Pushing or towing a 425

[JD-Beach]

OK, I arrived home from a nice Father's day out and I noticed a gasoline smell in the garage. ... saw a few drops under the tractor ... thought that I'd simply pull it outside and deal with it. I could not start it and eventually the battery went dead ... tried to jump it from a mower ... no luck ... so, I pulled out the manual to see what valve had to be opened in the tram pump to allow it to be pushed and found that the image in the manual is not at all like the pump on my unit. ... in fact there is nothing on my pump that even resembles the "Tow Valve" shown in the manual. ... so for you guys that have a 6-year old 425 with a Robins engine ... anyone know what to turn to make this thing "pushable" or "towable" ?

Thanks in advance for your help.

JD

 

[JD-Beach]

Here's an image of my pump. (Not sure that I uploaded this correctly. This new and improved forum format is testing my capabilities).

Does anyone know what to turn to be able to push or tow this tractor? Figured I'd call Terry in the morning if I can't get it worked out.

 

[SpringHollow]

On my tractor, there is a JIC fitting with a cap on it. I do not see anything like that in your picture. A picture from the other side perhaps? Mine is on the "Driver's" side.

Ken

 

[Clumber]

OK, I arrived home from a nice Father's day out and I noticed a gasoline smell in the garage. ... saw a few drops under the tractor ... thought that I'd simply pull it outside and deal with it. I could not start it and eventually the battery went dead ... tried to jump it from a mower ... no luck ... so, I pulled out the manual to see what valve had to be opened in the tram pump to allow it to be pushed and found that the image in the manual is not at all like the pump on my unit. ... in fact there is nothing on my pump that even resembles the "Tow Valve" shown in the manual. ... so for you guys that have a 6-year old 425 with a Robins engine ... anyone know what to turn to make this thing "pushable" or "towable" ?

Thanks in advance for your help.

JD

See entry #11 the thread below:
http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/power-trac/210508-cant-find-bleeding-port.html

Mine is a 2010 PT 425. It has the same pump and configuration as yours. Move the PT only a short distance once the bypass connection is made.

 

[JD-Beach]

Thanks for the reply. So, if I understand this correctly we want to install a bypass between each of the two fittings (item #7) located on each of the tram manifolds (item #4 on the drawing) ... it would seem to me that this could be a permanent installation if it had a small valve in the line to open or to close the bypass. If one could conveniently locate the valve it would make pushing or pulling the machine much more convenient. (of course only short distances).

The bypass hose that I received with my tractor only has a fitting on one end. The other end is just a cut off hose.

After I move the machine I'll need to tackle the gas leak. It appears that it is the fuel pump. I'll remove it later and look it over.

thanks again.

 

[frischtr]

Thanks for the reply. So, if I understand this correctly we want to install a bypass between each of the two fittings (item #7) located on each of the tram manifolds (item #4 on the drawing) ... it would seem to me that this could be a permanent installation if it had a small valve in the line to open or to close the bypass. If one could conveniently locate the valve it would make pushing or pulling the machine much more convenient. (of course only short distances).

The bypass hose that I received with my tractor only has a fitting on one end. The other end is just a cut off hose.

After I move the machine I'll need to tackle the gas leak. It appears that it is the fuel pump. I'll remove it later and look it over.

thanks again.

Really getting cheap in Tazwell with a fitting on only one end of the hose. :confused2: That hose is not only supposed to be for purging air, but the tow bypass as well... Good luck.

 

[JD-Beach]

I removed the fuel pump this evening and gas started flowing out of the suction line from the engine block ... then I removed the cap to drain the engine oil and out came a gallon or so of gas and oil mixed. ... I quickly did a search here and saw that Clumber had the very same issue back on 3-01-2013. I thought that it was because of a failure of the fuel pump. ... allowing gas to flow back into the block thru the suction line. Can anyone comment on this? I'd also like to add a fuel shut-off like some folks here have. Any ideas are much appreciated.

Thanks in advance,

JD

 

[JD-Beach]

So after much research about gas in the oil (in the crank case) it seems that the carburetor may be the culprit. It appears that they sometime stick in an open position after the engine is turned off. One more case for a fuel shut-off valve. Interesting, as I was reading the Robin instruction manual I found a statement that said a fuel valve MUST BE installed when the fuel tank is mounted above the carburetor. The folks at Powertrac must have missed that page.

I had originally thought that the gas leaked thru the fuel pump into the crankcase ... but now I don't believe that. Does anyone have experience with these little fuel pumps? A cheap little plastic thing ... doesn't look very robust. Should I repace it?

 

[SpringHollow]

I doubt very much that it is the fuel pump. It is very common for the fuel to leak through the carburetor.

Ken

 

[BigMike50]

Your float in the fuel bowl of the carberatur is sticking allowing fuel to seep into the engine. Remove the bowl under the carb. And you will see the float. Work it up and down a few times

 

[Clumber]

So after much research about gas in the oil (in the crank case) it seems that the carburetor may be the culprit. It appears that they sometime stick in an open position after the engine is turned off. One more case for a fuel shut-off valve. Interesting, as I was reading the Robin instruction manual I found a statement that said a fuel valve MUST BE installed when the fuel tank is mounted above the carburetor. The folks at Powertrac must have missed that page.

I had originally thought that the gas leaked thru the fuel pump into the crankcase ... but now I don't believe that. Does anyone have experience with these little fuel pumps? A cheap little plastic thing ... doesn't look very robust. Should I repace it?

My neighbor, the retired mechanic, said it was probably was the sticking carburetor float. I installed a fuel shutoff valve. Note: install the valve in a place so you can easily and safely turn it off even when the engine compartment and cover is very hot. I was burned a couple of times. The valve needs to be relocated. Also, leave the engine cover up to remind you to open the valve before attempting to start the tractor...:duh: I used carburetor cleaner and fiddled with float, and now use ethanol treatment in the gas.

 

[cqaigy2]

You may even want to remove the carb and give it a good cleaning and if it has a fuel shut off solenoid then it's not and i like your idea of a fuel shut off valve.

 

[Clumber]

Thanks for the reply. So, if I understand this correctly we want to install a bypass between each of the two fittings (item #7) located on each of the tram manifolds (item #4 on the drawing) ... it would seem to me that this could be a permanent installation if it had a small valve in the line to open or to close the bypass. If one could conveniently locate the valve it would make pushing or pulling the machine much more convenient. (of course only short distances).

The bypass hose that I received with my tractor only has a fitting on one end. The other end is just a cut off hose.

After I move the machine I'll need to tackle the gas leak. It appears that it is the fuel pump. I'll remove it later and look it over.

thanks again.[/QUOTE

Hopefully, it is very rare that you would have to tow the tractor and not worth a permanent tow valve installation. Also, by short distance I should have said a few feet, for example, to move it onto a trailer for moving it.

By 2010 when I purchased my tractor, PT wised-up as my hose came with fittings on both ends.

 

[J_J]

My tow valve is really simple.

There is a slot under a cover plate that when turned 45 degrees, opens two relief valves and lets the fluid cross over from input to output. Only used for short distance and slow.

 

[JD-Beach]

You guys nailed it. Seems that the carburetor was allowing an infinite amount of fuel to drip into the engine ... probably the result of a stuck or saturated float. Also the fuel shut off solenoid was very slow and weak to open and close (perhaps not closing at all when needed most). I called Powertrac who sent me to Robin who sent me to Continental Engines in Greenville, SC and after pricing the parts, (solenoid, floats, needle valve) it made sense to replace the carb for 50 bucks more. Sooooo, I have a new carb and a new manual fuel shut-off valve on the way and a very capable mechanic standing by to make it all work. Hopefully I can report good news in a few days.
Thanks all,
JD

 

[JD-Beach]

Great news! ... My friend Roy installed the new carb, new plugs, new oil and filter, and a new battery ... started it up ... runs like new. All is good. I ordered a new fuel shut off valve ... hope to install it next weekend.

thanks,
JD

 

[cqaigy2]

Sweet! :thumbsup: