Security Systems

[buckeye]

Has anyone had any experience with security systems? We had a door-to-door guy come by our house the other day representing ADT. Although ADT is a well known company, I was wondering how well these work. My basis for concern centers on the "wireless" operation of the unit they presented. I was wondering if it is difficult to scramble or fool this system.

We are getting ready to build a new home and the thought of adding a security system has come up several times. Any input you all may have would be most appreciated.

Regards,

Buckeye

 

[Bird]

They work so well that 96-98% of all alarms are false alarms (and I'm not talking specifically about ADT, but all brands)./w3tcompact/icons/laugh.gif

 

[MossRoad]

I've installed several. Two were hard wired and one was wireless. The hard wired never had any problems. The wireless had occasional problems with low batteries about once every year and a half.

The nice thing about ADT type companies is the monitoring feature. One drawback is that they are monitored over land phone lines. Any burglar worth his weight cuts the phone line before proceeding to burgal. Some of these companies now offer Cell Phone monitoring. Seems like a nice feature. I'll bet it can get very pricey, though.

If you don't want to spend alot of money, just get a system that will blare several loud sirens outside and flash the lights off and on in the house. It is not monitored, but scares the burglar out of the house.

 

[RanchMan]

I'm a firm believer in the "wired" version - we've had both.

Can't say that anyone ever successfully "jammed" our wireless system, but I'm sure some smart guy out there could figure out a way.

The problems we had with our wireless system included "flakeyness" of reception from transmitters (e.g. sometimes when you opened a door or window, it wouldn't register), and "falsing" - e.g. receiver picked up some "wild" signal from somewhere.

Our builder included "prewire" for a security system as part of the purchase of our last house. You can still get a problem crop up from a bad sensor or something, but I believe it is a lot more secure & reliable way to go.

 

[Knight9]

We had a hard wired system installed in our new house. We certainly don't pay to have it monitored as the thieves would be long gone by the time anyone made it to our place in the country /w3tcompact/icons/frown.gif. So we just set it up to blare REAL loud!!!!

Kevin

 

[LilRhody]

I work in law enforcement. Alarms are worth it. It may just 'slow' a thief down, however, (IMHO) nine out of ten times it will scare them off. I have a monitored system that is hard wired. Because of where I live, I could never get any cell phone reception; so, it was pointless to look into that option (and I did not want to spend the $$ on a satellite system). I have dealt will ADT alarms (my dad used them for awhile, along with numerous other private and commercial agencies), the only draw back that I have found with them is a lengthy delay between the activation and the notification. I have been informed that everything is routed through phone lines to a central dispatch system in Texas. I have encountered 20+ minutes of a gap between tripping the alarm and calling the police.
One other nice feature about an alarm system, is that you can 'shut off' certain zones at night. This is great for my house. Due to its design (a 3000', multi-level contemporary) we can never hear what is going on from one end of the house to the other. Having the alarm set at night makes for a nice security blanket. Furthermore, an alarm reduces our home owners insurance. And as noted above, any good crook would cut the phone lines, but, with a battery back-up and a siren installed in the attic...it makes one heck of a loud noise...

 

[EarPlug]

There are 2 basic parts to a "security system" - the part that detects the intrusion and the part that provides the alarm an/or notification.

The better choice for the detection is the hard wired. It is much easier to check the integrity of the system then with wireless devices. To do it right you want to protect ALL openings not just the doors and not just the first floor. Many companies will try to sell you just the doors and then motion detectors for the interior. Motion detectors have a couple of problems - can't use them with pets, they are more likely to false alarm, and do you really want to wait until the bad guy is inside to set off the alarm?

Building a system like this is not cheap. But you can save quite a bit by pre wiring while the house is under contruction.

The second part, alarm and notification, has multiple issues also. You can set up sirens, buzzers, bells and lights to go off when an alarm sounds. A light or strobe is a good idea since it helps the resopnding police (or fire) find your location easier.

The notification or monitoring is a big issue. You can use either a phone line or a cell phone or the best is both. Phone lines can be cut and the cell can be a back up.

The monitoring company is probably the most important part. However, there are just a couple of major monitoring companies. The big boys like ADT have their own monitoring center. Smaller local security companies usually contract with an indepentant regional or national monitoring center. All companies want to sign you up to a long term contract. Avoid this if you can! If the company provides bad service you want to easily be able to change.

Also watch out for upgrades. They are usually very high profit items. The $99 special system are not a bargin. It is just a way to sign you up for a long term monitoring contract and get in the door to sell the upgrades.

There is a term used in the alarm business - F.U.D. - Fear, Uncertainty and Deception. Let the buyer beware, get mutliple quotes and check references.

Jack

 

[Anonymous Poster]

Since I happen to be in the alarm industry currently, and have been for over 20 years, here's the deal. ADT, once a fine name, in fact, one of the industry pioneers, has been bought by a mega holding company, and the name is being whored. ADT now sells the use of their name to any halfassed installer who will pay to use it.
WWW.DSCLTD.Com, will get you to the site of DSC manufacturing, where you can access enough information to learn a lot about alarm systems. www.amcest.com will get you to a site where you can find a dealer installing for American Central Station monitoring service.
Nearly all alarm monitoring is now done by nationwide companys, rather than local dealers as it was 20 years ago. Alarm monitoring costs the dealer anywhere from $2.50 a month to $10.00 per month for basic monitoring service. This is a per account rate, and monitoring for multiple signals {fire, burg, freeze, sump pump} from a single transmitter does not cost any more per month.
The cost of a combination control/transmitter, with keypad and battery is less than $200-. PIR {passive infrared} detectors cost the dealer less than $25 on average, and smoke detectors cost less than $25 as well.
Secondary transmitters that operate on celular phone systems shouldn't cost you more than $300 extra on the install, and about another $200 a year for monitoring.
Medical alert systems with either a wristwatch or pendant system are also available, and do not cost a lot either.
The alaarm industry has been invaded by hustlers, pimps and ******, and in a lot of cases the buyer would be better off dealing with a burglar.
Do NOT get sucked in by $99.00 installation specials, they are a scam.
There is NO magic in how alarms work, and the installation of an alarm system isn't hi teck either. Most are installed by 19 year old kids working for about $6.50 an hour. In my area, drug testing would yield 80% of the installers are potheads. Yothink they don't talk about your system and goodies to their fellow potheads?
By the way, I'm close to retirement, and am pretty fed up with what a fine industry has turned into. If you have questions, post them, and I'll answer as time permits.

 

[Will]

I installed a hard wired system in my house. It has been totally reliable. It was easy to get high quality parts, it was fun learning enough to do a decent job, and it was a lot cheaper doing it myself. The wireless installations I've seen are pretty clunky looking compared to the invisible magnet activated switches in the window sills.Here's a trick if you are worried about intruders cutting your phone line: find the most likely spot they'll cut the phone line (probably between your outdoor phonebox and the ground) and move the line to some spot that is less obvious. Not much of a trick so far, but here's the fun part - stick a loop of wire from your alarm system down the piece of conduit that used to hold your phone line. Now when they cut your phone line, they're only tripping the alarm!

 

[Anonymous Poster]

Buckeye,one thing you might want to try when having your Phone Box installed.Have it placed on the inside of your foundation wall (basement),bore a hole through the concrete with the angle of your bit pointing upward toward the inside of your basement,make the entrance of the line below the backfill level.This approach will keep water from draining into your hole,keeps your phone line and box out of sight,making it very tough for a thief to cut your access.

Have a system that besides the usual sensors in the main level windows and doors,also has "Glass Breakage" sensors on stationary widows.These sensors are tripped by noise.

About 2:00 A.M. the alarm goes off,VERY LOAD SIREN,one outside and one in the basement,I grap my 9MM and head downstairs knowing some SOB has just broken into our home.

When I get downstairs,after checking all the windows and doors,turned on all the lights,nothing seems out of place.I find my wifes pager laying on the Kitchen floor (hardwood).She had laid it on top of the island bar earlier that evening.Somebody paged her,thing started vibrating,falling off the bar and hitting the floor,Bingo.

 

[JoeR]

I agree with M Reeter on glass break sensors. A friend of mine used to install high tech security systems in nuclear power plants, and he hit on some key points. It is best to detect the intruder before he/she breaches your security perimeter. A glass break sensor technically lets you know before they have entered. Whereas, magnetic sensors let you know the perimeter has been violated. If you have a long driveway, you may want to install a driveway sensor to let you know when someone has pulled in. Most thieves are lazy, and bring transportation to their crime scene. The best defense was a dog... A dog can hear someone prowling outside, long before a security system would detect the presence of an intruder.

Personally, I wired my home security system. Since it was low voltage, it was not part of the inspection and the builder didn't mind me doing it myself. I installed a driveway sensor, and that was the best purchase!! I know when people have entered the property long before they are knocking on my front door!!!

Good Luck,

Joe

 

[neilw]

Many years ago our home was robbed a few days before Christmas. All that was stolen was a few new presents under the tree and our sense of security.

We purchased a wireless state of art system from Rollins. We had an assortment of problems with false alarms and battery failures. We felt more secure and the problems were not that often or anoying.

Most of the problems we had were operator caused. IE: forgot to turn off before going out for the paper and then standing in the front yard wondering who the idiot was who's alarm was going off.

I've come to believe the most important part of any alarm system is the sign in your yard or the alarm permit taped to your window. If you've got something someone wants badly enough they will get it. But the casual thief is put off by the sign.

 

[dmccarty]

buckeye,

Get a dog. /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif

I know its not possible for all people and certainly nobody should just
get a dog to protect the house. A pet is a HUGE responsibility that should
not be taken lightly.

Even though one of our dogs has cancer and likely won't live out the year
once she is gone we are going to get another. We have two dogs now down
from three. While they can sometimes be a royal PITA, they are wonderful
to have around the house. I have been wondering if we would ever get
anymore dogs but they are such wonderful companions and really do provide
good security. After that little girl was taken from here home in CA, whatever
doubts I had about having dogs was removed. As long as we have a kid(s)
then we are having dogs.

Our house will be a good 1500 feet from the nearest neighbor and at the end
of a road with a gate. I want the family to have some noise makers and
sensitive ears running around the place both when they are outside or inside
the house. I know that as my daughter gets older she will want to walk the
woods by herself. I'll feel alot better knowing that she has at least a couple
of big dogs running around with her.

This weekend I took my GSD to the property while I worked. Normally, I don't
do this because I don't want her getting near the equipment. She did ok though
I had to yell at her a few times to get away from the backhoe. A car drove past
my gate and no tresspass signs while I was working with my back to the road.
Kelly alerted on that car which let me know someone had drove past the gate....

We will have a hardwire security system that makes noise but I put most of my
trust in dogs..... /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif

My Two Cents...
Dan McCarty

 

[buckeye]

Thanks for everyone's input. My parents have a hard-wired system that is not monitored by a service. Regardless, it has kept them from being robbed several times. It just seems that so many things are wireless now and I was concerned about thier security, no pun intended. We'll prabaly put something in and we will be getting a dog. Once again, thanks for all the input.

Jim

 

[Anonymous Poster]

Or better yet, two or three or maybe even five or six!

 

[hwp]

From my perspective, there are two equally imporant parts to a security system - intrusion and fire. In many ways the most effective part of the intrusion aspect is the alarms that sound upon an unintended entry. There are three motion detectors wired into my system that I have disabled because I tend to do things at odd hours and if the motion detectors are not disabled, I have to turn the system off. I didn't do this on a number of occasions and set off the alarm system. Our dog, a Great Dane, would also set off the motion detectors as he also wanders around the house during the night.

The fire detection aspect is important particularly when no one is home. I have hard wired stand alone smoke detectors, required by city bylaw, and smoke detectors as part of my security system including a heat detector in my garage. In case of a fire, the fire department is called automatically whether someone is home or not. Having had one house fire caused by a wind downdraft in the furnace when we were not at home, I wouldn't be without a fire monitoring system.

 

[MReeter]

Dan,I echo your sentiments of owning a GOOD Dog.We have a Female GSD that's about 18 months old.Sadie is my 7 year old sons CONSTANT companion.She now sleeps in his bedroom in her own spot.

I truly pity the poor Fool that might even think about bringing harm to this boy.She is turning out to be the most loving,loyal,and protective dog we have ever owned.

We will never be without another Shepherd...Period.

 

[snowman]

Around 1980 or so, a door to door security alarm salesman came to my parents house; no idea what company it was.

My parents had no interest in it and didn't buy anything.

Within a week, the house was burglarized. I have no doubt that the salesman was the one that did it. May have been a scam whereby they were posing as alarm sellers just to get inside the house to see if the house did have an alarm system.

In the 40+ years that they lived there, that was the only time they were burglarized.

 

[Wal]

<font color=red>Get a dog</font color=red>

Absolutely agree with your statement.

 

[benewton]

Concur with the dog(s).

But get a weapon too...

Detection is one thing, resolving the problem another.