Tractor Performance: diesel vs gas

[genusCastor]

Howdy all, new to the forum here.

I'm planning to buy a smallish farm tractor, prolly less than 50 HP. I'm interested in opinions about the difference between diesel and gas engines, in regards to overall tractor performance. What preference do you have and why?

- djb

 

[WilliamBos]

Howdy all, new to the forum here.

I'm planning to buy a smallish farm tractor, prolly less than 50 HP. I'm interested in opinions about the difference between diesel and gas engines, in regards to overall tractor performance. What preference do you have and why?

- djb

Honestly, I would not touch a gas tractor with a ten foot pole. Fuel usage, spark/ignition system, torque, would be my biggest reasons why.

There are probably a few exceptions to the rule, but they are probably a small elite few.

 

[Egon]

You may just be asking an impossible question!

The answerer you are looking for is so vague as to be almost indecipherable.

 

[john_bud]

Howdy all, new to the forum here.

I'm planning to buy a smallish farm tractor, prolly less than 50 HP. I'm interested in opinions about the difference between diesel and gas engines, in regards to overall tractor performance. What preference do you have and why?

- djb

Gas tractors use 50% more fuel per hp

jb

 

[wolc123]

In the old days, a gallon of diesel contained significantly more energy than a gallon of gas, 20% or so better fuel economy was common. That is changing as the tree-huggers are forceing the use of lower sulfer diesel, and it probably wont be long until a gallon of gas can produce just as much work as a gallon of "environmentally friendly" diesel. This spring, I could get a gallon of gas more than $1.00 a gallon cheaper than a gallon of diesel, and this made a gas tractor cost effective for getting work done. I would not be suprised to see a comeback of gas tractors, or even more likely, natural gas in the coming years.

 

[WilliamBos]

In the old days, a gallon of diesel contained significantly more energy than a gallon of gas, 20% or so better fuel economy was common. That is changing as the tree-huggers are forceing the use of lower sulfer diesel, and it probably wont be long until a gallon of gas can produce just as much work as a gallon of "environmentally friendly" diesel. This spring, I could get a gallon of gas more than $1.00 a gallon cheaper than a gallon of diesel, and this made a gas tractor cost effective for getting work done. I would not be suprised to see a comeback of gas tractors, or even more likely, natural gas in the coming years.

Gas tractors will not be coming back. Gasser still cannot compete with the torque of a diesel, or the displacement of diesel engine vs a gasser of the same power.

1 gallon may be cheaper, but for those who farm, or even the hobby farmer, over the long run the diesel is cheaper. Also, no spark plugs, or wires, among other things, maintenance costs are lower.

 

[BobG_in_VA]

I almost hate to see questions such as "gas or diesel?". You used to be able to get more out of gallon diesel than a gallon of gas....who knows with ULSD what that end result will be on that score....It could almost be too close to call...as far as torque, diesels have it hands down....as far as maintenance, I find it almost a draw with the gasser a tad easier to maintain (I'm speaking of older gas iron that use battery/coil ignitions). In this regard, any decent shade tree mechanic can tune a 4 or even a 6 cyl gas engine....a well tuned gas engine stays tuned for quite some time (as they usually only turn up less than 1900 rpm to produce their HP and Torque). I can and have tuned a bunch of them, re-did a couple that had God only knows how many thousand hrs on them...carbs are easy to bring back to useful life...I can't say that about injector pumps....hope I never have to buy one of those... End result? who knows, I've got both gas and diesel...love em' all! just some thoughts BobG in VA

 

[jaybrad]

BobG, Do they still make gas tractors with carburetors? I haven't seen a carb on anything larger than a lawn mower or generator in a long time. Just one of those things I figured had been replaced on larger engines.

A like my little diesel a lot - and one of the reasons is fuel storage. Diesel is much less volatile.

I have fond memories of growing up crank starting the old gasoline powered International Super C (and others), but am glad to now be in the diesel world.

Jay

 

[WH401]

The only upside to a gas tractor is your not killing yourself as severly with the gas fumes.

 

[jaybrad]

The only upside to a gas tractor is your not killing yourself as severly with the gas fumes.

Ah, but I like the smell of a diesel (tractor) on a fall morning.

 

[genusCastor]

I figured this might be a loaded question.

Back in the 70s I grew up on a farm with a gas powered Massey Ferguson 35, and it served us well enough. But I haven't been in the tractor "business" since then. I know diesels are better for towing because of torque, but I wondered if it made much difference in a tractor. I'm not concerned that much about the difference in cost of diesel and gas, I'm looking more for performance. I have driven a couple diesel tractors, but don't have any long term experience with them. I've always thought of owning a diesel tractor, and when I started looking I pretty much ruled out gas engines. But I was wondering if I should or not.

And I should have mentioned that I am talking about a used tractor, not new. So I'm comparing 20~40 yr old diesel and gas engines here.

- djb

 

[WilliamBos]

Ah, but I like the smell of a diesel (tractor) on a fall morning.

I second that!! And you also do not have carb, points, or anything else to let you down. When thet gasser is running bad, the eyes start watering real quick!!

Deisel all the way.

 

[john_bud]

The only upside to a gas tractor is your not killing yourself as severly with the gas fumes.

It's funny how people confuse odor with harmfulness. You are 180 degrees off, gasoline exhaust fumes contain more harmful byproducts of combustion than diesel exhaust. You may like or dislike the odor of one, the other or both, but the gasoline exhaust is much more dangerous to your person.

 

[GaryCrowell]

Diesel all the way. There's a reason you can't buy new gas tractors anymore.

 

[jaybrad]

It's funny how people confuse odor with harmfulness. You are 180 degrees off, gasoline exhaust fumes contain more harmful byproducts of combustion than diesel exhaust. You may like or dislike the odor of one, the other or both, but the gasoline exhaust is much more dangerous to your person.

Gasoline exhaust: carbon monoxide (death)
Diesel exhaust: nitrous oxide (laughing gas)

You be the judge.

Jay

 

[RollTideRam]

What was the last gas tractor made? JC

 

[flusher]

What was the last gas tractor made? JC

Near as I can tell from the Blue Book, for JD 1973 was the last year for gassers (1020, 1520, 2520, 4030, 4230).

For Massey Ferguson 1977 looks to be the final year for gassers (MF-230, MF-245).

For IH the 284G the last gasser was offered in 1982.

Also in 1982 Ford offered the 2610, 3610, and 4610, its last gassers.

 

[Soundguy]

I'll add my 2 cents in.. Touching on somthing Bob G in VA said.

.. the older iron gasser tractors with a carb, coil, spark plug wires and points .. well.. they are just so darn easy to maintain.. A new set of copper wires.. and you are probably 5-8ys down the road.. a good set of blue-streak points and you are a few years down the road.. a good napa coil.. and? decades down the road.

I clean and regap my points tractors 1x per year if I notce a problem.. if no problem.. I don't touch them. I've got a couple with 4+ years on a set of points with no regap.. anda couple with 5ys on points with only 1-2 re-gaps... same with rotor and distrib cap / condensor.. 1-2x per decade.

If she needs a lil attention.. things like head gaskets and bearing shells are no biggie to deal with.. good static timing on a gasser is easilly done with a thumb test in #1 hole and turning distrib to/fro looking at points and spark.

I'd not hesitate to rebuild a gasser on my bench...

They generally start easier.. and if they need help.. start fluid isn't quite so dangerous to use.. by the time a gasser gets hard to start, usually an 80$ starter rebuild.. or 12$ set of starter cables.. and 25$ worth of tune up parts gets it to go.. that is untill the rings finally get loose in the cyls.. in which case you can rering and ridge ream for another few years or perhaps a decade of work.. then ya might need bearing sheels or possibly to hand lap a few valves.. then back for another few years of work.. etc.. etc.

A diesel ont he other hand... I woudn't try to rebuild one on my bench.. not without help anyway... more compression.. and the diesel injector pump isn't as easy to time as a saprk ignition breaker based distribuitor in my opinion.

I also wouldn't consider doing a 'partial rebuild on a diesel.. IE.. dropping rings or bearing shells into a gasser.. sure.. on a diesel.. all or nuttin..

As many are pointing out.. there is more than a dollar per gallon difference.. depending on specific fuel prices.. you are now looking at a 20-25% disadvantage against diesel.

On the flip.. diesels usually don't require as much tune up work... just keep the filters clean and the oil sump clean.. just like a gasser.. and they go.

However.. this ULSD thing is making me wonder. I just had to go thru the fuel system on my mower machine.. a NH 7610s.. all the way from tank to injector pump... plastic fuel strainer DISOLVED.. and orings got gummy and soft... Wasn't a super fun job.. and I'm not looking forward to doing it again soon.. or to my other diesel with virtually the same setup.. a ford 5000.

Most of my tractors are old gassers.. ones an older diesel.. and one a newer diesel.. have had other diesels as well.

I've found that any manchine you 'work' with.. you will work 'on'.. don't matter gas or diesel. .. switches go bad.. gauges go bad.. parts get bent or broke.. wires chafe.. connectors fall apart.. rats chew wires.. hoses and lines wear and age.. etc.. etc. don't matter gas or diesel.

I work on my diesel less.. but it costs more when i do... I tinker with the gassers more often.. and it's cheaper as i do it. they all have their pro / con. When i accidentally run a gasser out of go-juice.. i just dump more in the tank, hit the starter and apply some choke and go... on the diesel.. I REALY REALLY REALLY try not to run out.. to the point that i fill up befor ethe tank is much past 1/4.. it's simply no fun bleedin a cantankerous diesel.. some are esier or harder than others... sometimes they are easier to pull off once you run em' dry.

For small work.. under 50hp.. I don't mind working with a gasser.. for work over 50hp... I do tend to prefer a diesel. I primarilly mow with my larger diesels, and do loader or drawbar work with my gassers.

soundguy

 

[Soundguy]

I second that!! And you also do not have carb, points, or anything else to let you down. When thet gasser is running bad, the eyes start watering real quick!!

Deisel all the way.

Well sure.. if you don't know how to maintain a gasser.. a hands-off (diesel) is better for you... it's a pay me now/pay me later kind of thing.

Seriously.. anyone who thinks points are difficult.. really should learn how to work with them... then they will feel silly about being worried about them when they find out how easy they are to set and maintain. Good standard ignition or blue strak parts are leaps and bound better than cheaper parts like tisco.. etc. better nylon or phenolic rubbing blocks vs plastic.. etc.. A lil grease on the cam block / rubbing block leading edge.. etc..

spark plugs, points and other ignition components in a good running gasser will last years.. My dailey worker is a ford 850 from 1955... it's got a few oily spots and such.. but starts on the first bang of the rebuilt starter.. has good bluestrak points in it.. had the same set for 3ys with 1 cleaning, same wires for 3 ys.. same plugs and cap and condensor and rotor. i did recently remov ethe plugs.. wipe them with a hand towel, reset their gap and swipe a piece of cardboard thru the contacts and reinstall them... probably have to repalce them and the points in another few years.. maybee... Air filter.. oh yeah.. it's oil bath.. just takes 1/2qt oil to clean it / change it...

soundguy

 

[Soundguy]

What was the last gas tractor made? JC

Lets not forget cub cadet had a CUT gasser in the late 90's!

soundguy