Tree selection when thinning / clearing

[AlanB]

Hi Folks,

I have about 10+ acres of heavy wet woods with 30+ years of untouched growth and underbrush.

It stays very wet in the wet times.

I want to thin / clear some areas to make them more usable as well as thin almost all of it so that more air movement and sunshine make it too the ground with hopes of drying the ground out a bit.

The dilemma I always face is I hate to take out the wrong or too many trees as that is for all practical purposes irreversible. Then again, if I bring it equipment to do it with, a mulcher or track hoe is on the agenda, I hate to miss an opportunity while they are sitting here to get it cleared and done.

Current thoughts are to walk the woods marking trees I absolutely do not want cut. Big large stable good condition trees.

I think I will also mark anything dead (it needs to come out)

Then I will select some mid size trees, and some smaller ones probably in some form of clusters or something so that I can get through with the mowers / trucks / bush hogs.

Then cut the rest.

I am also thinking of picking some building sites and just clearing them and stacking the stuff there for burning

We also want some ponds, to help with the water problems, and will clear anything in those locations, probably paint a big circle on the ground or mark a ring of trees with ribbon.

Is there a more logical or thought out something I am missing?

Oh, and I will probably mark all the sweet gums with those dang prickly balls and just get rid of them :thumbsup: I hate those things.

Thoughts appreciated, will try and post pictures but not sure how it will come out.

 

[treeman40]

Im a clearing contractor from cleveland tn and will be in clarksville next friday be happy to look at your project

 

[beenthere]

Get a trained forester in to help you make the decisions that you are outlining.

Someone with your woodlot interests at heart, and not the money you have in your pocket.

 

[Cedar Buster]

Sounds like you have a good handle on things.

Good preparation and planning are the key to a finished product that you're proud of. You don't want to be changing your mind while you or your contractor are clearing.

Establish your future goals (roads, ponds, building sites, etc.). Walk it. Discuss it. Plan it. Mark it. THEN clear it.

Cedar Buster

 

[tawilson]

I don't know how your winters are there, but round here it's a lot easier to plot and plan and mark property lines once the leaves are gone.

 

[MarkV]

Here in N. Georgia the state forestry department has been very good about coming and evaluating woodland property owned by our family. The have walked, mapped and provide written management plans for 4 tracts, 240 acres, so far. As you mentioned once the trees are taken down it is pretty much irreversible in my lifetime. I would see if the state offers any professional services you can utilize. After all you are paying for it already.

MarkV

 

[skipmarcy]

Alan - I live about 30 miles south of you in Houston county and I've been slowly cleaning-out my small patch of woods too, I have about 4 acres behind the house. I had several good-sized dead cedar trees still standing that I had a local sawmill cut into porch posts for my house - even though they looked old & gray and useless in the woods (kinda like myself !) they made some beautiful, red cedar posts and some 1x and 2x boards for some porch framing. There's a good chance you have alot of hickory saplings growing in your woods, the small stuff you want out of there, and there's a guy that occassionally advertises around here that will come purchase them - cut them himself. As you're probably aware they use hickory saplings for tool handles and chair making etc. I just mention this stuff as most people would just shove these items up in a pile and burn it. As for your gum trees and similar that you might want gone, sawmills will make ties out of most any tree so they have a little value if you feel like fooling with them - they use logs 8'8" long for ties. Our part of Tenn grows huge poplars - another tree that makes alot of ties or boards for siding. If you're lucky you might even have some nice walnut trees too - and no need to say that they are valuble too. There are alot of guys around this area with portable sawmills that could come and make lumber right on the spot too, if you can't/don't want to fool with transporting the logs. Just a few items to consider along with professional advice from forestry and other pros - they may not mention some of these things to you.

 

[EddieWalker]

I'm doing the same thing with parts of my land and I've come to to conclusion that 95 percent of what's there needs to come out in order to enjoy the remaining 5 percent. I keep everything that's 12 inches or thicker and take out all the rest. Then I'll go back and take out some of those too just because there are too many left. Instead of species, I go for what I like the look of. I hate sweet gums and their spikey balls that they drop, but love the color of them in the fall and how hardy they are. Once establlished, it's hard to kill one and they can be very attractive to look at.

It sounds like you are doing this for looks and to make the land more usable. I've never taken out a tree that I missed. In fact, I never think about it again once it's gone. For me, trees are like weeds and something that I have way too many of. Once most of them are gone, I can actualy enjoy what's left.

Smaller trees might turn into nice trees, but it takes so long and odds are very good that once you remove the trees around it, that it will fall over, or bend over on you. I tried that with some of my oaks that I had hoped would eventually turn into something I'd enjoy. But leaving them standing just meant going back and taking it out later on.

As for the ponds, be sure to consider what will happen to a tree that you change the soil conditions on by either drying out the soil or increasing how much water is there year round. Some big trees do not do well with change and will die on you in two years. That first year it makes it, but the second is when most of them die on you that are going to die. If you have one that you really like and it's massive, be sure to think about it's roots and what changes you will make. I've also found that some trees can handle heavy equipemnt without a problem, but then some, like my bull pines, are very finicky about soil compaction around the roots and damage to them. With those trees, I only take out the trees close to them with the backhoe, and I won't even let my dad to that because he's not gentle enough with the surrounding roots.

Good luck and be bold!!!!

Eddie

 

[tlbuser]

It stays very wet in the wet times.

I want to thin / clear some areas to make them more usable as well as thin almost all of it so that more air movement and sunshine make it too the ground with hopes of drying the ground out a bit.

Current thoughts are to walk the woods marking trees I absolutely do not want cut. Big large stable good condition trees.

I think I will also mark anything dead (it needs to come out)

Then I will select some mid size trees, and some smaller ones probably in some form of clusters or something so that I can get through with the mowers / trucks / bush hogs.

Then cut the rest.

I am also thinking of picking some building sites and just clearing them and stacking the stuff there for burning

We also want some ponds, to help with the water problems, and will clear anything in those locations, probably paint a big circle on the ground or mark a ring of trees with ribbon.

Is there a more logical or thought out something I am missing?

Sounds like you have some grading isues too. If you're not doing the work yourself, pick one. Mark the trees to keep or the ones to go, not both. Keeping a range of growth is a realistic approach.
As was mentioned, all of it can have value to the right person. Depends on whether or not you have the patience to wait on them. Firewood for sale may be an option for you too.

 

[AlanB]

Some pics, shop and truck shown for scale, representative of the area I want to clear out some.

 

[firedog]

I'm doing the same thing with parts of my land and I've come to to conclusion that 95 percent of what's there needs to come out in order to enjoy the remaining 5 percent. I keep everything that's 12 inches or thicker and take out all the rest. Then I'll go back and take out some of those too just because there are too many left. Instead of species, I go for what I like the look of. I hate sweet gums and their spikey balls that they drop, but love the color of them in the fall and how hardy they are. Once establlished, it's hard to kill one and they can be very attractive to look at.

Eddie

I've been working the same over the last few years, (not that I've got that big a place, I'm just slow). I was thinking just the opposite on tree size. Keeping the midsize and cutting the smaller & very large ones. Had a lot of big trees go down during H. Ike, but then again maybe that's what protected the smaller ones. I figure some of the larger trees are nearer the end of their life expectancy.

I know what you mean about sweet gums, the only thing I hate more are tallows.

Alan, once you get it thinned, it will definitely dry out. At least that's what I'm seeing.

 

[AlanB]

So at what diameter does a mulcher stop, or not be able to mulch, or is it a safe height of the tree?

As I think and look more and more I wonder if I need to have it selectively logged, then a mulcher or excavator come through?

 

[Eagleview]

I would use an excavator and mulcher in that situation . I think the trees would continually hang up and cause drama using a tracked mulcher . The foliage of the surrounding trees would catch the falling trees and create problems . I'm sure I will be corrected tho .

 

[tlbuser]

I'm sure I will be corrected tho .

A little optimism is good for one's soul and well being.

 

[DIRTROAD]

A little optimism is good for one's soul and well being.

HA HA!!:laughing:

 

[AlanB]

I have a logger coming out Friday to look at the place.

One of my friends thought if we logged it well I could come away with $50K, then I could purchase an excavator, and hire a mulcher to finish the cleanup.

Options, options, options, there are just so many.

 

[beppington]

Hi Folks,

...

I want to thin / clear some areas to make them more usable as well as thin almost all of it so that more air movement and sunshine make it too the ground with hopes of drying the ground out a bit.

I have almost the exact same situation: 60 acres, about 58 of which has been tagged "wetlands" even though many really huge OAK trees are growing in it.

If you go by my county's "progressive" folks ... read "environmental protection dept" ... i.e. hippies ... it's their belief that every single thing in the woods is natural, beneficial & should be un-modified.

And they can enforce this!

So, here you wouldn't be allowed to clear your forest just for "looks".

Fortunately, if the clearing/ modifications are for "genuine agricultural purposes", it's permissible.

So I'll be buying a cow

 

[DIRTROAD]

One of my friends thought if we logged it well I could come away with $50K,

If you are refering to the same ten acres that you mentioned in your original post, you will do well to get $2k out of it.

Just think about what you wrote for a minute. If it was that profitable to sell timber there wouldn't be a tree left standing in America.

You and your friend are badly mistaken!

 

[AlanB]

If you are refering to the same ten acres that you mentioned in your original post, you will do well to get $2k out of it.

Just think about what you wrote for a minute. If it was that profitable to sell timber there wouldn't be a tree left standing in America.

You and your friend are badly mistaken!

Same acreage, and I believe that number to be high as well, but I guess we will see what I am told tomorrow by the guy standing there looking at it.

 

[MarkV]

Alan, I think your friend is way high on his estimate unless things are way different in TN than N. Ga. Timber prices are in the toilet right now with many of the mills that use to buy saw lumber shut down. Most everything here is going for pulp prices. On top of that you want to selectively cut saving the best trees and making it harder for the loggers to work. You have also mentioned that the area is wet and I'll just bet you want to put some restrictions on how much damage the loggers do.

I hope I am wrong but if we were to start a poll I would guess $800 to $1000 per acre without knowing what you have. Now that is still more in your pocket than hiring someone to clear and burn. I hope you will let us know what they say.

MarkV