small dozer options

[Groo]

I do some shopping for my father.
He already has a 35hp 4x4 Kubota with a bucket and backhoe

He is in the market for a small used dozer to cut roads in the wood amung other jobs. Something that could be hauled with a 3/4 ton truck.

my initial thought would be a used komastsu d21 or a class 3 dozer

I am thinking a Nortrac (new would be in his price range) at 3 tons would be too small. Some of the skid steers run 5 to 6 tons and with either tracks or track conversion kits might do a better job.

what are your thoughts on the Nortrac and Skidsteer options.

 

[DSS]

You could certainly be more versatile with a skid steer machine however, for grading roads, the dozer would certainly be my choice.

You could pick up something like used deere 450 or a D3 at a good price, especially right now since it is buyers market and they could still be moved with your pickup.

I would have more faith in one of these machines used than I would a new Nortrac.

 

[Groo]

do you think the skidsteer would be too low on traction? or is there some other reason.

I would of course be using a 6-way blade.

 

[ultrarunner]

I looked for a good JD 350C for about two years before I found my Cat D3. The D3 is bigger than I wanted but has done a very good job cutting in roads and such... I've had it almost 10 years.

Parts are as near as my CAT Dealer 5 miles away...

 

[DSS]

do you think the skidsteer would be too low on traction? or is there some other reason.

I would of course be using a 6-way blade.

A skidsteer is not going to give you the traction and the pushing power that a dozer will with a single grouser track.

 

[EddieWalker]

I have an F250 3/4 ton pickup truck and consider my CUT tractor about as big a load as I'm willing to haul with it. For a small dozer, I'd want a one ton with duel rear tires and trailer brakes.

Eddie

 

[DarinRay]

Heck yeah go for a small komatsu or mitsubishi dozer. I have NO experience with the nortracs but do have 18 of the komatsu and mitsubishi dozers. Darin

 

[BarryinMN]

I've had a JD350 for years. These old JD's are part of the ag division & parts are available at the green ag dealerships.

I have driven A Nortrac, they are small, biggest problem is mild steel tracks streeeetch... constant maintenance.

A CTL is handy if you need a loader but nothing carves up the landscape like a dozer.

 

[TMTS]

never used one, but rayco makes a small dozer set-up similar to its c87 and c90 units...

2004 RAYCO C87D Dozer - Crawler For Sale At MachineryTrader.com

also - you can sometimes find an older ASV 4810 that has the 6 way dozer attachment on it- you raise the loader arms, quick-disconnect the hyd lines for the loader, use the frame mount (not on the Quick attach plate) to attach the dozer blade and use the joystick to run the dozer blade...hard to find, but it does a nice job...

 

[Groo]

I saw a simmilar crawler, a 96 ICC D6000 a bit closer to home, (and thats what got me thinking about a skidsteer type unit) but I would be afraid of parts availibility for an oddball unit.

Also the previous coment about the mild steel Nortrac tracks has me a bit worried that these minidozers might be using the same track

 

[JasG]

3/4 ton pick-up will limit your choices. A JD 450 or a D3 are going to be in the #14000lbs range, add a trailer and your outside of what I would think a 3/4 ton could tow. JD or Case 350's, JD 400 would be ideal, but since they stopped making that size the used units have increased allot. Also when you jump from a 350 to a 450 the undercarriage parts increase in cost allot. D-21 is a good choice, but some grey market machines can be hard to get parts for. I had for a few years a Dresser, that was a very good machine, but larger than what you are looking for.

 

[Landwise]

1st thing-

A Tak TL150 has #13800 lbs of traction force, and a D3 dozer has #14300 lbs of traction force. A TL150 with a Bradco 6 way blade will do almost anything that a D3 will do (Almost...)

2nd thing-

An F250 with a Gooseneck hitch is only rated to tow #100 lbs less than an f350 dualie, and it will pull (I am on flat ground here) #24000 all day long, as long as your trailer brakes work. The Tak150 weighs around #11000 and would be NO problem for an f250.

 

[JasG]

Landwise:

Not sure where you are getting your numbers from. Maximum GCWR from Ford site for F250/350 is 23000 Lbs, 350 DRW 26000, max trailer 5th wheel 15000 for F250/350, 350 DRW is 18800 lbs. Here in NY last I knew your fine was by the pound for overload. So if caught pulling 24000 lbs the minimum fine would be $7100.00 and only would go up from there. Also the truck must be rated for the maximum trailer weight. If your trailer is rated for 24000 lbs and the your only pulling 16000 lbs you will still be getting a ticket for non-compliance.

This also depends on just how the truck is set up; it could be a low as 10000 lbs for trailer towing depending on axle, cab, frame, tire options.

Pulling a 24000 lbs load with F250 possible, legal it is not. That痴 1000 over the combine weight rating of the truck. My 15 ton tag trailer was 6000lbs alone. I stand by my statement a with a ｾ ton anything over a 10000 lbs machine is not a wise choice. The newer Deere 450痴 are closer to 17000 and I think the D3痴 are also.

 

[Landwise]

2000 model year tow ratings, as reported by trailmanor.com, 5th wheel:

F-250 7.3 TD 14,000d
F-250 4WD 7.3 TD 13,500d
F-350 7.3 TD 13,900d
F-350 DRW 7.3 TD 13,600d/e
F-350 4WD 7.3 TD 13,500d

Not sure what a new one is rated to tow, as I can't afford a new one.
In NC, a trucks legality to tow is determined by the plates that you buy. I have used this example before- You can put #80,000 plates on a Nissan if you want. You shouldn't, but you could....

GCWR is "Purchased" in NC

 

[john_bud]

Landwise is correct in nearly all states. From what I can tell, you simply need to register the truck and trailer for the load. You will need to keep within the load rating of the tires, wheels and axles. That may mean a light tongue weight and heavier tires etc.

If you want details, google up on "hot shot" truckers and what they do. Many are pulling 12 ton trailers. I know my neighbor pulls 12 ton with a dodge and chev dually. He needs CDL, DOT#, etc but is totally legal for the weight and has been pull over and scaled lots of times. 3 times in one week by the same cop even. No overload fines.

 

[AKfish]

Hmm... I'm not "gettin' it"!

How can you buy tags, etc. for weight limits that exceed the manufacturers limitations established for the vehicle? My crewcab Chevy 2500HD has a GVCW (think that's it - Gross Vehicle Cargo Weight) of 22,000lbs. I've had the truck on the scales at the landfill and it comes in a shade over 7K.

To my way of thinking; that means I've got around 15K to work with - trailer, load, etc.

How could I legally tow a 24K trailer?

(By the way, my neighbor just bought a 12 ton gooseneck; it weighs a bit more than 6,000lbs, for his 2500HD.) We had a lengthy discussion regarding his ability to haul his S250 Bobcat with Grouser tracks, bucket, grapple and/or hydraulic PHD. The Bobcat weighs ~9,000lbs.

I'm missin' something, here...

AKfish

 

[AKfish]

Don't mean to "sidetrack" the original post -- just got caught by the direction of the last couple of comments.

Thanks.

 

[AlanB]

IMO it comes down to what angle you are looking at the problem from, If it is DOT compliance, then what the guys are saying about "buying" GVWR is their experience, My experience has been that they were reading the Door sticker and looking at the scale which gave me the impression that had he been over, there was about too be a problem.

That is one of the problems with this type of discussion with folks from so many different area's and perspectives. Unfortunately the only one that matters is the particular DOT guy you get that moment, and his perspective. You can also rant and rave and take him too court and prove him wrong etc. etc. but I would be willing to bet your rig will be parked on the side of the road when you leave.

I also think that a lawyer, for the guy suing you if god forbid you had an accident and you were overloaded for your GVWR would make you mighty guilty looking in front of the jury.

I for one, would not want to overload my vehicle past its written limits, regardless of the tag I had on it.

 

[farmboy12]

Heck yeah go for a small komatsu or mitsubishi dozer. I have NO experience with the nortracs but do have 18 of the komatsu and mitsubishi dozers. Darin

What's your business?

 

[Landwise]

There is some truth here about being sued....

In civil court, a good lawyer would eat me up. I pull a 10 ton goose neck which weighs around #5500 empty. My Kubota 080 weighs around #18,500. I have bought a single axle dump truck to move it now, but used my f250 for a long time, and still use it on ocasion. I still use this truck to pull the Supertrack and ASV, sometimes with a root rake, 4 in 1 bucket and loftness cutting head.

I am in a very flat area, with little or no hills. I don't think my truck would do very well in hilly terrain. Once again, in NC, you buy GCWR.