Off Road Dump Trailers Revisted...

RobS · Jul 15, 2005

Again, excellent post rswyan, thanks for reposting here.

I guess I missed it before that yours is the "trailer" version with a tonguejack. I was thinking more along the lines of the wagon version with the wheels at each corner. Do you think that would fare any better being tied down to a flatbed trailer?

Nice pics, thanks again /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

have_blue · Jul 15, 2005

( ... and away .... )

Sweet!

For that price, anyyone that even remotely needs a wagon should jump on the Country Mfg. deal. If something for heavier hauling is needed, get another brand or perhaps beef the CM frame a little bit.

That self-driving tractor is cool too.

rswyan · Jul 15, 2005

Rob,

You're quite welcome.

Yup ... it is a trailer not a wagon. I've heard that wagons are more difficult to control when backing up ... I haven't really used my E-ZTrail wagon running gear enough to see the difference ... but I can tell ya the Country trailer is very easy to control when backing up .... might be something to consider, depending on where your operating.

The tongue jack has no problem supporting the weight of the trailer tongue when loaded .... I specifically asked about this when I ordered the unit. The trailer is made so that the tongue takes 15% of the weight (600 lbs) of the trailer when loaded to stated capacity.

As far as faring better with wagon when tying it down .... yes, I'm sure it would (four contact points instead of three) .... BUT I still believe that it is not a viable solution ..... BigEddy's followup post to my original got into the actual dynamics of doing it .... like him, it's not anything that I would attempt either.

rswyan · Jul 15, 2005

blue,

( For that price, anyyone that even remotely needs a wagon should jump on the Country Mfg. deal. )
I definitely agree ... /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

( If something for heavier hauling is needed, get another brand or perhaps beef the CM frame a little bit. )
Yup - I haven't scoped it out totally but three areas I would hit are the bed frame crossmembers (stock they are angle), the hinge mount, and the hinge bracket itself ..... all of these would be very easy to beef up .... it wouldn't cost much either.

The tires definitely seem fairly decent .... I've been runing them over sticks and large protruding roots in the woods ..... the wheels aren't as heavy as the setup on my E-ZTrail, which has actual 4 bolt hubs on a spindle, with tapered roller bearings. The Country unit's wheels are just slid over a shaft and cotter-keyed on .... no bolts .... dunno whether there are bearings or just bushings inside the wheels.

( That self-driving tractor is cool too. )
That's how I can get so much work done ..... divide and conquer /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

737800 · Jul 15, 2005

Great discussion gentlemen. Quick question. I am a single tractor operation, and from the size of the dirt loads in some of these photos of the tandem axle, I am assuming you are using a second tractor for loading after you hook up the trailer. I need to haul the trailer to the work area, disconnect to load it with the tractor, then hook up and tow. Have any of you 'all tried loading the tandem this way? I am thinking I may be forced to buy the wagon version so I can load it while it's not hooked up.

Any advise, techniques would be appreciated.

rswyan · Jul 16, 2005

( I am a single tractor operation, and from the size of the dirt loads in some of these photos of the tandem axle, I am assuming you are using a second tractor for loading after you hook up the trailer. )
Nope (although that would be nice :grin)..... I just flip the tongue jack down and run it out so it's supporting the weight of the trailer's tongue, unhook the hydraulic lines from the tractor, and pull the hitch pin in the drawbar .... and I'm off to load the trailer .... with the tractor that was pulling the trailer.

When the trailer is full I back up the tractor to it, lining up the hole in the tractor drawbar to the holes on the trailer tongue (which is actually very easy), set the brake, shutoff tractor, hop off, reconnect hydraulic lines, drop the hitch pin into the drawbar, flip the tongue jack up and I'm on my way.

( Have any of you 'all tried loading the tandem this way? )
Yes .... I have it done perhaps 20+ times, with heaping loads, exactly that way.

( I am thinking I may be forced to buy the wagon version so I can load it while it's not hooked up. )
Nope.

In addition to the advantage of the tandem trailer being easier to back up (versus a wagon) here's another advantage: because the trailer uses a tongue jack and is designed to place 15% of the load weight on the tongue, it functions somewhat like an anchor (although I wouldn't tempt fate, thinking it would hold a loaded trailer on any kind of an incline) .... so it is less inclined to roll than a wagon.

With a wagon you absolutely gotta chock the wheels or there is nothing stopping it from rolling off ... with the trailer I'd say it is far less likely using the tongue jack .... if you are on fairly level ground, you could probably get away without chocking the trailers wheels. I generally throw a 4 x 4 behind the wheels on whatever appears to the downslope side just for safety's sake.

737800 · Jul 16, 2005

Thanks again. Exactly what I needed to know. Just ordered the Tandem from Northern Tools. They had it in stock and it's on sale in their catalog (Flyer #1519, $949.99). Shipping was much less than Country Manufacturing, so the total price worked out $200 less. It'll be here next week. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

rswyan · Jul 18, 2005

Glad to be of help.

I found the first thing that definitely needs reinforced /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif .... the mount for the tongue jack. I was loading another trailerload of sheep doo and went to hitch the cart back up ..... I've been real lucky with this ... usually I can line the holes up so close when backing the tractor up to the cart that only a very minor amount of jiggling is needed to drop the hitch pin in and hook up. This afternoon I went to jiggle the tongue and and the one side of the tongue jack mount came loose. Headed back home, dumped the load, and then pushed the trailer into the shed for a closer look.

On inspection I find that the one side (the side with all the vertical force from the loaded trailer) had only a single spot weld holding it on (the piece is about 4" long where it meets the trailer tongue) I think the mount itself is heavy enough ... it's like 5/16" or 1/4" plate ... it's just the weld was (woefully) inadequate.

I slapped the wire wheel on my r/a grinder and knocked the paint off and then fired up the mig and ran a bead on the underside of the mount where it attaches to the trailer tongue and then another one on the other piece of plate where it attaches to the tongue. I'd definitely check this on your unit when you get it and make sure the weld is substantial enough to hold the weight of the trailer when loaded.

I'll be emailing Country to let them know that if they are going to telling people that the tongue jack with hold up a loaded trailer they better make sure the welds are adequate to the job.

As of this afternoon I estimate that I have moved 70,000 lbs of sheep manure, (plus another 25,000 lbs of dirt from neighbor who tiled his foundation.)

DMF · Jul 18, 2005

( All I'm saying is that treated with some care these units are fine and will probably do alot of work ..... but I don't think they are heavy enough to take a whole lot of abuse. YMMV. )

Well, I said the same thing a few posts back. The wagon is out of commision as of Saturday. The tounge gave up the ghost. I really don't feel I was abusing it either; I was moving 1 to 1-1/3 yards of fill which should be well under the 4K limit. I ended up moving 15 yards of fill for my wall project with my 3/4 pick-up; no dump but I had one of those roller things on the tailgate to crank the stuff out of the truck (load handler I think it's called). I noticed the same type of flexing, etc. as rswyan noticed with his trailer while dumping. These trailers/wagons are inexpensive to buy, and I'm not saying that they are total junk, but you get what you pay for. My wagon will be going through an overhaul/rebuild shortly. Stay tuned for further info... /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif

rswyan · Jul 18, 2005

( The tounge gave up the ghost. I really don't feel I was abusing it either; I was moving 1 to 1-1/3 yards of fill which should be well under the 4K limit. )
Where exactly did it fail ?

I was looking at mine today while I was loading it and could swear that the entire drawbar/tongue was bowed ..... hafta take a better look tommorrow and see if my eyes were decieving me or not.

( These trailers/wagons are inexpensive to buy, and I'm not saying that they are total junk, but you get what you pay for. )
Yup - there's no doubt that they could be constructed much more heavily.

I'm going to try and take some pictures of where the failure occurred and the repair. Keep us posted.