Why do you hate MTD?

mwood · Apr 3, 2005

Well said Nate.

I think the big debate here is really more along the lines of bad machines for certian jobs. I would agree that those Cubs are nice machines. Having said that, I wouldn't recommend them to someone with 500 sq. ft of grass nor would I recommend them to someone mowing 3 acres of corse field grass. (and I don't think you would either). For those jobs you need a push mower / brush hog respectively. However, these were not the intended uses for the machine and therefore, the machine functions as intended for the appropriate application.

Some people need a garden tractor. I run a snow blower on the front of my garden tractor (20 year old JD 216) and put close to 400 lbs of weight plus my own 220 lbs on the back of that machine to ensure I don't get stuck more often than necessary. I wouldn't do that to a newer JD L series but I wouldn't worry about doing it to a GT or X series. It's all about the proper machine for the proper job.

Heck... i've used machines not intended for the job. I've broken them / messed the job up. Was it the machines fault? Not in my mind. And yes, some machines are just lemons it seems.

Instead of debating what brand it the best overall, can't we debate what brand / machine is the best for a particular situation? I think this would be much more helpful for newer members and those who are looking for helpful info...

Just my $0.02

BRIGUY · Apr 3, 2005

Just jumped on the mtd/yardman website product selector

http://www.yardmachines.com/bestmodel/index.jsp

when I select 2 plus acres Mowing, they do not have a recommended product.

No I didn't select ability to run ground engaging equipment. But the option is there.

Actually I don't think the website is working correctly.

GerardC · Apr 3, 2005

I think your right. Just went to their site and it does seem like it's not working right. Kind of odd the way it is working.

LBrown59 · Apr 3, 2005

( I think your right.

 Just went to their site and it does seem like it's not working right. Kind of odd the way it is working. )
*******
Just like their tractors! 

 Couldn't pass that one up,Sorry.

LBrown59 · Apr 3, 2005

( Well said Nate.

I think the big debate here is really more along the lines of bad machines for certian jobs. I would agree that those Cubs are nice machines. Having said that, I wouldn't recommend them to someone with 500 sq. ft of grass nor would I recommend them to someone mowing 3 acres of corse field grass. (and I don't think you would either). For those jobs you need a push mower / brush hog respectively. However, these were not the intended uses for the machine and therefore, the machine functions as intended for the appropriate application.

Some people need a garden tractor. I run a snow blower on the front of my garden tractor (20 year old JD 216) and put close to 400 lbs of weight plus my own 220 lbs on the back of that machine to ensure I don't get stuck more often than necessary. I wouldn't do that to a newer JD L series but I wouldn't worry about doing it to a GT or X series. It's all about the proper machine for the proper job.

Heck... i've used machines not intended for the job. I've broken them / messed the job up. Was it the machines fault? Not in my mind. And yes, some machines are just lemons it seems.

Instead of debating what brand it the best overall, can't we debate what brand / machine is the best for a particular situation? I think this would be much more helpful for newer members and those who are looking for helpful info...

Just my $0.02 )

***********
1*I think the big debate here is really more along the lines of bad machines for certain jobs.
2*It's all about the proper machine for the proper job.
3*some machines are just lemons it seems.
4*can't we debate what brand / machine is the best for a particular situation?
mwood
--------------
1*There isn't a suitable job for a lemon like my MTD WARDS PowerCraft.My issue is lemon VS non lemon rather than matching machines with task ; which is a whole different ball game.
2*The matter of a product being a lemon has nothing what so ever to do with matching machines with jobs.
3*IE my Wards MTD.
4*Yes but only for machines which aren't lemons

LBrown59 · Apr 3, 2005

( Half of the guys I know are independents the other half work for or own reputable dealerships. They all have the same opinion.

 I don't want to bash any one who purchases a piece of lower end equipment to maintain there property. It is AMERICA. If it works for the intended purpose then great.

1*It Just seems odd to debate the quality of Hot Dogs VS. NY Strip steak.

2*You will never convince me that Hot dogs are better.

I promose not to try convince any one that NY strip is better.

)

*********
1*A lemon is a lemon is a lemon. It don't matter whither it's NY Strip steak or a hot dog.
2*If one pays for a hot dog shouldn't he get the hot dog even though it's not NY Strip steak???
I never even got the hot dog !

 How does the fact that my wards MTD is a lemon right from the start translate into it's improper maintenance on my part????
Also how does maintenance cure a defective product or design flaw?

Steve_Miller · Apr 3, 2005

This is my two cents worth, not pointed at you Gerard. If you don't do your homework before buying your probably not going to come out with an A+ machine unless you fluke it. Your chances of getting a lemon are low but they exist. Every machine will mow the lawn, it depends on the quality as to how long and how well it will last as well as how well you maintain it. All this arguing makes me think that some people want a top of the line mower for a bottom of the pack price, it just an gonna happen. If MTD kept selling the original Cub's and Troy models and dropped there own cheaper line who was going to fill the cheap line that the biggest majority of people want? Probably the competition and they were not willing to lose that market share. Using the Cub and Troy lines is well within their right to use as marketing tools as they own the names. If your not happy with the cheap products buy the better ones. Automobile manufacturers make dozen's of models of vehicles to try and capture as much market share as possible do they not? A $10000 car will get you there the same as an $80,000 one! /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif

P.S. I've own a rebadged Cub MTD for two years now. Its a 17HP hydrostatic drive with a 42" mowing deck and it has been fine for me so far. I also have a Yard-pro that I traded my KZ750 Kawi for 15 years ago that still runs like the day I bought it. I think it mows better than the new cub and its only a 14HP with a 42" mower. Its at my cottage and mows over two acres every week in the spring and summer.

Steve

GerardC · Apr 3, 2005

See link

GerardC · Apr 3, 2005

A $10000 car will get you there the same as an $80,000 one!

This is very true. The only difference is the level of creature comfort.

LBrown59 · Apr 3, 2005

( Well Said Jd. Also some people cannot afford the premium mowers. Which are without a doubt better machines. Of course some of the low end models of the premium brands are pretty much MTD types of machines anyway.

I am just glad that everyone does not have the same tastes and desires in life. Think about it.... there would only be one man and woman that anyone would want to marry, all cars the same brand/color, and maybe only one fastfood chain, etc....sorta scarey...

Ben

)

========
Here's the rub.
MTD has taken the premium labels and attached them to low end products which fools folks into believing they are getting a higher quality product than they are receiving.

I just can't condone this deceptive practice.

LBrown59 · Apr 3, 2005

( I think we are loosing sight of what is considered an MTD. Like I said in my post ealier on this subject I think this whole subject is set up to make MTD look like a mass producer of cheap inferior products and this is just not the case. They do make some cheaper, lower quality, mass produced, box store equipment. But they also make some of the finest lawn equipment on the market today. Lets not loose sight of the fact that MTD makes hundred of models of machines and lets stray away from plugging MTD as making nothing but cheap equipment. )
==============
 So where are they?
How about brands models and who sells them and where I can see or buy them!

gamble77 · Apr 3, 2005

Seems to me thats like saying since there is a bowtie on both the Corvett and Cavalier, the Cavalier should be an equal machine with the same performance...and we all know that just isn't true.

And people know this. They know that when you buy a Cavalier it isn't going to perform like the Corvett. If people can't figure this out about a $1500 mower compared to a $3500 mower then we as dealers, and MTD as a manufacture cannot be to blame. In other words MTD isn't liable for ignorance.

MTD has made a wise business decision by selling to "big box" stores, plain and simple. They also spend millions each year to invest money into some of the finest lawn equipment on the market.

I think there is a mower for each job, but if you buy a cavalier to go race at the drag strip on Saturday don't expect it to perform like a Corvett...

LBrown59 · Apr 3, 2005

( ( But they also make some of the finest lawn equipment on the market today. Lets not loose sight of they fact that MTD makes hundred of models of machines and lets stray away from plugging MTD as making nothing but cheap equipment. )

***Sorry, but from experience, I'm firmly convinced that MTD does exactly that; make cheap equipment.

I've never seen anything from MTD that I would confuse with a quality item. I don't mean to upset you, but I have to call it like I have seen it. It's sort of like Harbor Freight tools or Big Lots stuff. It is simply an inexpensive alternative. For the price paid, it may look like a bargain, but I have no desire to work on something every time I use it. To me, it isn't worth anything if I have to work on it and fix it constantly. )

===========
***I have to agree with you

No matter the badge

Bolens
Huskey
Troy built
Cub
Yardman
Wards Power Craft
MTD Yard machines
Ranch King

They're all the same

BRIGUY · Apr 3, 2005

( A $10000 car will get you there the same as an $80,000 one!

This is very true. The only difference is the level of creature comfort. )

HUMMMMM INTERESTING.

No difference in Safety ratings, Quality, longevity Or performance?

If this were the case everyone would be fighting over old Chevettes.

BRIGUY · Apr 3, 2005

Going to go out looking for a nice Pinto tomorrow.

Only difference is creature comforts right.

The Pintos had a five star crash rating right?

Don't need those cushy side curtain air bags.

I will not feel a thing when the Gas tank blows.

LBrown59 · Apr 3, 2005

(

And people know this.
1* They know that when you buy a Cavalier it isn't going to perform like the Corvett.
2*If people can't figure this out about a $1500 mower compared to a $3500 mower then we as dealers, and MTD as a manufacture cannot be to blame.
3*In other words MTD isn't liable for ignorance.
4** if you buy a cavalier to go race at the drag strip on Saturday don't expect it to perform like a Corvett... )
~~~~~~~~~~~
1*But at least GM don't try to trick the consumer by sticking a Corvet lable on A Cavalier.
2&3*I was in the housing business for over 30 years. I built my business based on eucating and serving the consumer not by milking the consumers ignorance.
4*I bought a Cavalier (spelled Wards Power Caft by MTD)and all I got was a U-Go.
Where is the ethics in that???

gamble77 · Apr 3, 2005

I don't milk things either, I tell people like it is...but if people go to Lowes to buy a lawn mower I don't have the chance to "educate" them.

Cub, In my opinion, doesn't try to decieve the consumer. They have 5 different ranges of "lawn mowers", not one range.

I really don't think this thread is going anywhere. I understand your frustration with MTD and the lemon you had, you have a right to. I just want to get my point across that I know that MTD makes great products because I sell them everyday. They put a roof over my head and food in my mouth. I can stand behind every MTD product that I sell with 100% confidence so long as I am selling the consumer the right machine for the job.

viking65 · Apr 3, 2005

LBrown59, I thought you might want to jump on this:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=71271&item=4370123173&rd=1

BRIGUY · Apr 4, 2005

Gerard

Come on, You must have started this thread for the entertainment value?

Are you really trying to convince guys who own higher end mowers that Walmart mowers are every bit as good.

Let's all face it a 900 dollar mower is much better than walking.

Will it begin to hold a candle to a 4500$+ JD, Wheelhorse, Kubota, Simplicity etc. NO WAY!

I have Used many lawn and or Garden tractors:

MTD
old Murrarys
Craftsman
Simplicity
Case
MF
Toro ZTR
Exmark ZTR
Kubota
Wheelhorse B Series
Wheelhorse C Series
Wheelhorse D Series
Lawn chief
John Deere
Bolens (Isiki)
Snapper
My (was my grandfathers) 1964 International Cud Cadet

I have done maintenance on several of the above to. So my opinion is based on experience.

To answer your origonal question

( Why do you hate MTD? )

I don't hate MTD products I just will not own or recommend them.

slowrev · Apr 4, 2005

MTD has taken the premium labels and attached them to low end products which fools folks into believing they are getting a higher quality product than they are receiving.

I just can't condone this deceptive practice.
//
Hasn't JD done the same with their bottom models ?
Green paint + Quality ?? well usually /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
Ben