Questions on handling round bales

[Z-Michigan]

After a lot of debate, my wife and I are seriously considering getting our hayfield baled as rounds instead of small squares, since we're not sure how available extra hands will be for putting up squares. Since I haven't handled rounds before, I have a few questions. Let me say first - I know not to lift a round bale with anything but a spear, so I don't need a warning/reminder. Here goes:

1) We would like to store bales stacked 2-high in our horse barn. The barn is conventional pole construction and shouldn't have any side loads put on it, so we're thinking of rotating the bales to sit on the flat end and then stacking them two high. First, with a loader-mounted bale spear, will I have any problem tilting a bale that was initially picked up with the spear in the flat end so that I can have the bale on its flat end? Second, once its sitting on the flat end, will I have any trouble putting the spear through the round side so I can stack two-high with flat to flat ends?

2) I don't currently own any bale spears. Our hayfields are 600+ feet from our barn. I am thinking I would halve my work time by buying both 3ph and FEL mounted spears to carry two bales per trip. Any reason this isn't a good idea? I am using a 5105 utility tractor with MFWD and I have 3000lbs rated 3ph lift and 2200lbs rated FEL lift.

3) While I'm planning to carry bales two at a time from hayfield to barn area, once it gets to the task of precise manuevering in the barn I'm not sure I have enough room to move with a bale sticking off the back, so I would need to lift a bale at the FEL without a corresponding bale on the rear. I have filled tires (1500lbs). Realizing that rear ballast is always a good thing for FEL work, am I likely to be able to place the bales inside the barn without having the extra 1000lbs or so on my 3ph?

4) Any other issues I should know of in advance before we get into this? Our alternative is trying to draft friends and relatives 3x a year at unpredictable times (whenever the nearby farmer bales our hay).

 

[daTeacha]

My first thought is why not use the large square bales? They will stack easier and you can readily peel "flakes" from them if you don't want to feed the whole bale at one time. We got some big alfalfa bales this year for the sheep after the wife had worked with small squares for a long time. She thought it was so nice that we will be getting our grass hay in big squares this year, too.

My tractor is rated to pick up 1200 lb with the FEL. I have about 900 lb of concrete on the hitch and 260 on the wheels with no load in the tires. That's enough to keep the back end down when I try to lift something big enough to stall the tractor. It's pretty common around here to see tractors moving down the road with a speared bale on each end, so that will probably work just fine. Are you thinking one spear or 3 on each end?

What kind of floor are you moving around on? With no weight on the back, you will have almost all the weight of the tractor and bale on the front tires. Turning them will put some pretty good forces on a wood floor, maybe tearing up a board or two at an inopportune moment. My FIL won't let a skid steer in the top of his barn for that reason.

You can cast a substantial 3 point weight out of concrete. Mine was made by building a box out of OSB, appropriately reinforced to hold the stuff in while it sets. Pop the forms off after it's thoroughly hardened. There was a piece of PVC placed through the box to leave a left-right hole into which I have inserted a steel rod that serves as pickup points for the lift arms, and a piece of steel with bollts and washers set into the top. I welded some large angle iron to that, drilled a pair of holes through the angle, and that's where the top link connects. It works well and is more compact than a ballast box, not to mention a lot cheaper. I suppose you could paint it to match your tractor if that's a concern. Concrete has a density of about 68 pounds per cubic foot if I remember right, but if you put fieldstones in the box prior to pouring the concrete in the overall density will be higher.

I have a grapple on my bucket which I hope to use to move the "big" grass squares this year. These will be about 3' on the small sides and about 8' long. The guy we got the alfalfa from moves those BIG bales (4 to 5' on the small sides, 8' long) with two spears on a skid steer. There are assorted root grapples that might work to handle your rounds from the side if you wish, and I have even seen an implement that lets you grab the bale, lift it, then rotate it so you can stand it on end in the barn if you want to.

Have fun!

 

[mjarrels]

I have large round bales stacked three high... large bank barn.

mark

 

[Z-Michigan]

My first thought is why not use the large square bales? They will stack easier and you can readily peel "flakes" from them if you don't want to feed the whole bale at one time. We got some big alfalfa bales this year for the sheep after the wife had worked with small squares for a long time. She thought it was so nice that we will be getting our grass hay in big squares this year, too.

My tractor is rated to pick up 1200 lb with the FEL. I have about 900 lb of concrete on the hitch and 260 on the wheels with no load in the tires. That's enough to keep the back end down when I try to lift something big enough to stall the tractor. It's pretty common around here to see tractors moving down the road with a speared bale on each end, so that will probably work just fine. Are you thinking one spear or 3 on each end?

What kind of floor are you moving around on? With no weight on the back, you will have almost all the weight of the tractor and bale on the front tires. Turning them will put some pretty good forces on a wood floor, maybe tearing up a board or two at an inopportune moment. My FIL won't let a skid steer in the top of his barn for that reason.

Thanks! First, I would love to use large squares, but they are not commonly in use here in Michigan. I am limited to whatever the custom farmer has; I believe he has round and small square balers, but not large square. If he happens to have a large square baler, I will be looking into that route.

I was planning to use one spear at each end; each would be the type that has a single big spear (42" long) and two smaller stabilizing prongs (maybe 10" long). I will have to buy Frontier for the FEL due to my JD quick attach, and probably something basic like "Farm Force" for the rear 3ph.

The barn floor is compacted sand, and if I screw it up it's no big deal to fix it with a drag or blade. I have MFWD so traction shouldn't be an issue. I just don't want to worry about tipping over forward, especially if I would be hitting the barn wall at the same time! We have a fairly nice 5 horse barn but it wasn't designed with significant hay storage in mind. Since we have two horses and hope to be down to one in a month, and since our hayfield should produce something like 25 tons of hay annually, we are looking to use it for storage as much as we can. It would be easier to store the small squares, but we have no ready cheap labor and I don't look forward to putting up 500 bales 3x/year.

 

[Egon]

In Alberta many people stack two high. The bottom bale is set on end with the top bale set flat on top. These are usually the large round bales.

Doing it this way would let you spear the bales conventionally and bring to shed. The bottom one could be flipped and pushed in place. The top one is conventionally speared and placed.

Your back, your wife and many friends will thank you for going to bales that must be handled mechanically. Throw a party!

 

[mlauk]

I think your tractor could handle round 4x5 bales, but I would be concerned with anything larger. I agree with Egon, to put the bottom bale on end and the top bale in a normal position on top, otherwise it would be to difficult to spear because of the height. I've never tried spearing a bale on the round side, but have picked up bales sitting on the end by spearing from top and backing up and tilting FEL up. Another thought for reducing travel time is to hook a trailer up on the 3 point to carry 3 bales (16 foot trailer) and one on the FEL.

 

[tydp]

Second, once its sitting on the flat end, will I have any trouble putting the spear through the round side so I can stack two-high with flat to flat ends?

YES! I have tried to unload 5x6 bales from a trailer on the side. I COULD NOT get the spear through the side of the bale. I had to pull them off with a chain (tractor too wide M9540 to get on trailer to spear in the end). With hay "forks" you could lift them from underneath but would then have a problem trying to stack them.....

 

[Soundguy]

I'v had no luck spearing a bale from the side.. of course my spear is a 3pt spear.

I do however move bales with my loader bucket.. No spear.. the buckets too far out as it is on my older machinery. i just cup the bale from the side, and then lift it an inch to get a ratched strap around it and the bucket and strap it in and go.. Even my old antique tractors move a bale fine this way.. and yes.. I can stack them 2 high this way.

You can take post hole diggers and sink 2-3 fence posts in the ground near the sides of the barn.. set your bales near them flat side out.. just like you speared them.. then you can stack them 2 high without fear of them rolling and side loading your barn. I have stacked 2 high in the pasture doing this with a tarp over them... if your fence posts are in the ground good.. the bales don't budge any.. My hay movers are an old 1955 ford 660 and ford 850 both with 1-arm laoders... Spear goes onthe cat 2 tractors.. ford 5000 or 7610s ( usually the 5000 as i leave the 7610s hooked to the mower most of the time.. )

Soundguy

 

[Z-Michigan]

I'm learning lots here, appreciate all the posts. Sounds like I shouldn't expect to spear through the side, but that shouldn't keep me from stacking two high anyway, with at least two options for doing that. Any more comments - keep em coming.

 

[BTDT]

Since we have two horses and hope to be down to one in a month, and since our hayfield should produce something like 25 tons of hay annually, we are looking to use it for storage as much as we can. It would be easier to store the small squares, but we have no ready cheap labor and I don't look forward to putting up 500 bales 3x/year.

Since you only have one horse (or soon only one), why not just sell him/her too, then let custom hay guy cut your hay, and sell it. Lot less work for you, and your making money.

 

[farmerjim]

i'm not too familiar w/ rounds, as i only do small sq's, but if you were stacking them flat side down on a dirt floor i would think that you could have some spoilage? unless you have a wrapper. if you stack them 2high like they sit after coming out of the baler, if there was any spoilage you could just un roll the outer spoiled area and use it for bedding or whatever and keep using the bale, where as if the whole side was spoiled i would think the bale was waste. you could probably get some pallets to stack them flat side down? i see people in my area that do rounds picking them up w/ either a spear on the 3pt or loader, and some w/ the round bale grapple on loaders or bobcat. i see many people wrap them and just store them outside stacked up. just another thought.

 

[redlevel]

If the bale is rolled good and tight you won't get a spear in the round side. I don't understand why you want to stack the flat side down. If you are stacking on dry sand/dirt under a shelter, spoilage will be negligible either way in one year's storage. The rolls in this picture were two years old.

When I was hauling and stacking round bales, I left one on the rear spear as ballast. As you see, it really doesn't protrude that much in the rear. Also, you will be much betternpleased with a front-loader spear that replaces the bucket rather than one that bolts to the bucket. I have tried them both and there is no comparison.

 

[Z-Michigan]

Redlevel - good comments, but your photo didn't come through. I was planning on a FEL spear that replaces the bucket. Only reason I wanted to stack flat side down is to avoid having bales roll and start pushing on the sides of the barn, possibly damaging it.

Farmerjim - we have been grabbing every free pallet we can find for 6 months now to let us store our hay well off the ground whether we do rounds or squares. Square bales on dirt is instant spoilage and mold; even a single layer of pallets doesn't always allow enough air to circulate, but we're planning two layers of pallets between hay and ground, which has worked for us so far.

As for storing outside - that is perfectly fine for most animals other than horses, but horses are amazingly delicate creatures that get sick from very minor problems with their food. We had 100 bales of moldy hay from last year that we couldn't use; gave it to a nearby guy with some cattle and he was thrilled. Cattle are much less sensitive to mold and spoilage. Having said all that, hay that's outside but in a wrapper is probably fine for horses, but you would have to inspect it more closely than if it's been stored inside.

 

[Z-Michigan]

Since you only have one horse (or soon only one), why not just sell him/her too,

If you can convince my wife of that, please go right ahead! I would then be ready to trade my 5105 in for a TLB of some sort and turn our whole property into a tree farm.

 

[Soundguy]

As stated.. the rolling is easy to overcome..

Soundguy

Redlevel - good comments, but your photo didn't come through. I was planning on a FEL spear that replaces the bucket. Only reason I wanted to stack flat side down is to avoid having bales roll and start pushing on the sides of the barn, possibly damaging it.

.

 

[john_bud]

It would be easier to store the small squares, but we have no ready cheap labor and I don't look forward to putting up 500 bales 3x/year.

Wimp.


Sorry, couldn't resist, it was just too dang easy!


On the bales, typical technique is to back into one bale, drive forward into another and drive back to the barn. Can you stack on both sides of the barn? Fel bale on one side, 3pt bale on the other? Might be easier and cut down on bumping into things.

I thought a horse only ate 1 bale every 2 days, not 3 bales a day!

jb

 

[redlevel]

Wimp.


Sorry, couldn't resist, it was just too dang easy!


On the bales, typical technique is to back into one bale, drive forward into another and drive back to the barn. Can you stack on both sides of the barn? Fel bale on one side, 3pt bale on the other? Might be easier and cut down on bumping into things.

I thought a horse only ate 1 bale every 2 days, not 3 bales a day!

jb

You will quickly figure out the most efficient way to do it. It is easier to put the bales exactly where you want them with the loader. Typically, I would get my rows started with both bales (front and rear), then start "stockpiling" the bales from the rear spear. I would stack the bale I hauled in on the loader, then back up fifty or so feet and drop the bale off the 3ph outside the barn. When I accumulated 15 or so bales, I would start stacking the ones I had stockpiled. Then I would start over again. That is much quickier than trying to back in and stack them in the row off the 3ph.

 

[texasjohn]

Listen to REDLEVEL, repeat, listen to REDLEVEL.

He must have the answer... since he does it exactly the way I do.

Spike to side of bake won't work.

Fork on rear and FEL spike... I use all the time.

Always put bale on rear FIRST, then spike one on the front. Yep, you know that, but it's worth repeating.

Always carry front bale as close to ground as you can and not rake hay off.

WARNING...attempting to place bale with FEL without serious rear ballast is dangerous. Every time I get myself into a situation and attempt it I get wheels off the ground and recalibrate my pucker factor... just drop the front bale and place it with your rear fork.

You can turn bale on end using spike..that's how I drop bales into round bale feeders... raise over feeder edge, tip over, let it drop into ring. I do NOT recommend this as a method as the base for your hay stack. You can't manage them properly. Put them on their side as in REDLEVEL's photo. That works best. They WON'T roll... they flatten on the bottom
Once I tried an experiment to stack bales 3 high....couldn't do it with my equipment...didn't get it high enough... SCARY too, even with round bale (1300lbs) on rear fork, 1000 lbs of liquid in tires AND 300 or so extra lbs on the 3ph.

Suggestion... maybe somebody in your area could let you borrow a FEL spike and 3ph fork and you could try stacking some in the field...to get a feel for it. This way, you KNOW what size bale works with YOUR tractor using this technique. I'm not very familar with your tractor... but my FEL lift capability is 2800 lbs or so.... and there are times when I don't fully spike a 1500 lb bale and the relief valve pops..then I need to reposition bale closer to tractor.

Be aware that the 4 wheel assist/drive can be decieving... you have good traction until the center of gravity moves just wrong on you, then bad things start happening fast... so, just move slowly and be ready to drop your front/rear load at all times unless you know you are well balanced and not going to hit pot holes or tilt.

It also works to have a flatbed 16ft trailer on a pickup. Place 3 bales on flatbed with spike. Then, pick up your rear and front bales with tractor and head for barn.....buddy/wife drives pickup. You place tactor bales, then either pick up the trailer bales with spike from side, or back up/into trailer with fork and pick up bales one at a time.

All the above being said, I highly recommend using a spike and fork combination.

 

[RFB]

Have to concur with texasjohn. I run the same rig/setup as he does; last year I put up both 800lb and 1500lb square bales. I will only go 2 high on the 1500's.

Even with proper ballast, I drive with the front-spiked bale about 5 inches off of the ground, and hand-on-stick ready to dump the load. Any little dip and real quick you are busier than a 3 legged cat trying to bury a t**d on an ice pond.

 

[schmism]

busier than a 3 legged cat trying to bury a t**d on an ice pond.

ROTFLMAO

<wipes the tears from my eyes> nice one man... i love hearing new ones!