Yanmar / Tractor Newbie

[Soundguy]

I read the article about the boy on the International tractor. From the looks of it I don't think he would have survived if it had been a certified ROPS. If it was made to give, in the rear rollover it would have just folded up on him. I can see where it would be helpful in a side roll but not rearward.

Eugene

I tend to disagree. A rops may be made to 'give'.. but that may just mean flex.. it doesn't have to mean 'pretzle up'. Also.. if you look at many rops designs, they are swept back.. or at least mounted at an angle so that the backflip is stalled before full weight of the tractor is on the rops.. Once the rops can touch, if it is a case of a powered roll over.. like a tractor being used to pull something.. as soon as the rops touch, the rear wheels should start to unload and lose traction.. thus stalling the flip before 100% of the tractor weight is resting on them.. etc.

Still better than nothing in any event..

Soundguy

 

[normde2001]

I tend to disagree. A rops may be made to 'give'.. but that may just mean flex.. it doesn't have to mean 'pretzle up'. Also.. if you look at many rops designs, they are swept back.. or at least mounted at an angle so that the backflip is stalled before full weight of the tractor is on the rops.. Once the rops can touch, if it is a case of a powered roll over.. like a tractor being used to pull something.. as soon as the rops touch, the rear wheels should start to unload and lose traction.. thus stalling the flip before 100% of the tractor weight is resting on them.. etc.

Still better than nothing in any event..

Soundguy

I have never driven a HST tractor, ( I guess they got no clutch), so how can you stop a back-flip rollover on a HST the way you would on a geardrive tractor by stabbing the clutch, as I have had to do on several occasions?

 

[Soundguy]

Some hst do have clutches.. in any event.. I'd guess if you let up off the treadle, or forward pedal that the tractor movement would stop.. etc..( hitting reverse pedal?)

Soundguy

 

[pruntyc]

As most of you know, I bought a John Deere, HST. The moment I let off of the pedal it stops, just like I had hit the brake. Now if they all work that way I wouldn't know, but mine does. And yes I do miss my Yanmar, even if this one is made by Yanmar. I was kind of wanting a 2210, but my wife thought at my age, I should get a new tractor, so I wouldn't need to work on it much.

 

[dieselsmoke1]

IMO the young man from Iowa was killed due to misuse of the equipment....period. Tragic but it's a fact.

Regarding rear roll overs, I'd speculate it's extremely unlikely unless the operator misuses the equipment, ie. attempts to pull a load from a drawbar mounted to the lift arms in the raised position for example, chains a log to the tire to "walk" out of the mud, or an even riskier trick is to hook the tow chain to the linkage bar attachment point on the tractor. Have seen this done, no rollover but trashed the draft system.

If the load is properly hitched to a belly bar, or at least hooked to a drawbar that is stabilized below the axle's center of gravity, going to be dang near impossible to tip a tractor over backwards by pulling a load.

Other than those that would try to drive vertically up a 60 degree slope or pull a 15 ton trailer downhill with a 30 hp tractor or hitch improperly as described above or use some other creative method to gain leverage, there's probably more chance of being struck by lightning while sleeping than a rear rollover.

Moral here...hitch to your load correctly and the odds of a rear rollover reduce dramatically.

DISCLAIMER: THIS IS ONLY MY OPINION! POST ONLY INTENDED TO EDCUCATE!

 

[LMTC]

General comment, NOT directed to any individual or specific post. It seems to be a natural human tendency to want to ascribe reasons to a disaster so we can then say those reasons don't enter into our situation, thus we are safe. Sometimes there is blatant stupidity involved. Often there is operator error involved. Anyone here NEVER made an error operating machinery? I would agree that some are less in danger than others based on behaviors and skill levels. That doesn't mean it is not prudent to take what precautions can be taken. A ROPS is one such precaution.

 

[Soundguy]

I think we look for reasons for problems so that we can assess risk in future situations.. I.e. learning from our mistakes.

That's whey when a plane crashes and the NTSA crawl all over it and find out that it was a weak 'thingamajig'.. then they can go inspect other planes for that weak 'thingamajig' and hopefully use that data to save lives.

To make a blanket statement that the reason we try to determine the reason for a problem is just so we can self-deny it is.. well.. I think a very myopic viewpoint. While it may be true in some percentage of the pupulation.. i do not think it is indicitive of the majority.

Soundguy

General comment, NOT directed to any individual or specific post. It seems to be a natural human tendency to want to ascribe reasons to a disaster so we can then say those reasons don't enter into our situation, thus we are safe. Sometimes there is blatant stupidity involved. Often there is operator error involved. Anyone here NEVER made an error operating machinery? I would agree that some are less in danger than others based on behaviors and skill levels. That doesn't mean it is not prudent to take what precautions can be taken. A ROPS is one such precaution.

 

[normde2001]

"Regarding rear roll overs, I'd speculate it's extremely unlikely unless the operator misuses the equipment, ie. attempts to pull a load from a drawbar mounted to the lift arms in the raised position for example, chains a log to the tire to "walk" out of the mud, or an even riskier trick is to hook the tow chain to the linkage bar attachment point on the tractor. Have seen this done, no rollover but trashed the draft system."

Not necessarily, anything that stops the tractor when you have good traction will do it, such as catching your boxblade on an immovable root, and lifting the frontend. It's happened to me several times.

 

[LMTC]

To make a blanket statement that the reason we try to determine the reason for a problem is just so we can self-deny it is.. well.. I think a very myopic viewpoint. While it may be true in some percentage of the pupulation.. i do not think it is indicitive of the majority.

Soundguy

Chris, please re-read my post. I agree with the first part of your post, but not the latter. I did not say that "the reason we try to determine the reason for a problem is just so we can self-deny it is" (your post). I said "It seems to be a natural human tendency to want to ascribe reasons to a disaster so we can then say those reasons don't enter into our situation" (my post). Nowhere did I try to say that the purpose of denial is THE reason, solely and singularly, nor did I say it is JUST so we can self-deny. Nor do I think that. However, I do think those are factors, and that there is a definite tendency on the part of many people to think that way...it's the "it couldn't happen to me syndrome." My statement was carefully and specifically worded so as NOT to be a blanket. Perhaps it would have been more clear if I had said "It seems to be a natural human tendency to want to ascribe reasons to a disaster so we can then say THAT SOME OF those reasons don't enter into our situation, thus we are safe". Even on re-reading it, I don't think it proposes a myopic viewpoint.

 

[roxynoodle]

Yeah, I've been asking a lot of experienced tractor operators if they have ever come close to a rear rollover and it may be more common than I would have thought. Sure, some people are doing things that are not a good idea. But, several people have told me they had a tractor "stand up" a couple of times for reasons like Norm described. No one goes through life error free. Experience helps but does not make you immune. I know I need operating experience but I'm trying to learn everything about safety that I can so that hopefully I can avoid at least some mistakes. Someone posted on the safety forum a little while back about his father in law falling into the auger of a post hole digger. He was 70 years old, had farmed and used tractors all his life, and yet he got off the tractor and tripped, causing the accident. Of course he should not have gotten off the tractor with the PTO running. But, I bet he had dug dozens of post holes in his life and figured he would be ok. This might be a case where experience allows us to do careless things. Last year I put new siding on my house. I was terrified of falling off a ladder. I always made sure it was steady and I went up and down slowly. My neighbor who does construction came over to help me get housewrap on the second story and he was standing on one foot leaning way out and the ladder was going sideways. He would also move the ladder by jumping it while he was on it. Stupidity? I thought so! But he was someone who had done this numerous times and hadn't had an accident. Of course some of us are riskier than others too. I guess my point is everyone knows experience makes a big difference, but just because you have a lot of experience and haven't had an accident, practice good safety anyways. Accidents can happen to anyone at anytime. If we knew they were coming we wouldn't be doing whatever caused them!