Subaru Automobiles

[kozal01]

"Initial Quality Survey". I'm not sure how to interpret that. Instances of immediate warranty work? New-car buyer satisfaction?

It seems strange to find Ram and Dodge at the absolute bottom of the list, Jeep well below average, then Chrysler at the very top of the Initial Quality Survey. I wonder what their research methods are. Worst case would be whoever pays the most for their listing.

I'm inclined to instead trust the statistically valid research findings from surveying a large number of existing owners, and reported in Consumer Reports as repair cost and owner satisfaction over time.

You're reading this backwards....

Chrysler is rated at the bottom for quality, not he top. This is number of issues per 100 vehicles.

Still, no way Ram and Dodge is on top though so I do question the validity of this as well.

 

[lman]

Seems odd that Ram and Dodge are at the top and Chrysler is at the bottom when they are from the same company.

I guess Cal beat me to that comment.

 

[Hay Dude]

Since I own a Ram, it’s 100% valid & correct.

 

[Hay Dude]

"Initial Quality Survey". I'm not sure how to interpret that. Instances of immediate warranty work? New-car buyer satisfaction?

It seems strange to find Ram and Dodge at the absolute bottom of the list, Jeep well below average, then Chrysler at the very top of the Initial Quality Survey. I wonder what their research methods are. Worst case would be whoever pays the most for their listing.

I'm inclined to instead trust the statistically valid research findings from surveying a large number of existing owners, and reported in Consumer Reports as repair cost and owner satisfaction over time.

Strike a nerve?

 

[Torvy]

Here's another explanation of why JD Power rankings are not really useful.

J.D. Power needs to rethink its Vehicle Dependability Study - Autoblog

J.D. Power's 2016 Vehicle Dependability Study suggests that cars are getting less reliable. Here's the problem: That's not true.

www.autoblog.com

 

[MossRoad]

That's INITIAL quality report. That's based on owner reports EARLY in the ownership period, according to J.D. Power.

Here is their 3 YEAR dependability report. Positions change quit a bit after 3 years.

Still, overall, that's a lot of complaints!

https://www.jdpower.com/business/press-releases/2023-us-vehicle-dependability-studyvds

 

[MossRoad]

Then we've got this to consider...

 

[MossRoad]

 

[buckeyefarmer]

I find the charts hard to believe, from my experience.

 

[IndyIan]

We had a couple complaints with our Outback, squeeky driver seat, and the silly screen acting up once in a while. They replaced the seat bottom, and updated the software on the screen, free of charge. Some people have an issue with the battery draining/dying so we got a letter from Subaru that we can get a free battery from them, which I haven't got around to getting yet.
They aren't perfect cars, but they seem to be trying to keep us happy which is working so far!

 

[California]

Then we've got this to consider...

View attachment 827643

I like this chart better.

 

[MossRoad]

 

[California]

You're reading this backwards....

Bah. I shouldn't try to post after midnight when I'm half asleep.

 

[MossRoad]

Reminds me of my high school driving test...

 

[MossRoad]

 

[Sigarms]

One of the biggest inside jokes in the HVAC industry is consumer reports and when they "rate" HVAC equipment per reliability.

Honestly, I've never put much faith at all in any reliability or quality "reports".

There is a phrase either I came up with or quoted (can't find it online), "percieved reliabilty vs actual reliability" (perhaps a spin off of interpreting data). I think some brands also rely on their image more than actual facts.

Long story, while ago (perhaps around 2016), took my 1998 toyota avalon up to Pa by myself for some reson (at least to visit my father back then). Car starting driving "weird" after 8 hours of driving with 45 minutes to go to my dads house. Keep in mind, the car had about 320k on it at the time. I took it to my "old local mechanic" around my dads place the next morning (he still remembered me about 20 years later LOL). I really do trust this guy, never left me hanging and always does what he says he's going to to when I lived in the area. Talking about cars in general and how happy I was with the Avalon overall (bought it at a good price with only 72K on it) he said something that floored me. He told me he saw a lot of stupidity from Toyota in their engineering process on parts on models after 2004 or 2005 that can cause a lof of issues, and he wouldn't buy one himself now. Perhaps Toyota has changed things since then, but here is a guy who works on cars 24/7, can pretty much fix anything (if it's worth fixing) and he was "bad mouthing" Toyota.

All that said, perhaps there is a person here who bought a brand new 2006 Toyota, still has it and NEVER has had a problem with the car other than average maintence.

No different than "chevy vs ford" guys and even orange vs green tractors.

I used to drive used VW's in my youth, my choice of car. That worked fine up North. Once I moved down south, I honestly swore off VW's to the local support I could find when I needed it (even through dealers). My local VW dealer up north was heads and shoulder's better than the local dealers I could find in NC. Point being, product support through the people selling the product also plays a role "quality".

Look at Kia. Long time ago they seemed to be a cheap joke. My supervisor just bought a brand new Kia Telluride (sp?) at a pretty IMO for his family. Go figure.

End of the day, the biggest question is if a product absolutely sucks and is garbage, exactly how do they stay in business selling a horrible product?

 

[Hay Dude]

One of the biggest inside jokes in the HVAC industry is consumer reports and when they "rate" HVAC equipment per reliability.

Honestly, I've never put much faith at all in any reliability or quality "reports".

There is a phrase either I came up with or quoted (can't find it online), "percieved reliabilty vs actual reliability" (perhaps a spin off of interpreting data). I think some brands also rely on their image more than actual facts.

Long story, while ago (perhaps around 2016), took my 1998 toyota avalon up to Pa by myself for some reson (at least to visit my father back then). Car starting driving "weird" after 8 hours of driving with 45 minutes to go to my dads house. Keep in mind, the car had about 320k on it at the time. I took it to my "old local mechanic" around my dads place the next morning (he still remembered me about 20 years later LOL). I really do trust this guy, never left me hanging and always does what he says he's going to to when I lived in the area. Talking about cars in general and how happy I was with the Avalon overall (bought it at a good price with only 72K on it) he said something that floored me. He told me he saw a lot of stupidity from Toyota in their engineering process on parts on models after 2004 or 2005 that can cause a lof of issues, and he wouldn't buy one himself now. Perhaps Toyota has changed things since then, but here is a guy who works on cars 24/7, can pretty much fix anything (if it's worth fixing) and he was "bad mouthing" Toyota.

All that said, perhaps there is a person here who bought a brand new 2006 Toyota, still has it and NEVER has had a problem with the car other than average maintence.

No different than "chevy vs ford" guys and even orange vs green tractors.

I used to drive used VW's in my youth, my choice of car. That worked fine up North. Once I moved down south, I honestly swore off VW's to the local support I could find when I needed it (even through dealers). My local VW dealer up north was heads and shoulder's better than the local dealers I could find in NC. Point being, product support through the people selling the product also plays a role "quality".

Look at Kia. Long time ago they seemed to be a cheap joke. My supervisor just bought a brand new Kia Telluride (sp?) at a pretty IMO for his family. Go figure.

End of the day, the biggest question is if a product absolutely sucks and is garbage, exactly how do they stay in business selling a horrible product?

Cheap price.

 

[Sigarms]

Cheap price.

I don't disagree with you at all.

The question becomes how do you determine what is a cheap price for the product in it's market vs the competition?

Even with cars, there are a lot of options that add to the price vs a base model.

I always thought Kia's were "cheap". Couple years ago went to a Kia dealer lot just to check out pricing, and almost fell over dead LOL

End of the day, owning any vehicle, I believe the reality is you're going to have a whopper of a service bill after so many miles even with performing standard maintence like clockwork.

For some reason, at in the the HVAC industry, sometimes people associate the warranty with the quality, which I've found isn't true.

 

[jmc]

He told me he saw a lot of stupidity from Toyota in their engineering process on parts on models after 2004 or 2005 that can cause a lof of issues, and he wouldn't buy one himself now.

IIRC, at some point back then Toyota was breathing down the back of GM as the largest auto company in the world. Word was that in Toyota's haste to overtake GM for the bragging rights, they made some mistakes. They might have even fessed up to it later, but I might have dreamed that part...

 

[Hay Dude]

IIRC, at some point back then Toyota was breathing down the back of GM as the largest auto company in the world. Word was that in Toyota's haste to overtake GM for the bragging rights, they made some mistakes. They might have even fessed up to it later, but I might have dreamed that part...

Toyota made a big gamble on hybrid vehicles. They might just win on that gamble.