Yet another toothbar

   / Yet another toothbar
  • Thread Starter
#21  
I don't think a kerosene heater would do it for me. The garage actually has in-floor heating and so the pipe doesn't freeze under the floor. The problem is the 8 or 10 feet outside. Temps here probably average -15 deg C in the winter, routinely go to -25 ish, and sometimes go as low as -40. An 8 foot long plug of ice frozen to -20C or lower is not easy to remove from a pipe! /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

I have actually thawed it out a couple of times by using a garden hose connected to the hot water tap (got running water in the garage ...) and slowly pushing it up the pipe from the outside. Makes a nice lake that freezes over later and takes over an hour to get all the way through, but if I really need the drain .....

Someday I might run a length of heating tape through the pipe so I can just plug it in to thaw if I need.
 
   / Yet another toothbar #22  
Do you like the in floor heating? I have been considering putting that in when I build my shop. In my dream world I consider floor heat for the shop with a loop also put in the drive so I could melt the ice and snow instead of plowing it.
 
   / Yet another toothbar
  • Thread Starter
#23  
I absolutely love in-floor heating. Since heat rises, when it emanates from the floor, everything in the whole place just seems warmer, even if the thermostat says the air temp. is the same as a forced air or radiant system would show. You also don't seem to get the severe temperature gradient you can get with other systems, where the floor and the air near it is cold and the air at the roof is much warmer, with the thermostat somewhere in the middle.

If you design the boiler and distribution loop system properly, it also gives you much better control of where the heat is applied. If I were building a new house the entire thing would be in-floor heating (you can even do it between floors of a house, in the spaces between floor joists) or hot water baseboard heaters with separate pumps or zone control valves for every room. I know of a guy that does that and also has his hot running water heated from the same boiler using a heat exchanger. The hot running water continuously circulates around the whole house in insulated lines so when you turn on a tap, you only wait for the stub line feeding the tap to run through before you have hot water. Nice system.

As for keeping your driveway clear, I have heard of it being done, but I would hate to see the gas bill, especially where I live! /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif
 
   / Yet another toothbar #24  
Brad,

I'm considering building my own toothbar. I understand that Markham Welding makes a fine product, but I'm all for saving a few bucks.
I have a couple questions, if you don't mind.

Did the 1/4" bar work out for you?
Would a different shank design have eliminated the need to notch out the bar? I found these on Ebay. He has many to choose from. click here

Thanks in advance,
KiotiMutt
 
   / Yet another toothbar
  • Thread Starter
#25  
I haven't used the toothbar too much yet, but it has held up to the little playing I have done so far. The shank (or adapter as they seem to be called around here) design is not a problem, it is just that in my case there wasn't much width available for the flat bar because of how the cutting edge was welded on the bucket. There was about 1/4" of space between the adapter and top of the cutting edge (thus the 1/4" flat bar) and if the top of the cutting edge happened to be flush with the rest of the bucket inside, I could have used a 4" or 5" width for extra strength and would not have had to notch it.

If it is possible for you, I would recommend what I did - load your bucket in the back of a pickup and go to some local places that sell teeth and adapters (try calling some heavy equipment dealers, vendors of skid steer equipment or attachments, etc.). The places I went were more than willing to let me take the adapters out to the parking lot and actually try them on my bucket to check the fit. I ended up having to get a size larger than I initially thought I wanted, but after getting it all built, the tooth size is actually about right.

If you have no source for adapters and teeth near you, then I would try an internet search for some manufacturers of said items and email or fax their sales department a description of what you want to do and a clear drawing (with dimensions) of your bucket edge and how you expect the adapter to fit on it. Hopefully they can give you some information of what type of adapter to use.

Here's some terminology I learned while shopping:

Underslung - an adapter similar in shape to what I used, except sort of upside down. The long thick part of the adapter goes under the bucket edge and the little hook part on top.

Flush Mount - an adapter that does not hook over the bucket edge at all. They are sort of like mine but without the bottom hook bit. This might be what you want if you were to build a shallow 'V' out of flat bar to fit over the length of your bucket edge and weld the adapters to that. They are called flush mount because when welded directly to a compatible bucket, the bottom of the teeth are flush with the bottom of the bucket.

Semi Flush Mount - these are what I used. The long thick part is above the bucket edge with a smaller hook under the edge.

Another note: If you don't have a reasonably heavy cutting edge welded or bolted on to your bucket, you will probably want to get one, or use a fairly thick flat bar to weld the teeth to. I can well imagine that hooking a single tooth on something would bend a bucket edge that isn't re-inforced. The cutting edge on my bucket is 3/4" thick, plus the flat bar holding the teeth is about an inch worth of steel to resist bending.

Good luck, and if you want some more specific pictures of my toothbar, or from different angles, let me know - it's no problem.
 
   / Yet another toothbar #26  
This place has a variety, with a smaller price tag teeth
 
   / Yet another toothbar #27  
Brad,
Thank you for the advice. Looking at the cutting edge on my bucket, I think I need to beef it up a bit. Looks pretty thin.

dummy, thanks for the link.

KiotiMutt
 
   / Yet another toothbar #28  
About a year ago I used my Agco ST35 with a Woods loader and toothbar to dig out my stone drive way in preparation for concrete. It was about 16' wide and 120' long of hard packed crush and run limestone. The toothbar allowed me to easily excavate about 5" deep. I did the whole driveway in less than 3 hours and even hauled it to my neighbors driveway in that time.
I didn't really appreciate how good you can dig with a FEL mounted tooth bar until last week. A house down the road was having a concrete drive put in that was about 50-60' long and 2 cars wide. The contractor was using a big 580 Case TLB. He would use the backhoe to scratch up the material and after he would go about 10' or so he would have to fold up the backhoe, pull up the outriggers, turn the tractor around and then scoop up the loose gravel. It took half a day to dig out that little drive. I couldn't help but think that a tooth bar on his front bucket would cut his time in half easily and paid for it's self on one job.
It gave me a whole new appreciation for tooth bars.
 
   / Yet another toothbar #29  
Gene your teasing me now. Just cuz I'm toothless. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif
I want one more than ever now.

KiotiMutt
 
   / Yet another toothbar #30  
I have used FEL's since the mid 1970's and all of them were toothless. We even had a big John Deere 500 TLB that was toothless and it was difficult to even scrape sod with. It wasn't until I bought the toothbar almost 2 years ago that I discovered how useful they are. You can't imagine how much easier you can dig. It makes it seem like you have twice the tractor. It is easily the most valuable option on my tractor.
In fact this weekend I am using a New Holland with an 18LA loader on it to tear out about 25' of sidewalk and then dig down about 12" and remove all of the clay ground in an area that is about 25' x 12'. I'm taking off the toothless bucket and using mine with the toothbar. I wouldn't even have taken this job without having teeth. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
 
   / Yet another toothbar #31  
I wanted to know how your toothbar worked out, I would like to build me one. What advantages do you have with one? Thanks
 
   / Yet another toothbar
  • Thread Starter
#32  
It has worked out really well, with one exception. I was trying to pry a big rock out of the ground and managed to put enough pressure on the toothbar (and in the right direction) to basically pull the middle of it off the front edge of the bucket. The sides were bolted on of course and stayed put so it bent the toothbar up pretty good. The fundamental problem is that the thin and narrow flat bar I was forced to use wasn't quite up to the task. I wanted to use something beefier but the weld seam on the bucket and thickness of the cutting edge I had to fit the shanks over prevented it. I've got the bar straightened out now and I will probably fit some thicker and wider pieces of flat bar between each tooth and weld it all up solid.

Aside from that one instance, it has held up well and proved to be very useful several times. I was doing a bit of landscaping and the bucket alone would barely scratch our hard clay. The toothbar cut in so well I went too deep a few times - just peeled up a nice strip of earth several inches thick without any effort. I highly recommend buying or building a toothbar if you have any need at all for ripping into the ground.
 
   / Yet another toothbar #33  
I was thinking of underfloor heating as my house is on piers. Not mainly for primary heat but for warm floors and possibly heating a swimming pool. Cost seems high to me ~4 grand for the system. What are costs up there?
 
   / Yet another toothbar
  • Thread Starter
#34  
I'm not sure, actually. The boiler was already here when we bought the house and I haven't looked into what they cost. I did have to re-do the plumbing, valves, pumps, etc. because it wasn't done quite right and I had to add another loop when we turned the old garage into an attached suite.

The cost of all that stuff was around $2000 CAD. That was 2 pumps, a bunch of 1" copper, a mixing valve, various manual ball valves, enough baseboard heater sections to go around a 19' x 27' room and various odds and ends. Pretty much everything except the boiler. The in-floor plumbing in the garage was also already here, so I don't know what that costs either. In any event, I'm guessing the boiler at around $2K, and given that you would have more plumbing than I had for the suite, $4K US doesn't sound totally out of line, although maybe a bit higher than I might have guessed if that is just for parts. If that is total price to get it all done by someone else, then it probably isn't unreasonable.
 

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