Our World Just got bigger...

[mojoinco]

Seems to me that the 'special addition' is probably a way to explain away the badge engineered new Montana which are probably a lot over stock Branson's while Kukje gears up for the green paint (presuming Montana is around long enough, and can afford to pay for the change).

So what happens to the (as I understand it) LG models that Montana sold in the past?

 

[JoeinTX]

"Face it, Montana does not manufacture anything, they are just a group of investors....."

This entire thing is getting almost ridiculous.

Now, Montana is adding Kukje gear to its line and dropping their own color in addition to adding blue Farmtracs. Additionally, now LS is entering the market and adding dealers of it's own selling the 'real' Montana tractor in direct competition with.....Montana.

It sounds like we're headed for a "correction" in the sub/small tractor market involving these specific lines. Aside from providing an existing dealer base, what is Montana's reason for existing in the future? No unique, indentifiable product. Primary supplier is now looking to compete directly with it in the market and has the weight of the company behind it.

Montana is a marketing exercise. I remember they were all the rage 4-5 years ago but they've experienced much the same as the other recent start-ups.......dealer contraction, supplier concerns, an appearance of uncertainty.

Not anti-Montana or anything but it seems that once old man Hunt passed away that the company began to go downhill. Besides, if I've got a Branson, Mahindra, or LS dealer nearby I would just go ahead and buy from them rather take a bit of a risk on buying the red/blue/green badged version from the Montana guy.

Thoughts...?

 

[Mike120]

You are probably correct Joe. Around here the only dealers were folks who couldn't get a name brand. One specialized in lawn equipment the other in jetskis and ATV's.....both have gone belly up.

The Korean chaebol's are swimming in debt because of their cross-guarantee loan practices and all are loaded with off-the-balance-sheet liabilities. They'll either consolidate the brands or peddle them off to the Chinese. "Future parts availability" is an oximoron for these tractors.

 

[JoeinTX]

"One specialized in lawn equipment the other in jetskis and ATV's.....both have gone belly up...."

Exactly. I've seen this movie before and I know how it ends.

Fifteen years ago every exurban feed store/trailer lot/tack supply/used whatever dealer/antique store was peddling Zetors or Belarus. Made some numbers, hung around a few years......but ultimately little/no support structure behind them and the corporate source was unstable. Very, very few remain today and those that do really don't front those brands or they've added more recognizable ones that keep them in biz.

Montana has certainly done better than that but I'm sensing some of the same things here. Changes within the company and leadership.......product line getting muddled and uncertain......questions about support are really being asked.......dealers closing or switching to other lines.


I dunno. Just Sunday morning chit-chat to make the time pass but, seriously, where does the Montana brand fit into this in the future? Why does it go on?

 

[Fred Widom]

In todays tractor world,a company has to have a manufacturing base to survive or be a exclusive distributor.Montana will need one of these to be a player.Already a year has gone by after their takeover of the Farmtrac assets,but things have gone more muddled with the original green dissapearing and getting replaced with Blue and red.
Someone has miscalculated.Things look bad for Montana at present .But giving credit to them,they have survived without having anything to sell for almost a year now.(Someone surely has a lot of money to burn)

 

[YanmarFever]

Montana's countdown began a while ago......

Their credit rating is nothing to brag about, the future will tell more.

 

[JoeinTX]

"Montana's countdown began a while ago......"

Sounds like it.

Appears LG/LS let Montana know a while back that they were going to enter the U.S. market on their own like it or not at which point Montana began scrambling for new suppliers of product in the future. Explains the Kukje/Branson thing. But, with Farmtrac, they seem to have assumed a large amount of liability without any real promise of product to market. Are they trying to get in with Escorts as a future supplier (since none exists in the U.S. currently) and the move was done as a show of "good faith" in hopes of potential favor later? I haven't read of any agreement between the two for this, no? If not, are they just gonna sell through the surplus Farmtrac stock and then try to exist on red Bransons with "Montana" slapped on the side? I suppose the arrangement for the "C" series UTB sourced tractors is still ongoing?

Weird.

As another poster said, all of Montana's branding/imaging are getting shot to heck with the cookie-cutter blue and red orphans assembled upon their lots now. Current Montana owners are not going to be able to buy replacement/additional tractors sourced from the same maker........or even the same color. All different now and sounds like it could fluctuate still over the next few years as things get settled.


Wow. Well, I was never a potential Montana customer but this just fascinates me.

 

[wampum]

Was at a Montana dealer last week,hoping to see the r4944hst. He did not have it or the r4344 in stock. he did however have several blue landtrac and farmtracs rebadged as Montana. He even had a little red Montana on the show room floor with a the Branson name embossed in the rubber floor mat. He quoted me a really cheap price on the Montana r4944hst when it comes in,but I am really worried about parts in the future.

 

[JoeinTX]

I see you've been posting around, wampum.


I don't know if a Montana dealer can get or guarantee you a 43/4944 right now. The only real source for them now is direlect Farmtracs or Kukje Bransons. It would appear the green line from Montana is now the domain of LS dealers unless they have some scraps to scare up.

I would not expect a whole lot from Montana dealers for a while in terms of service or clear warranty. If you can get the same or equal from another I would probably do so.


Montana Tractor now owns all of Farmtrac's U.S. liability while only marketing their left-over scraps and Kukje/Branson re-rebadged items.


Sorry, Montana dealers and owners, but I wouldn't touch with your Mother-in-Law's 100' cane right now......

 

[JoeinTX]

And for people like wampum, it might be time to stear towards the local Kubota/Kioti/Mahindra/MF/JD/CNH dealer.

In this past year we've seen seemingly harmonious and secure LongAgri (of which I was a HUGE cheerleader) and Montana networks hit the skids with little warning. LS is looking "for real" now. Kukje seems comitted regardless of the colors/brands/names that get slapped upside them. For now.

I wouldn't buy a Bela or Zetor right now to save my own skin. ChiCom tractors? Who the He!! knows about them....?

Of the "off brand" bunch..........Mahindra surely seems the Rose right now. Own the product, the marketing, the support. LS is right behind them and on the up-swing for the same reasons.

Lesson to learn? Until the OEM stakes money and reputation on marketing, selling, and supporting the product in the U.S. then it's a risky option. When they don't......marketing agreement, etc.....wait.

 

[Mike120]

Joe, you left out sustainability. Just because someone has something to sell (and it may be a good product), if they don't sell enough or make a decent margin, they won't last very long. When that happens you're out in the cold. A warranty is only as good as the balance sheet behind it and parts will be limited to existing supplies. Kubota was smart because they targeted the NH and AGCO dealers to add a second brand. The guys trying to come in now are having to use startups or lawn equipment dealers to build their networks. That's a lot more risky and it usually results in a lot of consolidations and wrapups when the market goes south.

I can still buy parts for my 26 year old Ford tractor and old NH hay implements. I'm certainly not too worried about getting parts for my 4 year old JD (made in the US) tractor. I would be concerned if I had one of the lower tier imports because it's not likely most will survive.

 

[FULL PULL]

I KNOW SEVERAL LOYAL BRANSON DEALERS AS WELL AS CONSUMERS. THE REASON IS THE PEOPLE WHO WORK TO AND SUPPORT THE BRAND. No, I do not work for them.

THEY TAKE A TRUE INTEREST IN THEIR DEALERS NETWORK AND WANT THEM TO SUSTAIN (AS THEY ALL DO) BUT HONESTLY IN TODAYS WORLD OF LOGOS AND EMBLEMS IT STILL COMES DOWN TO THE MAN/WOMAN BEHIND THE COUNTER. A HANDSHAKE AND LONG TERM TRUST.

WHAT DOES MONTANA BRING TO THE TABLE OTHER THAN WHAT SEEMS TO BE A LARGE MARKETING BUDGET? They seem to hop into and out of bed with who ever will sell to them.Branson is Kukje and they are the manufacturer not a marketing entitity. In all acaulity a simple fix. They got a super product line but a crappy marketing venue.

If it were me I would stick w/ Branson I think they have the true potential to be the 600 pound gorilla in the industry.

I saw a posting and do not recall which one who said their JD made in the USA- - just exactly which model is that in this size class? I thought JDwasamarketing companylike Montana in this size class- but I could be wrong.

These are just some thoughts of mine.

 

[HauntedBranch]

I have read this thread with some interest since I am considering a Montana among other tractors. It seems to me that, if you plan to keep the machine for the long haul, the main concern is parts. I have exchanged e-mails with someone at LS and they tell me I will be able to get parts for the LS Montanas at either LS or Montana. In any event, the tractor I am looking at appears to have identical siblings in other LS-manufactured lines. Am I missing something big and dangerous?

Phil

 

[polo1665]

I have read this thread with some interest since I am considering a Montana among other tractors. It seems to me that, if you plan to keep the machine for the long haul, the main concern is parts. I have exchanged e-mails with someone at LS and they tell me I will be able to get parts for the LS Montanas at either LS or Montana. In any event, the tractor I am looking at appears to have identical siblings in other LS-manufactured lines. Am I missing something big and dangerous?

Phil

IMO I don't think you are going to have much of a problem aquiring parts. You may however find it difficult to find someone to cover these parts and associated labor under the warranty if the badge brand goes under. If you are willing and able to do the work yourself, and foot the bill for parts if something goes wrong, you should be fine.

Mark

 

[JoeinTX]

"IMO I don't think you are going to have much of a problem aquiring parts. You may however find it difficult to find someone to cover these parts and associated labor under the warranty if the badge brand goes under. If you are willing and able to do the work yourself, and foot the bill for parts if something goes wrong, you should be fine...."


Agree.

Parts (and possibly in a different color from your tractor's) I don't believe are a huge issue. But, as said, issues/items that would be covered under a warranty could become very questionable should the brand/dealer base go kaput. I don't know what LS's warranties look like but I think it's probable they are different than what is offered by Montana and there's not guarantee that LS would assume them should Montana not.

As for now, though, Montana says they will honor the terms of any warranty the've sold for a green tractor.

 

[shakin]

not worried about my montana, (if you didn't figure it out i'm an owner) my dealer tells me they are not leaving the market, and they are leveraging for a bigger piece of the pie. i'm going to sit here and wait but i will not lose any sleep over this. i trust my dealer and i would buy from him again, parts for my ls built will not be an issue as he is going to be an ls dealer also, along with the tym brand. he has sold bransons and is listed as a branson dealer but there has not been any on the lot for years why is that poor distribution, i think kukje needs montana to sell their product and montana needs someone to build. they dont care who builds their units as long as they are competively priced and built with quality just my 2c.

 

[JoeinTX]

shakin,

Not being negative.....just curious. Why is your Montana dealer taking on LS as well? Is he keeping Montana and adding LS or dropping Montana? Is he now a Montana/LS/Branson dealer?

Adding LS makes me wonder if he's worried about supporting LG-sourced Montana products in the future. If he's secure about that through Montana, regardless of future OEMs wearing the green paint, why do it? Not saying your dealer is in the wrong but just trying to figure out this puzzle.

 

[shakin]

joel he is taking on the ls line for only a couple of models. he is dissapointed that montana will not be carrying these. he feels there are a couple of units in ls's line that are the best deal going in the tractor market, and he has sold lots of these, mine is one. montana has been great this summer i thought i had a problem and before the tractor had been even split they had sent the parts to him no questions asked. come to find out it was just an adjustment on the 2 stage clutch indside the case(i was there to watch this) and the parts were returned. i am concerned that the branson units may not come quick enough he is also a branson dealer and i think it has been at least 2 years since there was one on the lot, hopefully they come quicker than that. maybe that to is why he decided to take on ls also. he is also a tym dealer but i found those to be more expensive and didn't really see any real difference. now i'll answer the question all have been wanting to ask and yes he used to be a used car dealer. the signs are still up but he no longer does this. he does have a transmission shop as this is where his auto experience is. and he is a full fledged tractor dealer carrying now 4 brands and 3 or 4 brands of implements. he would rather sell tractors than doanything else the profits are so good on the tranny rebuilds that he can't pass them up.

larry