New tractor: how many hours usage acceptable?

[MrJimi]

There is a small wire that can be un-pluged very easy to NOT record any hours on any machine?
Really

 

[Grrrr]

There is a small wire that can be un-pluged very easy to NOT record any hours on any machine?
Really

Only if you have an electronic hour meter

But on the older clocks especially, it is possible to turn them back to zero with some careful manipulation. (or just spin them till they get to where they start again )

Rental machines in the UK often have tamper identifiers around the clock parts because they have a limit about how many hours you can use them a day and then they charge you overtime if you exceed it.

 

[daTeacha]

When I bought my early no ROPS B7100 at auction, it showed 1473 hours on the proofmeter. When I sold it several years later after having used it a lot it showed 1473 hours on the proof meter. The same auction had a pretty used looking L series that showed 25 hours on the proofmeter. I actually bought that one, too and sold it to the backup bidder after I got the B with the FEL on it. The PO of the tractors had disconnected the proofmeters or they broke at some time in the past (the guy was dead at auction time) and he never fixed them. His brother said he had disconnected them. The tractors ran fine, used no oil except diesel, had no issues as witnessed by me using the B pretty hard for quite a while and finally trading up only because of stability issues on my hilly ground.

 

[Skyco]

That is bizarre that some tractors record time on the "hourmeter" differently than actual time based on RPM. I never knew that
My BX24 manual plainly states "The hourmeter indicates in six digits the hours the tractor has been used: the last digit indicates 1/10 of an hour"
If some tractors don't do it that way they need to rename it 'cause it sure ain't an hourmeter

 

[srsu99]

My "new" TN 75A had 40 hrs on it. Dealership used it in several parades showed it at the county fair. They had that tractor and an identical one with 2 hrs on it. I could have bought either but they knocked like $5000 off. It is a 2006 model. I really dont care the loader bucket didnt even have a scrath in it when I originally looked at it. THought the money off was a pretty good deal!

 

[john_bud]

That is bizarre that some tractors record time on the "hourmeter" differently than actual time based on RPM. I never knew that
My BX24 manual plainly states "The hourmeter indicates in six digits the hours the tractor has been used: the last digit indicates 1/10 of an hour"
If some tractors don't do it that way they need to rename it 'cause it sure ain't an hourmeter

Not really so bizarre. This point comes up from time to time and lively discussion sometimes results. In my view, the lowest tech way to monitor use is done with most lawn mowers, leaf blowers, weed wackers and such. They say check and change after so many hours of operation and you are supposed to track it yourself. Using a watch or ?? Next up is the electric clock style of hour meter. On an air craft this is called the frame hour meter. (I think). The key is on and the clock runs. That's ok and a step up it 's also the most common on home owner quality equipment. But, if your kid is playing farmer on the machine and turns on the key, in a week you will chock up 168 hours on the meter, but may not have turned the engine even 1 revolution. I guess every 5 days you still need to change the oil?

Next is the time referenced revolution counter. Still called "hour meter". It counts revolutions and makes the assumption that you are running at the rated PTO speed. At that speed, one hour is clocked for every hour you run at that engine speed. My Kubota is 2600 engine rpm to make 540 PTO, so every 2600 revolutions, the meter ticks off an hour. My Ford is 1515 engine rpm for 540 pto. On an aircraft this is the engine hour meter. This is the most common type on higher quality equipment, construction and industrial equipment.

If you run your tractor at less than PTO engine speed, this type of meter will take more than 1 watch hour to index up 1 hour. I use my FEL and have the engine at 2000 rpm often to save fuel and my hearing. So one meter hour takes 30% more watch hours. (78 minutes for those who care). On the other hand, the ford often will run at 1800 rpm to make the hoe operate faster, so 1 meter hour will take 16% less watch hours (50.5 minutes).

As maintenance intervals are based on useage, which means number of RPM's, this is a pretty good way of doing it.

My friend that only clocks 25 hours a year operates his tractor at 1400 rpm's and has a PTO speed of 2600 so it takes 111 minutes to clock 1 hour on the meter. Still, we both can determine the exact number of revolutions each engine has made since new.

Anyway, that's my story and I'm sticking with it.

jb

 

[tuckybill]

My mom's new Kubota b 3030 had just over one hour on it when delivered today. Now it has 2.6 She is breaking it in slow.

Interesting story. My dad traded for a JD 7210 and it had 900 hours on it. The dealer said he was holding it till the paperwork cleared on the trade with original owner . Just over one week later they delivered it and it had 948 hours on it. They had put almost FIFTY hours on it in just over one week!! They used it to deliver stuff on the highway and the tires were visibly worn from what it was when my dad traded for it. My dad felt he had a very good deal on it and just swallowed that and didn't make a fuss but that shows you what can happen if you trust your dealer too much.

When I was buying my Kubota L4200 I was also looking at the Deere 5400 with the power reverser. There was one in the state and it was 140 miles away. So we drove to see it. It had the loader with it naturally. Well they had been using it to load who knows what but it it must have been concret blocks. Almost all the paint was gone from the bottom and inside the bucket. The bucket had dents and just looked awful. Tractor had 51 hours on it. When I pointed this out to them they acted like I was a nut. They priced it a brand new price and considered the 50 hours of tough loader work to be the dealer prep I guesss. I ended up getting the Kubota and I've been very happy with it. Just some interesting tales of the hour meter and dealers.

 

[Tig]

My B7100 measures hours that the key is set to on. I can run the tractor with the key off and I can also clock hours with the engine stopped.

 

[Skyco]

All I'm saying is an "hourmeter" should measure hours. Period. Or call it something else. Usemeter?
I think the best way would be to monitor total fuel consumption. That way engine load is taken into account. Have a maintenance interval of say 100 gallons. Work it lightly and it takes more hours to get there. Work it hard and it arrives quicker Makes perfect sense to me

 

[the_sandman_454]

My Kubota is 2600 engine rpm to make 540 PTO, so every 2600 revolutions, the meter ticks off an hour.

Wouldn't that be 2600*60 (Revolutions/Minute * 60 Minutes/Hour), or 156,000 revolutions
per hour?

I think it's a better indicator of usage without having the ability to monitor how much load the engine is under. Theoretically if it's rotating faster, more wear is being put on everything just due to the forces involved (increased speed of everything in there, quicker direction changes for the various parts).

Forgot to mention my JD3520 had about 1.5-2 hours on it if I recall correctly.

 

[Grrrr]

Wouldn't that be 2600*60 (Revolutions/Minute * 60 Minutes/Hour), or 156,000 revolutions
per hour?

I think it's a better indicator of usage without having the ability to monitor how much load the engine is under. Theoretically if it's rotating faster, more wear is being put on everything just due to the forces involved (increased speed of everything in there, quicker direction changes for the various parts).

Forgot to mention my JD3520 had about 1.5-2 hours on it if I recall correctly.

I also prefer meters that vary with engine speed. I think it is better to change your oil and filters more often when you are doing high speed work and less often with low speed work. A meter that is linked to engine speed gives a very accurate mesure of this. I think most tractors have this sort.

 

[DuaneW]

I'm going out on a limb here but I believe that most (All) older tractors measure 'work' hours on the hour meter, which was an equivlent hour of work @ pto speed. Run the engine over rated speed, and you would clock hours faster than 60 mins, below, slower. This was done to give accurate wear rates on the motor. Now here is the 'out on a limb' part. With the advent of the New Generation Deeres (30xx, 40xx) Deere started using real clock hours, claiming longer intervals between rebuilds. Simply if a tractor would typicaly require a rebuild @ 3000 hours, John Deere could claim a 4,200 hour rebuild (assuming 60% of rated speed) schedule ( we all know how good Deere MARKETING is ). Now because of electronics, Its probably just easier to toss a clock in, key on = hours counted, dont even use oil psi to say dont clock hours because the motor is not running.

My Massey had 4hrs on it, was two years old on dealers lot, got a heck of a deal. I wouldnt worry about hours (< 40 +-). simply means tractor has been pre checked. If it did have around 40 hours, I would request that all fluids be changed per 50 hour breakin schedule. Getting that done alone is a pretty good discount.

DuaneW.

 

[DavesTractor]

I think some of the tractor finance companies figure a tractor is new with 15 hours or less. I think if it has been putted around the yard, shown at the county fair, etc., we still have a new tractor. If the owner has taken it home for the summer to mow his yard, the term "demo" might still work, but it will be at a discount.

I put 25 hours on a new tractor this summer. I'll sell it at a discount and include a free 50 hour service. Someone will get a bargain, and 5 years from now when they have 800 hours on it, who will care?

 

[MtnViewRanch]

I think some of the tractor finance companies figure a tractor is new with 15 hours or less. I think if it has been putted around the yard, shown at the county fair, etc., we still have a new tractor. If the owner has taken it home for the summer to mow his yard, the term "demo" might still work, but it will be at a discount.

I put 25 hours on a new tractor this summer. I'll sell it at a discount and include a free 50 hour service. Someone will get a bargain, and 5 years from now when they have 800 hours on it, who will care?

How big of a discount? Is it a 3215? I'm about 10-12 hrs away. It does't even have to be painted blue. I could be there Monday morning.

 

[DavesTractor]

How big of a discount? Is it a 3215? I'm about 10-12 hrs away. It does't even have to be painted blue. I could be there Monday morning.

1815HST, MMM, ML102.

Email me or Rob on the 3215, huge sale on them in September. No joke.

 

[GrowingRocks]

Many of you say to get the dealer to let you demo one, even at your house and then say, I wouldn't buy that tractor it has too many hours.

My tractor had 4.2 hours on it when delivered, and I put on about a half hour of that while demoing at the dealer. Matter of fact, the demo is the biggest reason I bought red. I went to the NH dealer who wouldn't let me kick on the PTO (on a tractor that already had mowed based on the grass on the deck.) Went to the Case dealer and he not only asked if I wanted to try it, but when I said my yard was pretty much all weeds, he pointed me to a area of pasture up to my waist and said "give 'er a whirl". I did, and signed the papers the next day...

I still like my dealer... kind of feels like the place my grandpa went when I was growing up.

 

[john_bud]

Wouldn't that be 2600*60 (Revolutions/Minute * 60 Minutes/Hour), or 156,000 revolutions
per hour?

I think it's a better indicator of usage without having the ability to monitor how much load the engine is under. Theoretically if it's rotating faster, more wear is being put on everything just due to the forces involved (increased speed of everything in there, quicker direction changes for the various parts).

Forgot to mention my JD3520 had about 1.5-2 hours on it if I recall correctly.

Hey hey hey hey now!

Pointing out my mistakes will only earn you respect and admiration from the rest of the board!

J (math challenged) B


On edit.

I like the fuel total used gauge idea. Not as an only indicator, but it would be a cool addition to a time indexed revolution counter. Probably pretty easy to do with a simple rotary flow meter and a bit of compute power.

 

[Runner]

Getting in late here. My 2520 had 1.6 hours on the clock when delivered to me. They put about 40 minutes on it loading the attachements at the dealer and unloading them at my home. The nubs had not been worn off the tires yet.

 

[ToadHill]

Mine had just over 1 hr. The dealer said he likes to run the unit for a while to make sure everything operates up to "snuff".