Review and Issues

nater · Sep 4, 2002

Sorry it has taken a while to post my initial review of the PT422, but I thought if I held off for a little bit, I could also post some issues, and get your feedback on them, as well.

Ordered the whole package, with overnight delivery, on a Wednesday afternoon, and no kidding, by 7am on Thursday the delivery guy was parked out in front of the house just itching to unload it and head back to VA. Our order included the 422, bar tires, canopy, 48" tow behind trailer, 48" finish mower, 48" brush hog, stump grinder, big and small bucket with teeth, 60" hydrolic blade, 60" rake, core plug aerator, 48" boom lift, forks, post hole digger with 12" auger and an extra quick attach plate. I must tell you it was an impressive site to see all of that equipment on the delivery trailer. As he was unloading it all into the garage (Filled one WHOLE side of the garage!!/w3tcompact/icons/shocked.gif), a group of eying neighbors began to form across the street. (It was GREAT!!)/w3tcompact/icons/king.gif

Of course heading into the office was NO LONGER in the plan for at least that morning, so I jumped on the machine to see what it would do. Keep in mind that I bought ALL of this site-unseen, and based it off of all your recommendations, and especially, Moss's website.

First thing that needed modification was the seat stop on the slide adjust. Being 6'3", it just felt a little on the cramped side. Found that by simply loosening the nut on the right front side seat mount, the L-bracket stop could be swiveled out of the way, gaining at least an additional 2" of rear travel on the seat. This REALLY helped a ton, and it I fit perfectly.

First thing to try was the 48" finish mower. I didn't go with the 60" based on your recommendations related to hills and the power reduction. Don't know if that this was the best decision. The mower does a GREAT job, basically as good as any I have ever seen, but the edge trimming aspect of the 48" falls short. Since it is only as wide as the tires on the machine, there is no trimming overhang. This makes it very difficult to get into the arched landscaped areas. Guess that is why they make weed wackers. /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif

Next up was my first try at digging with the bucket. This was where I really first felt that I may have made a mistake with this machine, or I was just not cut out to be a "digger-Dan". I could not dig up enough dirt to even cause concern for the worms. I stopped and went to re-re-read the forum posts on how you guys recommend to dig and found the wiggle technique. Worked great!! I am not the diggin master, but I can now hold my own. I can't recommend enough to purchase both buckets, and the teeth for the small one. I have used them more than I EVER thought I would. Have moved well over 100 tons of pulverised dirt and I can't even estimate how much mulch and woodchip piles have been relocated with the PT. The large bucket is awesome for back grading, and you can get a differnent look and performance depending on the angle of the bucket when you drag it back.
Issues with bucket:
1. When carrying a FULL load of dirt downhill in the big bucket, there is a very annoying squeal that seems to be coming from the front wheel motors. I have re-greesed everything and changed the hydrolic filter, but it the noise is still there. I made sure the parking brake (Another issue below) wasn't rubbing against the wheel. Anybody have any suggestions, or have you experienced this. It drives me nuts!!

Next came the mighty brush hog. We have about two acres of wetlands behind our property, with 6' weeds and nasty hawthorne trees. My wife watched my head into one side of this jungle and dissapear. She said all she could see was weeds and trees falling down and flying everywhere. In a couple of minutes, she saw me appear coming out on the other side. This piece of equipement is AWESOME!! It needs to be treated with the utmost respect, as it has power beyond belief. You truly need to take EVERY safety precaution when using this!! It easily shreds up to 3" trees, cutting them off at the ground and basically mulching it up. I am now on my THIRD set of blades!
Issues with brush hog:
1. The discharge path from the mower PACKS the front of the machine with debris. This is especially a problem with the front left wheel. The hydrolic motor well is packed so tight, it is hard to get that stuff out of there. Need to put something in the way of that opening or change the discharge path to the side.
2. The front tires pneumatic tires on the brush hog, and basically all of the attachements, SUCK. I had gone through 4 sets of repaired tires, using PT's suggestions to over-inflate, and changing the down force, but nothing worked. Finally, I had PT send me the poly filled tires, and have NEVER had any problem since. I then had a local tire shop change ALL the tires to poly fill and could not be happier with the results. I believe that even though they are physically heavier, PT should just include poly-filled tires as standard.
3. The blade mount configuration causes the blades to hit the extra bolt heads everytime you engage the PTO. I always engage it at the lowest RPM, but the blades still suffer quite an impact.

Next up was the stump grinder. To be honest, this does the job, but I should have held off on this as I we don't have enough stumps to justify this. It worked great for the 30-40 3"-7" stumps we had, but now that they are gone, it will not be used. If anyone is interested in purchasing this, please let me know.
Issues with stump grinder:
1. I know this has been discussed, but the rotation of the blade kicks everything back at the tractor and the operator. Not a huge issue, but really need to be careful with the angle of attack.

The plug core aerator is really worth every penny. We have all clay and really needed to get some moisture into the ground. Additionally, after heavily coring the entire lawn, I put down about 1 inch of pulverized soil over everything and the core holes ended up being filled with the new soil. The plugs are at least 3+" deep and the unit is built to last forever. Each spindle has easy to reach greese zerks.

The boom lift has been tested on EVERYTHING that CAN move in our house. It has been another tool that I can't live without.

Amazingly, I have not tried the forks yet. Not terribly exciting, but I will let you know if any issues arrise.

The 60" rake has been used so much that the tines bend in multiple directions. It is awesome to be able to sink the teeth into the ground an inch or two and pull back across the yard. It has provided a very effective way to get grass seed into a clay bed. NO complaints with this.

Overall issues and observations:
1. The stearing wheel is WAY to thin for this type of machine. I got a speed ball (clamp on type) and this has made all the difference in the world. Without it, my hands would hurt after a couple of hours of use.

2. The engine is LOUD! I would love to hear if someone has been able to quiet it down. Not sure how much is muffler and how much is just plain engine noise.

3. After several flat tires, from those darn Hawthorns, I filled the tires with Slime. I recommend doing this right away.

4. NOTE: The hour meter advances WITHOUT the engine running. If you leave the key in the one position, the hour meter is advancing. I must have left the key in the on position before we went away for a weekend and.......just an excuse to do the early filter and oil changes. PS: Running Amsoil synthetic now./w3tcompact/icons/grin.gif

5. Under lower RPMs, when you accelerate, it sounds like a BB or ball bearing is rattling around in the wheel motors. Has anyone else had this?

I will try and post some of the pictures taken over the last two months, and keep you up to date. Planned modifications will be starting soon, so I will post those as well. Thanks for your continued assitance, encouragement and advice.

Nate

Nate

nater · Sep 4, 2002

One more small issue:
The parking brake on the PT could really use a redesign. I continually have to pull it up since gravity wants to pull it down. There should be some kind of two position lever lock that would keep it in the on of off position. Additionally, this would allow the tension on this holding nut to be backed off a bit.

deadstick · Sep 4, 2002

Nice review, thanks for the info.....

Were the poly filled tires the same as what you normally get or are they different. I have the 60" mower and had the tire deflate once but would be interested to know if I could poly fill these?

Funny about your handbrake. I have the opposite problem. Mine is so darn tight I have to use my foot to push it down (disengage it)

duane · Sep 4, 2002

Nater,

I kept hearing a clicking noise when first using my machine, and found out it was the parking brake rubbing on the front slotted wheel rotors.

I would call PT regarding the squeal which seems to be coming from the front wheel motors. Post and let us know what they say.

I still love my PT422.

Duane

MossRoad · Sep 4, 2002

WOW! That's quite a package. /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif

I have to agree with the others, my parking brake is very hard to disengage, especially if I step on the treadle before engaging it. I then have to turn the wheel side to side while pulling up on the lever to get it to come out.

I always take the key out when I leave the unit. Too many people might be tempted to test drive my machine /w3tcompact/icons/wink.gif

I hear the same noise at low RPM that you describe. Kind of sounds like ball bearings clicking in fluid. To solve this, I up the RPMs [smart]

bmac · Sep 4, 2002

Nater,

Thanks for the review. You may have read that I am seriously thinking about a Power Trac so reviews like this are very helpful.

One attachment I was wondering about was the core aerator. My soil (if you can call it that) is very hard, red clay. I was eventually going to ask anyone if the core aerator could penetrate this stuff. From your comments, it appears as though it can. If I may ask, how do you top dress after aerating? What to you use to "sweep" the new dirt out so it is smooth and level and fills all of your newly formed holes (from the aeration)?

Excuse this stupid question, but what do you use a boom lift attachment for?

Finally, after considering all of the issues you have had (good and bad), do you have any regrets about your purchase? Would you do it again or recommend this machine to others?

Thanks

bubenberg · Sep 4, 2002

welcome nater, for this time i think everything has been said. so i just want to add good luck and many happy and constructive hours in the saddle!

hrl

pajoube · Sep 4, 2002

Nate,
Great review and congratulations on your new PT. You answered many of my questions as I read through your review. Looks to me like you will now need to build a barn just to store all that equipment{wink}
Keep us up to date on your progress with each attachment and tractor issues. These reviews continue to solidify my decision to purchase the PowerTrac {smile}
PJ

PTRich · Sep 4, 2002

When I first got my machine the parking brake would slowly work it's way done, I got in the habit of constantly checking it. It wen't away after about 50 hours but my habit of checking it when ever I hear a clicking noise has not.

PTRich · Sep 4, 2002

1. The stearing wheel is WAY to thin for this type of machine. I got a speed ball (clamp on type) and this has made all the difference in the world. Without it, my hands would hurt after a couple of hours of use.

I stick my finger in the wheel and spin it, this was hard at first because I was always taught to keep your thumbs out of the steering wheel or you will break them. I even drove my car like that.

2. The engine is LOUD! I would love to hear if someone has been able to quiet it down. Not sure how much is muffler and how much is just plain engine noise.

I keep ear protection on the steering wheel, I put them on soon as I start the tractor. It has become habit now. Another quick note, I always where my seatbelt now no matter what. I have been nearly ejected twice, the roll bar stoped me and left me a nice badge of courage on my head.

3. After several flat tires, from those darn Hawthorns, I filled the tires with Slime. I recommend doing this right away.

I have can fill my tires with air and reseat them with my hands in just a few minutes. I am going to put slime in them as soon as I remember when I am at the store.

4. NOTE: The hour meter advances WITHOUT the engine running. If you leave the key in the one position, the hour meter is advancing. I must have left the key in the on position before we went away for a weekend and.......just an excuse to do the early filter and oil changes. PS: Running Amsoil synthetic now.

Did not know that, I have a long cord on my key. I take it out when I turn it off. I also us synthetic, I don't know if it makes a difference but it makes me feel better.

5. Under lower RPMs, when you accelerate, it sounds like a BB or ball bearing is rattling around in the wheel motors. Has anyone else had this?

Never noticed before, I will check. I usualy do not run a low rpms, the speed of the hydralics changes to much.

I loved your review, perhaps you could post it under tractor reviews?

nater · Sep 4, 2002

deadstick,
The poly tires are the same ones as you have on the 60" mower. It cost only $20/pair to have them poly filled at the local tire store, and it took 3 days to get them back. The nice thing is that unlike foam-filled, they will always keep the correct shape and never develop flat spots.

It sounds like the handbrake is an issue with many PT owners....some tooo tight and others too loose. I will mention a possible fix to the PT guys. If they bless it, I will post it with some drawings. Should cost less than $5.

Nate

nater · Sep 4, 2002

duane,
I did check if the brake was rubbing, but it has at least a half inch of clearance.

I will call PT about the squeal and post thier reply.

nater · Sep 4, 2002

bmac,
The core aerator is awesome. Yes, it does bore out cores even in the hard clay. To assist the depth of the core, I have my wife turn on the sprinkler for a couple of minutes just before I go over it.
I overseed with a good grass mixture and then spread a thin layer of pulverized black dirt over the holes and use the large bucket to drag backwards over them. The dirt packs down very well into the cored holes. I am going to try and do this every other week for the remainder of the fall season.

Trust me that I consider NO question as stupid. My decision to purchase this PT took over a YEAR! And about drove my wife to the funny farm.

I have no regrets and would buy the 422 over the 425 again. I realize that the Kohler engine has a lot of fans, but I acutally visited both factories (Kohler and Robin). (Now you can imagine my wife's state of mind) /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif The Robin engine's oil pump moves 4 times the amount of oil as the Kohler, resulting in a lower operating temp of at least 25 degrees. Since the machine is so simple, and engine parts are available directly from the regional rep, I have all the confidence in the world in handling any service issues myself.

What I would do different is hold off on the trailer and the stump grinder. I would probably have instead ordered the trencher and the seeder/spreader. The trailer and the stump grinder are built extremely well and perform as expected, but I just don't see us using them very much from now on.

Yes, you have my 100% recommendation. You will NOT be dissapointed with this machine. It will continue to impress you with every task you throw at it. I find myself willing to tackle projects that I would never have considered before.

nater · Sep 4, 2002

PTRich,
Thanks for the tips that you use. I will definitely use some of them.

Where do I find the tractor reviews?

bmac · Sep 4, 2002

Thanks for the reply, nater. Down here in the deep south, the prevailing grass is hybrid bermuda (no seed available - must be sodded or plugged). There is a company down here that does core aeration and top-dresing with sand/top-soil mixture. It was going to cost me about $4000 to have just my front yard done (probably about 1/3 acre). Ouch. They claim that when they are done, the yard will look like a golf green. May take more than one treatment to get this result if the yard is real rough when they start. Needless to say, I passed on this. But, I was wondering if I could get reasonable results by doing it myself. The core aeration is straight forward enough, I just wasn't sure how I would get the top-dressing smoothed out. Back-dragging a wide bucket sounds like a good place to start. Would the 60" rake help work the sand/top-soil down into the cored holes?

Back to my previously mentioned stupid question. What does one do with a boom lift?

Thanks again, nater.

nater · Sep 5, 2002

bmac,
I do use the 60" rake, but I have not used it to fill the core holes. I use the 60" rake to cut grooves into the clay and break it open. Once open, I again overseed, spread pulverized black dirt and heavily water it. I suppose it would work to use the rake to drag back across the core plug holes with sand or some other type of top dressing. I would also probably assist in breaking up the cores that are laying all over the lawn.

The boom lift is used to extend the forward lifting capacity of the tractor. It has two grapple hooks that you can hook up any type of towing strap and lift/drag trees......or just about everything else. When angled up the lifting height extends to 8+ feet! I actually, with the help of some additional rear ballast weight, was able to lift the front of my F150 supercrew so that both front wheels where 6" off the ground!! Wast of time??? Probably lifting the truck is not all that beneficial, /w3tcompact/icons/grin.gif but this boom lift is awesome when your lifting large tree trunks or rocks. It also makes you look like your ready to take on the neighbor in a jousting match./w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif I will post some pictures of my PT in action, with all the accessories over the weekend.

I wish I had the skills and resources to put together a web site like Moss's, but I am just a mortal./w3tcompact/icons/blush.gif If you would like to see anything being done special with the tractor, just let me know and I can try and have the wife shoot a digital movie clip of PT and me in action and email it to you.

deadstick · Sep 5, 2002

How about a clip of you lifting that F150 with the boom /w3tcompact/icons/grin.gif

davesisk · Sep 5, 2002

I actually, with the help of some additional rear ballast weight, was able to lift the front of my F150 supercrew so that both front wheels where 6" off the ground!! 

Wow! That's pretty impressive! Jeez, how much ballast weight did you need? I know that I can pick up about 600 lbs in the bucket on my 1418, any more and the back end lifts up, leaving the machine standing on the bucket and front wheels. You must've put quite a bit of weight on there to do this! Please, do tell, or post a video clip or picture here on TBN!

Dave

Schultz · Sep 5, 2002

Great review, hopefully PT is reading them as well & taking notes. Being a development engineer I see this a great source for them. I too have been tossing around the idea of a new tractor, and looks like there is enough convincing info here to make it a PT. Unfortunately, it won't be for another year or so.
Regarding LOADNESS: I have given this a lot of thought, and thought of requesting the following when the time comes. I would even pay extra for it if I had to. Anyway, get the 425 but have it factory set so that the RPM's are limited to say 3000 or 3100rpm. Looking at the power & torque curves of the Kohler this would still provide about 22-23hp but at much reduced noise levels. This still provides about 200-300rpm of torque rise so you wouldn't be bogging the engine down when mowing or working the tractor. So far I haven’t seen a good reason not to do this.
All this would involve for PT would be resizing the hydraulic pumps for this RPM range - not a hard calculation. The only down side I see is a compressed speed/power range.

Just something to think about.

bmac · Sep 5, 2002

Thanks, nater. Would love to see the boom lift and core aerator in action. I will second the request to see the SuperCrew on 2 wheels. As a fellow SuperCrew owner myself, maybe some day we can have a competition lifting our respective trucks. Thanks for the generous offer for the videos. If its not too much trouble, I'm sure lots of folks would enjoy them.

As I haven't seen the rake in person, I didn't know how aggressive it would be. When I asked, I was thinking light pressure with small tines to smooth things out. Sounds like that thing would be hefty enough to rip out my existing grass.

Thanks again.