More welder questions

[irvingj]

To all you welders out there.... I took a course, got pretty good at gas welding (I had had some experience a LONG time ago....), and had the use of a loaned wire-feed (flux core) welder that I became, well, good enough at.

I've since purchased the wire-feed welder, after refurbishing the machine. It's a good one, I think, a Lincoln SP-125 Plus. It seems to work very well.

The thing is, when I offered $300 for the wire feed, the seller threw in a plasma cutter that needs some work. I've seen it operate, briefly, but a switch somewhere in the circuit must be having some problems, because it became very intermittent, then stopped altogether. It had, in all fairness, been sitting for at least a couple of years and was filthy and neglected. It's a Snap-On YA 5550, 230V.

The question: is it worth it for me to fix --or get fixed-- this plasma cutter AND run a 230V feed to my garage (I don't have one now), or would it be better to trade it in on a newer or new 120V unit?

I have very little knowledge about plasma cutters other than their theory of operation, but I sure like they way they can cut metal, and this could open a lot of new potential for me to be able to build things. I have no idea how much is this Snap-On unit is worth, though it seems that similar ones go for anywhere from 1,000-2,000 dollars- any ideas/suggestions?

Thanks in advance for any and all thoughts!

 

[Spudland_Dave]

The question: is it worth it for me to fix --or get fixed-- this plasma cutter AND run a 230V feed to my garage (I don't have one now), or would it be better to trade it in on a newer or new 120V unit?

As far as fixing the plasma...hard for me to answer that...BUT...I Can comment on the 230V feed....without a doubt I'd wire the Feed...regardless of what you do with the plasma. It opens the door to pretty much larger welders, plasma's, compressors, etc...

 

[J_J]

A plasma cutter is a good machine to have. It will cut any thing that can conduct electricity. and do it quick, and all you need in addition to the machine is good clean air. I have a small Lincoln ProCut-25, and a Lincoln ProCut-55. The small one is 115 v, and the med size is 230 v. It cuts 3/4 in, and severs 1 1/8 in steel. On an old plasma cutter, the trade in would be almost nothing, even if they take trade in. Perhaps you can find a working model on Ebay to compare. A good tech, and the right parts might get it working. Even mine are considered out dated now. They are always bringing out new and better systems. The upgrade to my ProCut-55 is the ProCut-80, and it cost about $3339.

http://www.lincolnelectric.com/plasma-cutting.asp

http://www.weldingmart.com/Qstore/c000048.htm

 

[DJ54]

"I've seen it operate, briefly, but a switch somewhere in the circuit must be having some problems, because it became very intermittent, then stopped altogether. It had, in all fairness, been sitting for at least a couple of years and was filthy and neglected. It's a Snap-On YA 5550, 230V."

It may not be this simple, but what the heck...

When I first used my Pro-Cut 55 and was playing cutting various items, mine did the same thing. The warning light came on, and wouldn't do anything.

Finally noticed a little blob of spatter near the orifice in the tip. Took my knife, and scraped it off. Turned the machine back on, and we were good to go..!!

You might take a look, and try... Who knows..??

I used mine Wednesday to cut some 3/16" stainless steel... OMG.., I love that thing..!!

 

[DaveOmak]

Irvingj, Plasma cutters are worth their weight in $20's. The problen you are experiencing may be in the cutting tip. My hyper-therm has a set of contactors in the tip. My unit, I unscrew the tip and usually replace the contactor. Sometimes you can clean them with a wire wheel and they will work for a time. Not sure how yours is configured. Be sure and NOTE HOW THE TIP CAME APART. Also, clean air is a must. I have a motor-guard toilet paper roll filter in the air line. It keeps out moisture and small particles of dirt and oil. Use a dedicated air line to the unit to prevent a dirty air line from being hooked up and contaminating the unit. Best of luck. Dave

 

[jaquetarr]

You might want to check that the work is grounded directly to the machine. I mean have the ground clamp directly on the material being cut. If you ground to the table & clamp the work to the table you might get spatters and intermittant cuts >> bad ground.
We had a similar problem one day and spent hours checking everything on the machine. After exhausting all possabilities, we moved the ground and it worked like a champ......
Rgds,
tim

 

[irvingj]

Wow. Thanks again for all the useful tips. (I love this site!)

Since I don't have a 230V circuit available, what I thought I'd do was to go through the machine, generally cleaning things --which always seems to be a good place to start, IMO-- then check the tip carefully. I did learn that the tips are considered "consumables" and need to be replaced from time to time, so that part of the machine sounds like a good place to concentrate my efforts.

Once I've gone through it, to the best of my limited ability at this time, I plan to truck it back to Norm's shop (who had it before) and hook it up to see if it works.

If it does, I'm not sure just how I'll proceed-- I do have an air compressor, but it's not filtered/dried, nor do I have a 230V outlet handy. I'd have to run a 60-amp service to the garage, but that would entail running a #6 line from my breaker box all the way to the far side of the house and then from there to the garage. I have a 1-1/2" underground PVC tube going to the gargage, but that's got a #10 30-amp line in it already. It might be a trick to snake a #6 three-wire through it as well!

Snap-On still has a version of the same plasma cutter, a 50-amp unit, but the current one's made in Italy... the one I have's made in the US (but parts for it are still available). The new one sells for $3852...!! I found one of them on e-bay for $3000 that had only a few hours on it.

So-- if worse comes to worse, perhaps I could sell the one I have, assuming I can get it to work OK, for --$1000?-- and look to getting a newer one that's 120V. I really don't see that I'll ever have need of cutting anything more than 3/8" steel, most likely less, so a 120V machine might be fine for my use. Any thoughts?

 

[DaveOmak]

irvingj, You can probably get it running for under $200. Chech to see what new plasma cost. My hyper-therm 350 will cut 3/8" using 220v 20amp circuit. They were $1600 10 yrs ago.
If you rewire your shop, you could pull 3 each #8 or #6 wires using the #10 wire as a puller. 2 hots and 1 neutral. No ground needed. Then you would have 30 to 50 amps service 220v. Put in a sub panel for your 110-220 breakers. Add a ground rod at the sub panel and your in. Compressors, table saws etc, cost 1/2$ to run on 220v and run better. You would be surprised how much you will use a plasma once you have it. Someday you will want to cut 1/s" or larger and kick yourself if you get rid of the big unit. Good luck Dave

 

[moeh1]

may depend on how far the garage is from the house. Less than 100' may have to pulll ground wire as well, should check local regs with the inspector. 1-1/2" conduit should be adequate to pull any reasonable amount of wiring, think about what else you might wish to do

 

[irvingj]

Thanks! Moeh1, it's not too far... coming out of the base of the house, line goes into a PVC 90 degree access box, then down into the ground, about 12" under. Makes a 90 with a PVC elbow, then only about 15' underground to another PVC ell, where it comes up through the slab for the garage. From there, 8' up the post, out of the PVC, and "free-run" across the lean-to roof and into the garage. My small 120V panel is about 4' below entry point in the garage. Altogether maybe 35' once it leaves the house.

Dave- good idea; I hadn't even thought of running three separate wires- I'd just looked at the feed to the stove. Been too long since I've played electrician! 3 separates have GOT to be easier than one 3-wire #6!

Concerning the plasma cutter, I kinda thought it'd be one of those things I'll wish I had a long time ago, and it would/will undoubtedly get some use. I can cut with a torch, but it sure ain't pretty!

 

[Egon]

I have a 1-1/2" underground PVC tube going to the garage, but that's got a #10 30-amp line in it already. It might be a trick to snake a #6 three-wire through it as well!

Pull the existing run from the garage and run a new 220 volt line to a panel in the garage. Run your existing garage wiring into that panel. Make sure it's all to specifications.

 

[Berniep]

I bet that old feller is just a new tip away from cutting every piece of scrap metal in your possession. I cut about everything I could get my hands on and even into some not so scrap when I first got my plasma. I now don't use it a bunch but when I do it is indispensable. I can remember looking at the jigsaw and looking at the O/A setup and back to the jigsaw then to the sawzall and not liking any of them and putting off the project. Now I just hook up the airline and have at it.

 

[DaveOmak]

irvingj, I could have made an error. Where I live in Washington, the neutral wire (white) is connected to the ground bar in the electrical panel. Therefore all neutrals and grounds are bonded. In some areas a ground is required on all circuits and the neutral is NOT bonded to the ground. The neutral runs back to the utility. Check your panel to see how it is wired.
It is important however to put a ground rod at the sub panel in your shop. Read the manual on the plasma. Some equipment emits a frequency of EMF radiation that can interfere with radio, telephone etc. operation. A good ground close to the equipmant will reduce or eliminate that electrical interference. Here, 2 ground rods are required. They need to be 4 or 6 feet apart or sometning like that in the event one fails or something I guess.
Hope that helps.

"if you don't know how to engineer something, overbuild it"

 

[irvingj]

Thanks, Dave. Having worked in HVAC for 12 years, I used to be up on electrical... but I've been away from it (professionally) for 20 years. I will definitely check everything out before proceeding, always a good idea in any case. I didn't have to install a ground rod for my simple 120V feed to the garage, but if I go to 230V I'll definitely put one in, just as a precaution and whether or not it's required. But I will check the regs.

As I remember, around here the neutral is grounded, but I'll certainly check that out to be sure. Thanks for the advice!

 

[RPW]

That snap-on plasma cutter is worth its weight in gold. I just looked a a new snap-on plasma cutter (50AMP) for about $3500.00. You can contact snap-on for replacement parts.

 

[irvingj]

Thanks, RPW. I did notice that parts were still available from Snap-On. It's on the list of projects....

I just serviced the mower deck & put that up for the winter, re-installed the BH and FEL, greased them.... Now oil changes and snow tires for my & wife's cars, put the push mower & bikes away..... And MAYBE, just maybe, get the propane heater I bought last year for my garage installed & hooked up! Oh. And the front-mount snowblower for the tractor, and an oil change for the tractor, and..... Oh well. Keeps me out of mischief, I guess! But I am definitely looking forward to being able to cut with a plasma cutter!!