Mowing Mowing Septic tank

[DavidInNH]

I'm pretty sure that I have a system that is similar to the "Infiltrator". Mine was installed in '93 and IIRC, they referred to it as a "Swedish system" (but my memory isn't what it used to be). One of the benefits mentioned at the time was that we needed less lineal feet than alternative systems.

Hey, if you believe the VW ads, then those plastic arches ought to be pretty strong./w3tcompact/icons/grin.gif

-david

 

[patrickg]

David, I never heard the Infiltrator type leach field called Sweedish but I'm surely no leach field historian. I don't know how strong the Infiltrator is regarding driving over it but I just wouldn't. Compaction is a bad thing for leach fields and I'm sure having a wheel break through and go into one could spoil an otherwise fun tractor day.

Patrick

 

[Soundguy]

If those are steel i-beam sections, then the person driving should have known they were overloading the septic tank lid... a small tractor is one thing.. a huge forklift with a heavy load.. sheesh..

Soundguy

 

[Soundguy]

The drainage field for my house was ,a pseudo comercial instalation similar to an infiltrator structure.. but closer to comercial, in that it had a main line, trunked to 3 sub lines, hole deal is about 6 to 7 ' deep, and uses plastic filter structures and some voids. Looked very nice... took a good amount of gravel.. but possible less than a 'standard' system.

Soundguy

 

[Soundguy]

Incidentially, the deeper system like I used, doesn't give you the 'square lush green forest' in one spot in your yard, like some of the other systems .

Soundguy

 

[patrickg]

Hey, Soundguy, Wow, 6ft deep? Gravel? The infiltrator system doesn't use gravel as far as I have read. Where did they put the gravel? It is possible that if the top of the plastic arch thingies are 6 ft down that you might not have so much problem driving over them. The infiltrator depends on evaporation and transpiration and the big void it encloses gives you a huge surge capacity as well. Your system is way out of my experience. Details, please?

I was warned to never drive parallel to the leach field trenches but to go crosswise and as little as possible. I was told I could till it a couple inches but in general to leave it alone.

Patrick

 

[patrickg]

Well Soundguy, Bring on the lush green patch! Mom's year old leach field is about 50 ft or so by nearly 200 ft. I didn't fertilize it as much as when I did the new yard and seeded annual rye. The rye looks like it will make a decent hay crop at the rate it is growing (over a foot high lots of places). The leach field is way behind in greening up and has a lot of weeds. I will spray it for broadleaf weeds in a week or so and maybe seed a couple kinds of grass on it. I wish it would go lush green! Wasn't it Erma Bombeck who said the grass is always the greenest over the septic tank?

Patrick

 

[MrP]

Will c,

How about horses walking over the leach field? Could they do damage to it? It seems to be sunken in in places. It could be normal settlement (the field is about 10 years old).

 

[Soundguy]

My system uses 3 areas that ar rectangular voids, with angular facets running the length, and has drainage ports all over the surface. Gravel is piled up over the structures ( about a 2' structure with gravel a foot to either side, plus about 6" on top.. then covered with regular fill.
Fairly interesting system.. probably a good 6' or so of fill over the whole mess. Other than the fancy drainage structures.. it is really only a variation on a theme for a regular drain field.

Soundguy

 

[patrickg]

SoundGuy, So far in my limited experience with septic systems I think I have learned that THE most important thing is that IT goes away when you flush, every time. But seriously, your system sounds well constructed. Like the Infilltrator system it should have good surge capacity. I don't know what your soil characteristics are so I don't know if it would have been a good idea to put some kind of "anti-infiltration" cloth over the top of the gravel before backfilling with soil. It keeps fine stuff from getting into the gravel and plugging it up. Of course there are soils where that would be a waste of time and money.

Our job was competitively bid and I picked the next to lowest bidder because for $50-$75 difference I thought they were going to do a better job. They used a cloth cover prior to backfill with soil. I think it was Tyvek or some other man made stuff with a jilion year life underground.

Don't laugh too hard but I was thinking of fertilizing over the top of the leach field to get it to green up some. It looks real poor compared to the area I took to bare earth and planted annual rye. I'll give it another 3-6 weeks to perform or get some fertillizer.

Patrick

 

[Soundguy]

I actually made my description too brief. Yes, there was some geotechnical fabric over the top of the field.

From what I have noticed, the field area seems to provide extra drainage to the soil above it, and may in some cases adversly effect the grass above it by not letting the water sit as long... but heck.. plants a weird anyway...

Soundguy

 

[patrickg]

SoundGuy, Everything about the installaltion, including GeoTextile, seems to make sense but the depth is way beyond what I would expect or what I have read, works. What kind of soil is over the field? My continued interest is not purely theoretical. I will be putting in another leach field when I build my house. Have the site selected and the perk test is completed and registered with DEQ (Department of Environmental Quality) B_U_T if I could bury my field as deep as you have that might offer me some advantages.

Patrick

 

[billfires]

Patrick, I don't kwow what local codes allow but if your soil will handle it I would seriously consider a drywell for your washing machine. Depending on the number of people in your household a grey water system may be another option for bathtubs and showers. We put the drywell in (against the rules) and after talking with board of health member they like the idea of a seperate grey water system. We put in a 4' x 6' whirlpool tub that is used at least once a day(sometimes twice with the kids) and it puts a lot of water in the septic system. I have been toying with the idea of a grey water system but the waste plumbing is under/over finshed ceilings.

Bill C

 

[Soundguy]

I'm not familiar with the codes in your area, but deep drainage systems are common in comercial structures.

Probably residential installers don't want the hassle of digging deep. Most use those small rubber tired backhow loaders.. they have a limited digging depth.

Soil conditions will have a lot to do with it as well.

We put in drainage retention areas with most of the roads we construct. It is not uncommon that there will be a drainage structure at the low point in the DRA. Especially in high clay areas, or other areas of low perc. The drainage structure is not much more than a concrete inlet, with screen, and a multi ported box. Material around and below the structure will be excavated, and beckfilled with a sandy medium.
It is just another version of a leech field.

The system we used was designed for high volume. Had a larger tank installed as well.. 2500 gallons.

We were also draining a large garden tub, a few bathrooms, kitchen w/ washer, laundry w/ laundry tub. The county had no problem with the design.

Good luck

Soundguy

 

[patrickg]

Bill, I have read extensively into grey water systems for conservation and other reasons. A dry well in some situations is a very smart idea. A scary application of grey water is irrigation, especially surface irrigation like spraying. Pardon me but this gets indelicate: E. Coli from washwater as well as viral contamination and some bacteria are not good things to spray on the yard. Especially if kids or pets could become contaminated. Just having someone in the household with a viral infection, flu or whatever, is a source of dangerous contamination. Subsurface irrigation is far less dangerous but is still questionable for vegies you will eat. There are stringent filtration requirements with using grey water for spraying, soaker hoses, drip, whatever. I have seen several folks try and fail at using grey water for irrigation due to lack of sufficient filtration. Thosands of dollars and lots of frustration, wasted.

I intend to plumb my house while being built to accomodate a grey water system even though some septic engineers (civil eng specializing in waste disposal) have recommended that you not cut down the quantity of water feeding the septic system too much. I may opt for a not too hard to clean reusable filter and sand bed combination. I would still like to use grey water for trees and ornamentals even if I now think I should avoid it in the garden.

I'm not as fanatical as some on the conservation scale. People plumb homes to flush the toilets with grey water. One design had dual sources for flushing. Vaves selected fresh or grey to fill the toilet tank. The idea was to use fresh for the last flush of the day or as required to avoid putrefaction. Some folks install a holding tank for grey water and handle it in batches. One civil engineer writing aout health issues commented that there is no such thing as a holding tank for grey water as the act of storing it for any reasonable length of time even less than a day would allow it to transform into "black water" and that in general, storage for more than a few hours was a bad and potentially smelly prospect. So what next, timers to flush the toilets with fresh water if the noxious odor sensor triggers it? By the time the grey water gets filtered by the biomass of my pecan trees I think the pecan pies will not be harmed.

Patrick

 

[patrickg]

SoundGuy, I'm exhibiting the symptoms of not knowing that I don't know. What I read about evapotranspiration leach fields was that they had to be shallow to work well. Maybe it was COULD be shallow not HAD to be shallow???? Luckily we aren't short on space because mom's leach field is larger than some city lots.

I helped the civil engineer auger the holes for the perk tests for mom's system as well as mine. It got scary for a while when the best looking places wouldn't drain for beans due to clay but a not too promising looking area just about couldn't be filled and perked fine. As the contractor thought his LASER level messed up just before the inspector arrived to be shown the system prior to backfilling, they took up the perforated pipe and back filled the trenches over the shredded tires. They then dug new trenches between the original trenches and put the tires and pipes there, got it inspected and backfilled it. The forman said all the extra porosity of the trenches between trenches would make the system work almost like all the trenches were plumbed in. It was a bid job so they ate the extra materials and labor without a whimper and we stayed on real good terms. Now the guy will give me free consulting when I ask as well as he came out to show me how to do a large paraloptic (I didn't know what it was) in my landscaping to control drainage. Good guy.

Patrick

 

[Soundguy]

I did my college thesis on primary, secondary, and tirtiary treatment systems, and specalized study in water supply & waste water eng. It really is an under represented facet of civ/eng. Most people opt for surveying, or road desig / traffic analysis.

A decent way to handle frey water would be a holding pond ( or network of ponds )stocked with flora to help convert the water to a more useable form. A trash pump can then be used to irigate from the pond.
Good luck on a filter. Other than a screen for solids, you are going to get pretty time and money intensive for a filter system for grey water that is effictive , and accomodates a useable flow. Filtering for viri and microbes are going to complicate that further, unless you plan to use a chemical injection system and holding tank setup. Starts to get sticky, for a small operation. But if you do plan on implimenting it, keep us informed.

Soundguy

""even though some septic engineers (civil eng specializing in waste disposal) have recommended that you not cut down the quantity of water feeding the septic system too much. I may opt for a not too hard to clean reusable filter and sand bed combination. I would still like to use grey water for trees and ornamentals even if I now think I should avoid it in the garden. ""

 

[patrickg]

SoundGuy, It just keeps getting better...

I'm not going to try to drink the stuff, just do a rough prefilter to get lint and the big chunks then maybe through some sand and then on to the trees and ornamentals. I hope a sand filter will keep me from pluging hoses or maybe good enough to allow the recycled tire type soaker hoses. Later I should pick your brain for ideas and or to sanity check things before building a preventable failure. I will be building near too fair sized fishing ponds and don't want to get much grey water into them, hence my interest in those soaker hoses as they can be buried and will last a long time. Burried they sholldn't contaminate the ponds with runoff.

Hopefully we can go into this in more detail later.

Patrick

 

[bubenberg]

hi, we are doing quite a bit of reseeding of septic tank areas, drainage areas and sandmounts. why the guys that do the actual installation work for three generations around here are giving us the lion share is because our equipment does not exceed around 1500 pounds power trac + rake, or a small type of rock hound.

when the foreman briefs the owners they recommend that only small tractors, or commercial lawnmowers up to 70 inch deck and 1500 pounds are used. they will honor any workmanship defects unless they find that large equipment has been used in and around this various sewage treatment/disposal sites.

 

[billfires]

patrickg, when I suggested a "grey water" system I was suggesting a seperate underground tank to deal with higher volumes of water that tend to overload the "septic" tank. I believe that you could have a seperate leaching field/pit or drywell (depending on soil conditions). Sorry if my terminology led anyone to think I was referring to an above ground system.

Bill C