Stalling an HST tractor

   / Stalling an HST tractor
  • Thread Starter
#21  
Can I ask what gear you were in at the time this happened???

XXXXXXXXXXX

Low gear (of L M H) with the 4WD engaged. Definitely running 2000 or less.

The Service Manager told me today that deisels were made to run from 2/3's rpm and up. If that is the case then I think the crank was making noise(s) from day one. I could not stand the thought of running that little motor up to 2500 or higher rpms. Sounded like it was gonna pop.

Maybe I should have said something to them way back 80 hours ago?

CB
 
   / Stalling an HST tractor #22  
I've stalled the HST on my B2710 a few times with no ill effects. More often I have killed the engine a mound of hard clay with the brush hog, or trying to dig with the FEL. In 900 hours and nearly 13 years no ill effects.

Yep, I tried not to do that very often, but I've stalled and killed the engine on both the B7100 and the B2710 with no ill effects. I've also gone into a load slowly enough on the pedal, but with plenty of RPM to stall the transmission without stalling the engine. But as jinman said, I never held it in that situation long enough to overheat anything.
 
   / Stalling an HST tractor #23  
Maybe I should have said something to them way back 80 hours ago?

CB


Don't even bring that up...you weren't sure and informing Kubota or the dealer could only muddy the waters.
Did you do your 50 hour service?
 
   / Stalling an HST tractor
  • Thread Starter
#24  
Don't even bring that up...you weren't sure and informing Kubota or the dealer could only muddy the waters.
Did you do your 50 hour service?



XXXXXXXXX

Yes sir. Have had it service twice since new. Just because I like to baby a new engine. Costs too much not too.

CB
 
   / Stalling an HST tractor #25  
Something had to be defective somewhere. In my opinion, there is nothing that you could do under normal operating conditions that would break a crankshaft. I mean, how many kubota rental machines are there that get thrashed on daily? Something had to be wrong from day one.
 
   / Stalling an HST tractor
  • Thread Starter
#26  
Don't even bring that up...you weren't sure and informing Kubota or the dealer could only muddy the waters.
Did you do your 50 hour service?

XXXXXXXXXX

They've been on this tractor three times since April of 2011 for various services and adjustments. If they didn't run her up a little during new tractor services at 50 hours then I feel like they certainly should have. They should have something at all dealerships to put a tractor through it's paces after servicing. Possible a weight to lift with the bucket and 3PH just to test the hydraulics. Maybe pull on something or drag something around the back lot to ensure HST or clutch is adjusted right and teh 4WD is engaging right. Just a thought. :)

BTW, what day is "Ladie's Day" at Kubota?

Chain Bender
 
   / Stalling an HST tractor #27  
Never thought of this as a possible problem until this thread. Several years ago we had a customer complain that a rental machine they got wouldn't climb like the previous machines they rented. This one was 50% heavier than the previous ones with only 10% more power. Job was compacting clay liner on landfills before filling, 50% slope. I flew out, instrumented the machine, and had no problem climbing the slope by watching the tach and feathering back on the hydro keeping the engine at full power. It was slow climbing, but I could do it. Then had them get their operator to show me how he did it. He started up the slope and as the engine pulled down, he would give it more propel lugging the engine down until it died. He kept doing this because on a car or truck when you need more power you press harder on the accelerator. I showed the operator the correct procedure but it was tough because he had this "need more power, give it more throttle" process ingrained. Couple weeks later I get an email from the dealer, engine now running bad, discovered broken crank. Sent a person from engine division to check it out, could not find a flaw in the crank so had it sent to metallurgy. They also could not find anything wrong but the crank was broke, and this just doesn't happen so give them a new engine. This just seems so odd. Lugging an engine is bad but I would have predicted bent or broken rods before broken cranks.
 
   / Stalling an HST tractor #28  
I can't see where lugging an engine down to a stall would prolong the life of ANY unit....The front half of the crank is being rammed down by a piston or two while the clutch end is suddenly stopped....????
 
   / Stalling an HST tractor #29  
Back in 1973 I bought a new Kubota B-something-or-other for landscaping work. There weren't a lot of Kubotas at that time.

After about 400 hours the engine froze up. All service and fluids kept up. Kubota bought the engine back and shipped it to Japan for inspection. I got a new engine out of the deal. Never did hear what caused it.

On my B3200 I run the heck out of it 2000rpm for pushing and fel work. The appropriate range is important to prevent stalls. It still happens on occasion.
 
   / Stalling an HST tractor #30  
XXXXXXXXXXX

Low gear (of L M H) with the 4WD engaged. Definitely running 2000 or less.

The Service Manager told me today that deisels were made to run from 2/3's rpm and up. If that is the case then I think the crank was making noise(s) from day one. I could not stand the thought of running that little motor up to 2500 or higher rpms. Sounded like it was gonna pop.

Maybe I should have said something to them way back 80 hours ago?

CB



I bet the problem was there before you stalled it and that just pushed it over the top..:confused2:
 
   / Stalling an HST tractor #32  
.


.
Mental note to self: Don't stall the engine, again...



.
..
 
   / Stalling an HST tractor #33  
I have got to say this.. I have never stalled my Hydro tractor (125 hours now). I can see stalling it when running the PTO.. but I don't see how to stall it thru the Hydro and wheel driveline.. I suppose if you put it in high and rammed a pile of dirt or gravel? I do 90 percent of my work in Low.. and this might be because of where I live on such hilly ground. When I had a Hydro New Holland I used mostly for mowing I used Med. Except for FEL work. But If I go into a pile that will not move (or a tree) the tires will still spin even with 750 lbs on the back and loaded tires or the Hydro pump will go into relief if the traction is superb. I have never had the motor bog down enough to even think about stalling. Tell me again how do you stall a Hydrostat equipped tractor? I truly don't understand. And did not think it possible.


James K0UA
 
   / Stalling an HST tractor #34  
You can stall it when you run the engine at low RPM. The engine will start lugging before the relief valve opens or tires slip. If you keep RPM above 2000 it will work as you describe.
 
   / Stalling an HST tractor #35  
You can stall it when you run the engine at low RPM. The engine will start lugging before the relief valve opens or tires slip. If you keep RPM above 2000 it will work as you describe.

Ok cool, I guess when I have come up to something that might not move I must have always gave it some fuel. Thanks

James K0UA
 
   / Stalling an HST tractor #36  
I must have a good cranks in my tractors, I have stalled my B2710 and JD 6675 skid steer so many times (about half from my wife, does not like high RPM due to the noise) I am not able count them. Both running as good as the day I bought them. The B2710 is easy to stall no matter what rpm you are running if you try to get a bucket full of gravel, I have never been able to let off the trans pedal fast enough to recover once rpm drops when operating the FEL.:eek:
 
   / Stalling an HST tractor #37  
Interesting thought on keeping the RPM's up, but wouldn't the engine be at idle speed just before it stalls no matter what RPM it was operating at previously?
 
   / Stalling an HST tractor #38  
Interesting thought on keeping the RPM's up, but wouldn't the engine be at idle speed just before it stalls no matter what RPM it was operating at previously?

No...a stall at a higher RPM doesn't reduce the engine speed to idle. The engine "dies" at the stall. Then it spins down (inertia) rapidly.
 
   / Stalling an HST tractor #39  
I am also confused. Wouldn't there be more force at play (and consequently more damage) from a high rpm stall? High RPM should make it harder to stall leading to few stalls over time which is good. But each time it does stall how would it be better for the tractor?
 
   / Stalling an HST tractor #40  
I am also confused. Wouldn't there be more force at play (and consequently more damage) from a high rpm stall? High RPM should make it harder to stall leading to few stalls over time which is good. But each time it does stall how would it be better for the tractor?

Operating at a higher RPM (more torque and HP being produced) lessens the probability of stalling...doesn't prevent the possibility of stalling 100%, just much less likely to happen.
But yes, as there is more energy being produced, a stall at higher RPM could result in more damage to the engine.

I cannot ever recall stalling an engine at high RPM, but I have stalled more then a few at lower RPM. BTW, I'm not writing about tractors here...these were motor vehicles (mostly manual transmissioned trucks I wasn't familar with and mostly when first engaging a gear).
 

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