really didn't have a clue as to how heavy duty the boxblade should be. I knew I didn't want to spend 2 grand or more for a boxblade though. It's been through some pretty tough granite, clay roots and rocks. In my case, the scarifier carrier tube was strong enough, but the scarifiers weren't. I bent and snapped several off with that boxblade, so there was no question the box itself was strong enough.
The first thing I did was get some scrap steel and made some supports for the scarifiers. This was not an expensive addition and save on scarifiers. I did the welding myself at my camp. You need to create a generous fillet when doing the final passes.
After that, realizing that I was moving the position of the scarifiers many many times for all the road and ground prep for my new home, I decided to change that too. It was just too time consuming with all I had to do. I made that same boxblade into a gear driven hydraulic model. It's given me years of trouble free work now. I did all the work myself to it and it was a little more expnsive than just adding the supports, but I don't think I have more than 400 bucks into parts total.
Now it's pretty heavy and pretty cool too.
So there ARE some things you can do to fix up a boxblade.
Yeah, but what would it cost to BUY your box with all the fancy do-dads on it? A lot more than the 900ish you have in it!
Some of us (ahem - me - ahem), may be a touch short on reaching your talent level, so we have to resort to paying more. (sob)
One bright note from all your additions on that box. You have provided some very good before and after data on how the results improve with a heavy box over a light one. Being a "weight bigot" myself, I always like to hear how people add more weight and are even happier with the performance when it gets heavy.
jb
Some of us (ahem - me - ahem), may be a touch short on reaching your talent level, so we have to resort to paying more. (sob)
One bright note from all your additions on that box. You have provided some very good before and after data on how the results improve with a heavy box over a light one. Being a "weight bigot" myself, I always like to hear how people add more weight and are even happier with the performance when it gets heavy.
jb
3RRL
Super Member
- Joined
- Oct 20, 2005
- Messages
- 6,931
- Tractor
- 55HP 4WD KAMA 554 and 4 x 4 Jinma 284
I couldn't agree more with you John.
Weight is a huge factor for the boxblade when cutting, digging or ripping....even smoothing. Loose material is easily moved without the weight, but once you need it to cut into any hard ground, weight is of utmost importance. Naturally, the construction of the boxblade needs to follow suit being well made for tasks like that.
pitt_md
Veteran Member
I think John Bud and others made some good points when they said your tractor is overpowering the boxblade. You need to look at the parent material thickness and connections to the rear of the box. Their are inexpensive ways to beef up your boxblade by adding some scrap steel in strategic areas to gain performance and thereby weight too. But the stock box has to be built well enough in the first place.
When you start checking out 84" boxes you'll see a significant improvement in material thickness. I have a medium duty 84" Howse that had a very good base structure. The 3pt connection is a solid plate of 3/8 pre-hardened steel that spans from 3pt to the rear of the box. I know it's it's heat treated because I machined it. All the steel is 3/8" minimum with 5/8" bars running to the rear of the box. There scarifier tube is heavy too.
Here is a picture of the stock 84" Howse boxblade. I paid 500 bucks for it 3-1/2 years ago.
When I first got that box for my 55hp tractor I got lucky because I really didn't have a clue as to how heavy duty the boxblade should be. I knew I didn't want to spend 2 grand or more for a boxblade though. It's been through some pretty tough granite, clay roots and rocks. In my case, the scarifier carrier tube was strong enough, but the scarifiers weren't. I bent and snapped several off with that boxblade, so there was no question the box itself was strong enough.
The first thing I did was get some scrap steel and made some supports for the scarifiers. This was not an expensive addition and save on scarifiers. I did the welding myself at my camp. You need to create a generous fillet when doing the final passes.
After that, realizing that I was moving the position of the scarifiers many many times for all the road and ground prep for my new home, I decided to change that too. It was just too time consuming with all I had to do. I made that same boxblade into a gear driven hydraulic model. It's given me years of trouble free work now. I did all the work myself to it and it was a little more expnsive than just adding the supports, but I don't think I have more than 400 bucks into parts total.
Now it's pretty heavy and pretty cool too.
So there ARE some things you can do to fix up a boxblade.
What can I say but WOW! That is the trickest BB I have ever seen. I am impressed.
oliver28472
Veteran Member
My cousin just sold his old 6' Gannon at auction for about $500. It was a little beat up but nothing wrong with it. Doubt my Satoh Buck would even lift it. My approach to buying most things is look everywhere you can for it, classifieds, craigslist etc. and don't get in a hurry.
I really feel bad about this entire issue because I believe that the dealer has acted completely and overwhelmingly in good faith. I truly believe that they had zero foreknowledge regarding the strengths/weaknesses of the product, and all of their representatives have constantly presented themselves as if this is their problem, not mine, and that they will ensure customer satisfaction. That is a commodity that is hard to find nowadays. I would gladly purchase an alternative (genuine heavy duty) box blade from them just due to their treatment of me throughout this issue.
More to come.
More to come.
greggh
Gold Member
In the pictures, it looked as if the scarficiers were turned backward. It doesn't look as if they would catch on anything except if you were pushing instead of pulling, and that wouldn't make sense either. It must really be a weak piece of equipment. Sorry about your trouble.
locknut
Platinum Member
- Joined
- Jul 31, 2006
- Messages
- 576
- Tractor
- Kubota
It's easy to see why the tube split out.Hard to believe a company would build it without welded reinforcement sleeves to spread the load over the entire tube.Reminds me of the old days when I worked in a gas station and we would poke a screwdriver through an oil filter.....well,we all know how that turns out....don't we.I'm sure they'll make it right.
3RRL
Super Member
- Joined
- Oct 20, 2005
- Messages
- 6,931
- Tractor
- 55HP 4WD KAMA 554 and 4 x 4 Jinma 284
RFB said this:
The dealer I bought it from was very responsive and said the manufacturer was as well. They called me back within an hour of notification and said a new one will be made and shipped for exchange.
This is a lot different than what is suggested in your post .... poking a hole in an oil filter. It doesn't look like it was their intent to rip anyone off to me. Might just be a bad design that they have to address, and with that statement, they are going to do so.
Did you exchange the filters you poked the holes in?
SnowRidge
Elite Member
Except for one thing. The dealer should have spotted the fact that it wasn't put together strongly enough right away. He should have called the factory and asked them exactly what are they trying to pull with that kind of construction. At a minimum, he should have warned you to keep an eye on it and to make sure you stressed it while in its warranty period.
frenchie4x4
Bronze Member
RFB, SORRY TO HERE ABOUT YOUR DILEMMA WITH YOUR NEW BOX BLADE. POSSIBLY WHEN IT WAS BUILT THE SUPPLIER SENT THE WRONG WALLED TUBING AND THE NEXT ONE WILL BE BETTER. I BOUGHT A MIDWEST 84" 4 YRS AGO FOR $400 AND HAVE NOT HAD ANY PROBLEMS. IT IS MADE OF ALL 1/2" STEEL AND THICK TUBING. I PULL IT WITH A 50 HP TRACTOR ON A ROCKY SHALE DRIVEWAY 3/10 MILE LONG. IT WILL STOP THE TRACTOR IF I CATCH SOMETHING. LET US KNOW WHAT THE OUTCOME IS. GOOD LUCK. FRENCHIE
