Why no Ecoboost in the F250?

[deezler]

By the way, Stellantis' Hemi V8 is about to be replaced by an inline turbo 6 across the board. And GMC has a turbo i-6 coming as well, to outcompete their own top-dog small-blocks. But these are relatively small displacement 6 cylinders, with heavy turbocharging. Great for light-load passenger vehicles, still too highly stressed to be desirable for daily heavy towing applications.

 

[timswi]

In my opinion and experience (dyno testing engines daily for an auto supplier) the main reason would really just come down to packaging in the engine bay.

A chevy small block v8 can get to 8+ liters displacement in a 400 lb, compact package. Try to get an inline 6 engine to 7 or 8 liters of displacement.... it will be nearly twice as long (deep) as the v8. Ford has come around with designing and introducing the 7.3L pushrod Godzilla motor.
Chrysler/RAM has stuck with the cummins B engine for several reasons, mostly because it just kicks a$$ (too bad it has to come with a chassis and interior designed and assembled by Stellantis).

Don't get me wrong, the Duramax and Scorpion are huge engines also. So frickin tall... can't stand how tall the hoods have to be on new 2500/3500s because of this. I have often wondered about how compact, lightweight and efficient a GMC 2500HD could be if the entire truck was just optimized around the small block motor ONLY. No stupid duramax to add so much space, cooling capacity, suspension and controls for, etc etc. No offense to anyone who loves their duramax; but when a gas small block can tow 20+ thousand pounds already with excellent reliability and decent fuel economy, forget the hulking diesel already.

I agree with most of what you're saying except the MPG's of gas vs diesel. My 1500 6.2's never had a problem pulling 10k but they only got 6MPG doing it where my DMax 2500 gets around 13 or better depending on conditions and whether I run it hard and tow haul mode destroys mileage. I had to use it in the 1500's. The 2500 I can shut it off on the interstates.

 

[deezler]

I agree with most of what you're saying except the MPG's of gas vs diesel. My 1500 6.2's never had a problem pulling 10k but they only got 6MPG doing it where my DMax 2500 gets around 13 or better depending on conditions and whether I run it hard and tow haul mode destroys mileage. I had to use it in the 1500's. The 2500 I can shut it off on the interstates.

Yes, this is very true for all 1500s vs 2500s from 2015 and prior. But from my perspective the situation has changed a bit now, especially with $5.50 diesel while gas is $4 or less (here in Michigan anyway).

A new F250 7.3L gas will generally be within a couple mpg of the much more complicated, expensive to buy, fuel and maintain 6.7L scorpion for cruising and towing loads under ~12,000 lbs now.

A new GMC 6.6L gas has a similar comparison to the L5P duramax. They are really close.

It sucks that EPA regulations for diesel emissions have choked them so far from maximum efficiency, but it is what it is. 8 and 10 speed transmissions and better tuned manifolds, cyl heads and fuel injection have brought the gas motors really close to diesel in efficiency under load. Without the complications of a huge heavy motor with turbos, all the extra plumbing, emissions aftertreatment, etc.

By the way is anything wrong with your 6.2L? lol. My '03 6.0L LQ4 with 4L80 trans can still get 8-9 mpg with a 10k trailer load. But also still gets 9 mpg with my 5000 lb camper (aerodynamics mean a lot more than weight at highway speed).

 

[hiddentacocatneddih]

Diesel trucks died in 2007

I wouldn't buy anything newer if I wanted it to last

 

[blee03]

Diesel trucks died in 2007

I wouldn't buy anything newer if I wanted it to last

Ummmm....
My 2012 is still running like a top... 260k miles

She still runs out nicely too, puts a smile on my face every time!

 

[timswi]

Yes, this is very true for all 1500s vs 2500s from 2015 and prior. But from my perspective the situation has changed a bit now, especially with $5.50 diesel while gas is $4 or less (here in Michigan anyway).

A new F250 7.3L gas will generally be within a couple mpg of the much more complicated, expensive to buy, fuel and maintain 6.7L scorpion for cruising and towing loads under ~12,000 lbs now.

A new GMC 6.6L gas has a similar comparison to the L5P duramax. They are really close.

It sucks that EPA regulations for diesel emissions have choked them so far from maximum efficiency, but it is what it is. 8 and 10 speed transmissions and better tuned manifolds, cyl heads and fuel injection have brought the gas motors really close to diesel in efficiency under load. Without the complications of a huge heavy motor with turbos, all the extra plumbing, emissions aftertreatment, etc.

By the way is anything wrong with your 6.2L? lol. My '03 6.0L LQ4 with 4L80 trans can still get 8-9 mpg with a 10k trailer load. But also still gets 9 mpg with my 5000 lb camper (aerodynamics mean a lot more than weight at highway speed).

I tow about half of my trips in the PA mountains--Tons of steep back road hills. My neighbor's 6.2 Ford 2500 only gets 14 empty and he drives very conservatively. I think He said towing his 14' tandom with maybe 2k on it--he gets maybe 10 MPG.

My GM 6.2's were fine just gas hogs towing heavy--High RPM runs up hills and the like. My Dmax doesn't care one bit. Much less stressful that's for sure.

 

[deezler]

It makes sense that most of our opinions on gas vs diesel are formed based upon experiences in the trucks and feedback from other owners, that primarily consist of results from prior to these newest generation of gas trucks.

The ford 6.2L, GM 6.2 and 6.0, and FCA 5.7 and 6.4 Hemis are all pretty reliable, strong motors - that drink a lot of gasoline when towing. They are saddled with 4 and 6 speed transmissions that required a high ratio final drive to achieve decent performance. My 6.0L LQ4 has a 4.10 gear, which helps for towing, but has the engine running 2500+ rpms on the freeway in 4th (top) gear.

With ford's 10-speed torqshift 10R140 trans, you can now get a 3.31 gear with the 7.3L godzilla in the F250/F350, and still tow like a boss. I want one.....

 

[Slowpoke Slim]

I tow about half of my trips in the PA mountains--Tons of steep back road hills. My neighbor's 6.2 Ford 2500 only gets 14 empty and he drives very conservatively. I think He said towing his 14' tandom with maybe 2k on it--he gets maybe 10 MPG.

My GM 6.2's were fine just gas hogs towing heavy--High RPM runs up hills and the like. My Dmax doesn't care one bit. Much less stressful that's for sure.

I've had my 6.2 Ford for 10 years now. I'd like to know how your neighbor is getting 14 mpg, unless he's being towed behind another truck.

I think my "better" average unloaded is 12.5 mpg. And that's driving it like there's a raw egg on the gas pedal and I don't want to break it.

Don't get me wrong, I love my truck. But it is what it is, and 14 mpg 'aint it.

 

[Hay Dude]

It makes sense that most of our opinions on gas vs diesel are formed based upon experiences in the trucks and feedback from other owners, that primarily consist of results from prior to these newest generation of gas trucks.

The ford 6.2L, GM 6.2 and 6.0, and FCA 5.7 and 6.4 Hemis are all pretty reliable, strong motors - that drink a lot of gasoline when towing. They are saddled with 4 and 6 speed transmissions that required a high ratio final drive to achieve decent performance. My 6.0L LQ4 has a 4.10 gear, which helps for towing, but has the engine running 2500+ rpms on the freeway in 4th (top) gear.

With ford's 10-speed torqshift 10R140 trans, you can now get a 3.31 gear with the 7.3L godzilla in the F250/F350, and still tow like a boss. I want one.....

Gas wont tow heavy with a diesel. Not even close. And the fuel mileage will suck down more gas to the point where the gas cost advantage is lost.
For me, it’s all about towing, and there aint a gas truck in existence that will tow over 40,000lbs weekly.
I’m left with the obvious choice. Diesel power.
Look at GCWR’s on diesel compared to gas along with fuel economy. It’s not even a contest. Diesel engine lives a lot longer life than gas when used to it’s max capabilities.

Gas trucks were used in heavy trucks long ago. Mercifully, they are gone. There’s a reason for that.

 

[BravoXray]

Gas trucks were used in heavy trucks long ago. Mercifully, they are gone. There’s a reason for that.

Back in the '70s a local trucker used to run a Chevy 427 powered C60 or C70(I think) single axle tractor pulling a 3 axle trailer hauling steel coils between Chicago and Detroit. He said he got about 4 mpg loaded and 6 mpg empty. He bought a new one every other year as the 427 would be worn out. He said in the long run it was cheaper than buying a diesel tractor that was over twice the price.