USDOT number - What it means?

[john_bud]

Hi,

I have been looking over the CDL requirements and think they are understandable. BUT, now a requirement for USDOT number has hit the radar screen.

It appears that if a vehicle, load, fluids, driver + trailer and load actual weight are 10,001 pounds or greater and the use of the vehicle / combination results in gain, said vehicle needs to have a USDOT number on both sides of the truck along with company/person name. States have even put out guidelines that spell out that winning a contest, prize or award constitutes a gain and puts you into the commercial category. (!!?) Hauling sheet-rock on a trailer for your buddy also puts you in that category. Hauling your tractor to a buddies house to move a little dirt - commercial - even if you only get a cold one for your efforts! Hauling your tractor to your farm to mow your fields - commercial.

Seems crazy extreme to me, and I want to be the first to say I may have it all wrong. If anyone has some other examples of what kicks you into the category of needing a USDOT name, please post.

The real question is, for a private person hauling a tractor to a farm (which makes it commercial, apparently) and needing a USDOT number --> What does it really mean? I have not found a clear and understandable document that tells how life changes when you have that magic number on the doors.

Anyone able to de-mystify this?

Thanks!
jb

 

[Rara Avis]

Hi,

I have been looking over the CDL requirements and think they are understandable. BUT, now a requirement for USDOT number has hit the radar screen.

It appears that if a vehicle, load, fluids, driver + trailer and load actual weight are 10,001 pounds or greater and the use of the vehicle / combination results in gain, said vehicle needs to have a USDOT number on both sides of the truck along with company/person name. States have even put out guidelines that spell out that winning a contest, prize or award constitutes a gain and puts you into the commercial category. (!!?) Hauling sheet-rock on a trailer for your buddy also puts you in that category. Hauling your tractor to a buddies house to move a little dirt - commercial - even if you only get a cold one for your efforts! Hauling your tractor to your farm to mow your fields - commercial.

Seems crazy extreme to me, and I want to be the first to say I may have it all wrong. If anyone has some other examples of what kicks you into the category of needing a USDOT name, please post.

The real question is, for a private person hauling a tractor to a farm (which makes it commercial, apparently) and needing a USDOT number --> What does it really mean? I have not found a clear and understandable document that tells how life changes when you have that magic number on the doors.

Anyone able to de-mystify this?

Thanks!
jb

The two major regulations that you are dealing with are 383 and 390...

Regulations - Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration

Regulations - Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration

Your exemption is the following:

Farm vehicle driver means a person who drives only a commercial motor vehicle that is

(a) Controlled and operated by a farmer as a private motor carrier of property;

(b) Being used to transport either

(1) Agricultural products, or

(2) Farm machinery, farm supplies, or both, to or from a farm;

(c) Not being used in the operation of a for-hire motor carrier;

(d) Not carrying hazardous materials of a type or quantity that requires the commercial motor vehicle to be placarded in accordance with ｧ177.823 of this subtitle; and

(e) Being used within 150 air miles of the farmer's farm.

Farmer means any person who operates a farm or is directly involved in the cultivation of land, crops, or livestock which

(a) Are owned by that person; or

(b) Are under the direct control of that person.

If you don't meet this exemption, then you want to see of the following applies to you....

ｧ390.3 General applicability.

(f) Exceptions. Unless otherwise specifically provided, the rules in this subchapter do not apply to

(f)(3) The occasional transportation of personal property by individuals not for compensation nor in the furtherance of a commercial enterprise;

If neither of those apply to your particular case...You are in need of the USDOT number and all it entails...

By the way you are correct about two of your ops that would be designated commercial by a DOT agent, but only if you actually admitted that you were compensated for your efforts...NO COMPENSATION...NOT COMMERCIAL

 

[tlbuser]

As long as you stay in the state of Vermont and are hauling non-commercial, 10000 GVWR or less, no problem. A DOT number is not much more than a registration system. If you really think you need one, you gotta have a physical card to go with it.

Now, just for fun, let's say you drive over to NY and p/u a car/truck for your buddy. Technically, you are now a "motor carrier" and would need:
USDOT number (free)
Company name or not for hire placard (couple of dollars)
DOT physical card (~$100.00)
ICC motor carrier stamp ($300.00)
Yes, you would technically be a motor carrier because you do not have title to the vehicle you are towing!

 

[X24]

What if I was carrying an small excavator (6000lbs) to friends houses to do "good deeds" for them free of charge because I am such a nice guy? All together I would be almost 13,000lbs. What about my drivers license? Am I still covered with a regular license or would I need a CDL?

 

[john_bud]

Paul,

In the Great State of Wisconsin, it looks like I NEED (by statute) a USDOT number. Any intra-state commerce in a vehicle or combination vehicle grossing 10,001+ by actual weight.

Ok, assume that's true. When I get the number and paint it, my name and what not on the sides of the truck -->

1)what "extra stuff" am I expected to have, do, be, ect.
2)Do I need a log book, special insurance or?
3)Or is it truely just a registration, get it and forget it?



X24 - I asked your question differently. But the answer would be the same (I think!!) - you need a USDOT number painted on your truck. You are providing a service, hence you are commercial.

I read last night where NY state includes in the statues that "prize money and awards" makes you commercial. Haul your car to the race track -> better have a USDOT! Haul your boat to a Bass Tourniment --> better have a USDOT! Even if you don't win, the fact that they offer prizes means you were attempting to get them for compensation --> better have a USDOT!

The triggers seem to be any gain, even indirect gain. Like you buy an old tractor from ebay, unless you are only going to use it in parades -> you're commercial! Using it for any reason on a "farm" means you are intending to gain by having it, hence by hauling it you will have a gain. If you buy, fix up and sell old cars, tractor ---> even if not profitably or a hobby by IRS definition<--- the act of taking money makes it compensation and hence commercial by DOT interpretation.

At least, that's what my understanding it. Still trying to determine from experts if that's correct! It still seems crazy extreme and almost abusive.

jb

 

[Builder]

If anyone needed a USDOT number, I would think it would be me, but I don't have one. I haul loads of fill, broken concrete, construction debris, etc. and pull my trailer with my equipment around all the time.

Here's the "gray area" I think I could debate since I don't get hired by anyone else to carry these materials or pull a trailer. Only for myself. I think you guys could reasonably argue this point, too.

(c) Not being used in the operation of a for-hire motor carrier;


All that being said, I might register for one anway since I have always erred on the side of "better safe than sorry" and it's pretty much free of excessive cost..

 

[BarryinMN]

Not certain but I think the USDOT # is set up to inspect & audit. More than just commercial crashes.

License records, logs, Insurance, preventative maintenance records, DOT inspections, Medical cards, random drug testing, etc..

They have provisions for fines & penalties for any & all discrepancies.

 

[Reg]

If anyone needed a USDOT number, I would think it would be me, but I don't have one. I haul loads of fill, broken concrete, construction debris, etc. and pull my trailer with my equipment around all the time.

Here's the "gray area" I think I could debate since I don't get hired by anyone else to carry these materials or pull a trailer. Only for myself. I think you guys could reasonably argue this point, too.

(c) Not being used in the operation of a for-hire motor carrier;


All that being said, I might register for one anway since I have always erred on the side of "better safe than sorry" and it's pretty much free of excessive cost..

If your insurance company then decides that your truck is now COMMERCIAL and not PRIVATE, they might drop you or offer you a COMMERCIAL policy - "free of excessive cost..." might not be so )-:

 

[Builder]

If your insurance company then decides that your truck is now COMMERCIAL and not PRIVATE, they might drop you or offer you a COMMERCIAL policy - "free of excessive cost..." might not be so )-:

STATE FARM has me as "commercial".

 

[Skyco]

you need a USDOT number painted on your truck.

Sure it has to be painted? The company I work for has magnetic DOT placards/numbers- they are only put on the trucks when needed......otherwise they stay off.

Added in edit- just found this from FMCSA 390.21 "(d) Construction and durability. The marking may be painted on the CMV or may consist of a removable device, if that device meets the identification and legibility requirements of paragraph (c) of this section, and such marking must be maintained as required by paragraph (c)(4) of this section. "

So they do not have to be painted.