The Ugly undeniable Truth

[NoTrespassing]

Do you guys know that there's a thread on global warming in the "friendly politics" forum? I won't be surprised if this gets closed.

 

[boggen]

due to such a large scale melting / freezing, and changing of water patterns / currents in seas / rivers. my support is simply. make sure data is collected, and is obtainable easily and un-altered. and with an attached "what my thoughts are info packet by folks that collected the data" to better grasp what may not be shown in direct hard core numbers. things get worse with the "grape vine" effect. internet has removed a lot, but it still is there in a good amount :/ i rather see data used for predicting actual weather minute by minute, within a 1 inch any place on planet. data is needed and constantly being recorded, from every place in the world, to even come close to that.

it does no good arguing over big picture's, if data is not being kept and recorded. air pollution / air sensors, air currents, etc... are also needed. and much more.

for a laugh... i am actually interested to see, a report, of what impact heavy traffic roads in surrounding area weather... does it produce a bigger chance of a storm or reduce one? more data...

 

[dave1949]

You have to laugh when the climate warming alarmists ...state so what if we are wrong, its 'only a few dollars" and it helps get us of fossil fuels. Except it is not a "few dollars" ...its billions of dollars wasted and false carbon trading economies being pushed that will eventually be exposed as being worse fraud than the mortgage fiasco that killed the economy a few years back. So if your wrong and CO2 from cars etc was just a blip compared to other uncontrollable factors, then you cost me and my grandchildren and their grandchildren an economy that actually has jobs and hopes. ...besides its all moot anyway China just got the greenlight from USA President to continue as normal until 2030 ...........building coall fired plants , probably using coal that is mined from USA ...so our little gas powered car impact is peanuts compared to China and we can do absolutley ZERO about them and even best case North America closing down everything would only slow thing down by one degree !!! Whoopie ...so lets just adjust and do our best without panic and silly billion dollar spending! Get the pipelines in place and stop the hypocrisy and panic. At least the oil from Canada is not blood oil like Argentina or Russia or Middle east !

I've never found the "who cares if it's wrong" argument to be suitable. It may make sense from a young person's perspective watching a bunch of old f*rts argue.

A lower carbon life is not an austere life. The electricity that comes from my solar panels works the same as that from the power company. We do need to lower our carbon footprints by some mechanism. Putting a market price on carbon and trading works to do that by letting the free market find the best and quickest solutions.

Denial-ism is political by nature. How else would you explain overwhelming support for fossil fuel subsidies, support for pipelines, unregulated fracking, etc. on the right while constantly undermining greener energy sources? You think conservative politicians care whether the electrons come from a coal-fired power plant or a solar panel? Most probably don't know what an electron is but they darn well know who contributes to their re-election. This is exactly what sickens the younger crowd.

At least China for the first time is owning up to its energy issues. I call that a win however small. The Chinese can't work miracles on energy anymore than we can. Globally the impetus is gathering to tackle the over-reliance on fossil fuels. That isn't happening because man-made global warming is some sort of a hoax orchestrated by Al Gore. Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.

 

[TCJatko]

I've never found the "who cares if it's wrong" argument to be suitable. It may make sense from a young person's perspective watching a bunch of old f*rts argue.

A lower carbon life is not an austere life. The electricity that comes from my solar panels works the same as that from the power company. We do need to lower our carbon footprints by some mechanism. Putting a market price on carbon and trading works to do that by letting the free market find the best and quickest solutions.

Denial-ism is political by nature. How else would you explain overwhelming support for fossil fuel subsidies, support for pipelines, unregulated fracking, etc. on the right while constantly undermining greener energy sources? You think conservative politicians care whether the electrons come from a coal-fired power plant or a solar panel? Most probably don't know what an electron is but they darn well know who contributes to their re-election. This is exactly what sickens the younger crowd.

At least China for the first time is owning up to its energy issues. I call that a win however small. The Chinese can't work miracles on energy anymore than we can. Globally the impetus is gathering to tackle the over-reliance on fossil fuels. That isn't happening because man-made global warming is some sort of a hoax orchestrated by Al Gore. Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.

Oy vey! Taxing carbon distorts the market. If "green" energy is cheaper, better, and more reliable, it will triumph. Do you really trust the Communist Chinese? You are truly naive.

 

[houstonscott]

Photos of Alaska: Then And Now. This is A Get Ready to Be Shocked When You See What it Looks Like Now. And yet many people still don't believe in the observable Climate Change Facts. Shame on you ! :thumbdown:

There was 10000ft of ice over North America. So what's your point? Latest science is thinking the warming that has been taking place for last 40 thousand years may be over and we are now starting to cool. The biggest point is CO2 and mans activities have nothing to do with cycles of warm and cold that have been happening for millions of years. Your photo's are evidence against man made global warming. HS

 

[KiotiKowboy]

So many of these so-called global warming scientists have been caught red-handed LYING. Why is this? Doesn't it make you just a little skeptical of their sky is falling BS?

Rest assured of one thing ....

Although mankind can make a mess, he DOES NOT HAVE THE AUTHORITY to destroy the planet. It will N E V E R happen.

 

[dave1949]

Oy vey! Taxing carbon distorts the market. If "green" energy is cheaper, better, and more reliable, it will triumph. Do you really trust the Communist Chinese? You are truly naive.

I do not depend on market principles to fix any long-term problem where profit is uncertain. The free market left to its own devices would destroy the environment. It did major destruction of the environment until regulations made that more difficult. It seems fossil fuels have triumphed for decades yet they are still subsidized. The Ag market is distorted by many policies and subsidies. The Govt. gave away land to homesteaders and granted 50-100 mile wide free corridors to the early railroads. There is a marked difference between market theory and actual practice.

I trust the Chinese to the extent that they are bound to global markets and need to stay in the good graces of their customers. The Chinese people themselves are pushing for green energy, environmental regulations and pollution control. That makes sense and they cannot achieve that without limiting their carbon emissions.

That speaks to the criticism about the deal made by Obama; that the Chinese were going to do that anyways. Maybe so, but to commit to it in public still has value coming from a major economy. Developed nations all want to reduce greenhouse gases, they have been playing poker on how to go about it and keep the most benefit for themselves. Nothing new there.

No need to roll out terms like naive.

 

[KiotiKowboy]

Gotta' love those government promises - lol.

How many agreements have been made with N Korea over the years? How many have they honored - ZERO.

As for China, I think too many people buy into the claim they are interested in playing fair. The fact is, they are our enemy. If they can bind the US into restrictive environmental agreements that harm us - they will.

 

[Steppenwolfe]

Leave it to the wing nuts to make this political. A picture paints a thousand words, unless you're blinded by your own narrow mindedness.

 

[RoyJackson]

They always have been, right back to some of the Founders who were for the most part, well to do folks. We forget the human side of our country's origins. Sometimes you have to wrestle with pigs.

Thanks for giving me a pass within my demographic cohort. This is a site mostly populated by rural Americans. That is the conservative stronghold and it often is apparent here on TBN. When I need reparative therapy, I look through the reader comments on the NYT's stories.

Well, you do need to sell your tractor, get rid of most of your electric devices (TV, computer, electric range, etc.) and go back to that austere way of living...at least you'd do your part in reducing the CO2 output.
But, I'll wager you won't do any of that above....typical of most liberals, all talk, no action.

 

[houstonscott]

Leave it to the wing nuts to make this political. A picture paints a thousand words, unless you're blinded by your own narrow mindedness.

The wing nuts who made it political are the man made warming nuts, looking to tax people, and control your energy use, and who think you can stop 99% of current energy production in exchange for some mythical green energy production. HS

 

[DarkBlack]

I got the OP's point wrong. I saw all the life giving water, and green oxygen giving vegetation in the photos, and thought that was the 'good'. Who would have thought he was pushing for dead lifeless ice and snow pictures

 

[dave1949]

Gotta' love those government promises - lol.

How many agreements have been made with N Korea over the years? How many have they honored - ZERO.

As for China, I think too many people buy into the claim they are interested in playing fair. The fact is, they are our enemy. If they can bind the US into restrictive environmental agreements that harm us - they will.

I wouldn't compare modern China to N. Korea by any means. I've had the experience of living in a repressed country similar to N. Korea and confess I don't understand why the people tolerate it as they do. Universal fear goes a long ways I guess.

I'm sure a good bit of that goes on in China too, but to a much lesser extent. They do love their successful entrepreneurs and see that isolation is not a winning strategy. Basically, capitalism has already won in China.

I wouldn't expect China or any global power to play any fairer than we do. You don't think that much of our diplomatic and assorted foreign affairs efforts are aimed at global market and military dominance? Heck, we spy on our friends and they spy on us.

 

[RedNeckRacin]

We can't predict the weather accurately what makes you think we can predict climate? Give me a dam break.

Last time I checked every living being exhaled CO2 and plants absorbed it to grow. Maybe you climate change experts should stop breathing to reduce your carbon footprint? Kind of funny how the hockey stick graphs all match too??