Need help....is this fixable???

[Shield Arc]

You may want to think about buying something like this.

Penetrant, Kit - Dye Penetrants and Inspection Kits - Supplies - 3WU63 : Grainger Industrial Supply

 

[chevy292]

Well I'll start disassembling the hoe this week, couple hours a night after work. l

Before I do that, I'm thinking I should try to get it bent back into shape as close as possible. Maybe even tack weld the broken ear back in place. Then take it all apart and start the heavy welding.

Does this make sense to everyone? It makes sense to me but I want to make sure before I get started.

 

[Lostalot]

I wish the very best,in my last post I should have mentioned that I have access to many friends and their knowlage and equipment so such a repair may be easier for me if it was my own machine. I will sugest that care be taken when realigning the lower pivots as you do not want any undue stresses created by misalignment,for me I would get a longer pin so that it sticks out either side then weld as much as possible of your existing material with the boom in situ including tacking the ram. Id then remove the bucket and dipper then trying pivot action on whats left looking for stressing. If required line boring through the pivots until everything is snookums. Then I would plate both sides of the boom,just tack welding,then again checking for
free movment,if all is good then remove the lot and weld away. Again this is what I would do if it was my machine and in the meantime there would be the advisory commitee(our local fishing crew) overseeing all that I was doing so there would be a big knowlege base for me to draw on. As an after thought I would also weld greasable bushes to the outside plates to suit the extended pin. Mate there are many ways for such a repair and it's hard to beat experienced and qualified repairers but I admire you for giving it a go

best wishes.....ps the ram may or may not be bent with the damage suffered

 

[banjodunn]

Well I'll start disassembling the hoe this week, couple hours a night after work. l

Before I do that, I'm thinking I should try to get it bent back into shape as close as possible. Maybe even tack weld the broken ear back in place. Then take it all apart and start the heavy welding.
Does this make sense to everyone? It makes sense to me but I want to make sure before I get started.

By all means if you can do that go for it, it is the best way of making sure the bosses and the pins line up correctly. As others have said after welding the boss back in then make up a fish plate to go over the top, taper it up the boom and weld up the sides but not on the end as this can start cracking.

Good luck with it all

Jon

 

[sequoyah101]

Gary has one of the best suggestions. Common problem with these pin boss bushings with the hole in the base plate that is cut oversize. The load goes to the fillet welds in shear and is not shared with the base plate. They do this for fit-up to get the pin boss bushings lined up straight. This way they can make allowances for distortion of the base plate and frame without line boring. Cut the holes oversize, jig up the pin boss bushings and weld.

Is the boom ram bent or broken?

Were it mine and since I don't have line boring tools, I would cut the crap out, weld in new plate with oversize holes having used the old plates for a pattern, put some more meat around the hole. Cut the hole oversize but still small enough to fit close enough to the pin boss but large enough for a backside fillet weld, turn a couple of new pin bosses to use the same old pins, weld them in good front and back having cut a little relief notch on the pin boss on the front. Clean up the backside and add a doubler plate on the out side. Cut the doubler plate to fit over the welds and leave the base plate a little proud of the doubler plate, weld it up with fillet welds. Paint it nice and away you go. For the safety bolts I'd probably use a cap screw with a plate welded to the pin on one side like on real equipment instead of the bolts. This would solve the problem of not having a space large enough on the pin boss for the bolt.

If I'm going to the trouble of fixing something like this I fix it since if it bends again it is probably junked.

 

[Gary Fowler]

If you notice on the bushing on the opposite side where the weld is cracked, there is rust on about halve of the weld indicating that it started cracking from the back side and has been broken for a while. The weld finally gave up when the other side let go. Really bad design for welding those pin bushings in and very little weld on them to start with I might add. That fillet should have been partial penetration at the very least and then a fillet size equal to the thickness of the boom plate minimum.
A magnetic particle inspection of these would reveal the subsurface cracks in time to repair them, unfortunately these are rather expensive test to do and equipment is not that cheap either compared to the dye penetrant shieldarc mentioned, however the dye will only show what is open to the surface cracks which is after the fact and most times they can already be seen with the naked eye after you know where to look. The dye just enhances them like a magnifier glass.
A routine close examination of all the fixation points would be a good idea from now on on that hoe as I would be suspicious of all the welds being of the same quality. Catch them when they first start cracking and then it is just grind off the old weld and reweld, maybe 5 -10 minute job

 

[Lostalot]

Can you give me the make ,model or anything else that can identify this hoe?

 

[gwdixon]

Can you give me the make ,model or anything else that can identify this hoe?

I think it is a Kioti KB2385.

KIOTI - run ahead of the pack!

 

[chevy292]

Yes it is a Kioti model KB2385.

If I were to bring this to a shop to have professionally welded, what would guys roughly guess it would cost me?

I'm just exploring all my options for the structural welding. I'll tack everything together to make sure it's lined up though.

 

[chevy292]

I'd like to do all of the welding myself, however I'm willing to put my pride aside if it is the better thing to do AND I can afford it financially of course.

 

[FastPauly]

"Digging out a brook".....as in big round rocks? I can invision the bucket not being able to get under them but rather sliding around them in the process. Net result.....huge amounts of lateral force being applied to the boom pivot pin.

 

[Gary Fowler]

There are streams with nothing bigger than pea gravel and then like we have at my place boulders bigger than the tractor, but that is beside the point now that we look at the cause which is bad design and welding.
Chevy, if you can tack it up, why not weld it. If you are any good at all and can get the boom flat, you just need a flat fillet weld on all the spots. E 7018 will weld it very good and with the proper bevel will get plenty of penetration. Any penetration is better than when new. Tack it when aligned and then unpin it lay it on the side and work on it. Put a near full pen weld on the bushing and then as much weld on it as you can get and not interfere with the safety pin. Flip it over and do the other side and put it back together. You may want to put more weld on the top side of your boom section and check the dipper also. If it were mine, I would put additional weld metal on each and every bushing while I had it off as you can see from the cracked side how they are breaking from the inside out. If you have to dismantle it, may as well do the whole thing. Welding time is miniscule compared to the assembly and disassemble of the hoe.

 

[Iplayfarmer]

...If I were to bring this to a shop to have professionally welded, what would guys roughly guess it would cost me?...

My rough guess is $300 to $600 depending on how you decide to do the repair. If you decide to cut off the old material and fab new it will cost more.

 

[Shield Arc]

If I were to bring this to a shop to have professionally welded, what would guys roughly guess it would cost me?

I think you'll be shocked!

I'd like to do all of the welding myself, however I'm willing to put my pride aside if it is the better thing to do AND I can afford it financially of course.

I don't think this is as much a welding issue, as a engineering / design issue. You've already got some very good options posted here. Get busy! :laughing:

 

[Arbo]

I'd like to do all of the welding myself, however I'm willing to put my pride aside if it is the better thing to do AND I can afford it financially of course.

It's too bad you're not local to me. I'd love to accept the challenge, but I'm in central PA. I figure in a day it could be done. I would probably torch off the bottom eight to ten inches of that boom and use the old for a pattern to fabricate new. Weld on the new pieces, run a reinforcing fillet over the seams, and call it good. I gaurantee that it would be better than new. I would probably use heavy wall DOM tube for the new bushings. You could cut holes in the plate for the bushings, make sure they pass all the way through the plate, and weld both sides, grinding the innner friction area smooth. Add some grease fittings and start digging.

I'd throw out a SWAG of $500.00 in material and labor.

 

[bvahjen]

I am in CT and have a good friend who is a professional welder and travels. Where are you? I am too dumb to figure out.

 

[chevy292]

I am about 30mins north of Boston.


I started grinding the old weld material out while I have the extra room to do it. What a pain in the neck. The only grinder I have small enough to fit in there is slow going. Oh well, one step at a time. I'll post a couple more pics when I get it cleaned up and tacked in place.

 

[Gary Fowler]

That is the problem with trying to fix it in place, but without JIGS to hold the dimensions exact, you just about have to have it on the tractor. Even after you get it ground and tacked off, check the pins after each welding pass to see if the are still loose. You can draw the metal back into alignment by welding on the side that needs to go in that direction. You would need to put some dogs on it to hold it, maybe some big C clamps to keep the boom ears from spreading ( I think they will spread due to all the welding on the outside edge). Weld a bit and let it cool then check for distortion. You can minimize the distortion by preheating the back side prior to welding.
In estimating weld repair time, make your guess and minimum triple it and depending on the cramped conditions maybe multiply by 10 and you may get close. When making repairs to pipe welds that were rejected by xray, we always triple the manhours that it took to make it the first time and even then it may go over.

 

[chevy292]

Yea I dont mind it taking a while. I dont earn the bacon with this machine. I just want to make sure I do it right.

 

[chevy292]

I got a lot done last couple nights. I was able to get the bend out of the ear thats still attached. I ground all the old broken weld off of the other side. Tack welded it back together.

Now I have to start taking everything apart.......fun!