Market Share %? Does anyone really know?

shvl73 · Dec 2, 2004

Philip Morris does.

Kraft Mac & Cheese does.

Aren't these two the same company?

Bob_Skurka · Dec 2, 2004

Altria is the parent company for Philip Morris USA, the PM brands of cigarettes occupy 50% of all the cigarettes sold in the US.

Altria is the parent company for Kraft Foods, but Kraft Mac & Cheese, as a brand family has a 50+ share of that category.

Kraft Foods itself does not have a 50% share for all its brands but it does have a 50 share for several (Oscar Meyer, Life Saver, Oreo also come to mind within their respective categories.)

jwstewar · Dec 2, 2004

But how many "brands" of Cigs does PM sell under?

As far as Mac & Cheese, I can think of two national brands of the top of my head head - Kraft & Velveeta. Have you ever tried any of the store brands Mac & Cheese? That is my point of the others should just stop competing. /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif Same w/ Ketchup Heinz & Hunts are the two biggies.

Heck even Coke only has a 44% market share w/ Pepsi having 31.8. W/ Cadbury Schweppes plc (Dr. Pepper/7Up) making up 14.3%. The "Big 3" here only 87.1% of the market - and I would bet they have a lot less competition nationally then the "Big 3" tractors, even though there are probably more "local" brands than there are "local" tractor brands.

shvl73 · Dec 2, 2004

Oreo also come to mind 
Well deserved! /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

Bob_Skurka · Dec 2, 2004

The Marlboro brand occupies 50% of the premium market all by itself. They probably sell a total of about 100 different SKUs.

Kraft & Velveta are the SAME company.

Hunts is miniscule compared to Heinz. Ditto Del Monte. Ditto Red Gold.

markie61 · Dec 2, 2004

( Why don't we just do our own survey to answer this question? )

Here is one of sorts - a flawed statistical analysis of 12,033 owning/operating posts:

Kubota 48%
Deere 17%
New Holland 16%
Kioti 6%
Cub 2.5%
Cen/Bran 2.6%
Mahindra 3.6%
Other 2.8%

I didn't include Case/IH or Agco stuff, but they would be about 1.5% and 3% respectively. Other problems of analyzing this site are: history of TBN originally being a Kubota only site (larger number of archive Kubota posts), the smaller brands not having separate owning and buying sections (they are combined, thus boosting their numbers), plus other issues....however....

It is interesting to speculate that our little internet "tractor community" may (MAY!!!) mirror the larger national picture.

Mark

Ledgemere Farm · Dec 2, 2004

but I have a hard time believing any one company has 50% of the market share w/ that many participants

You can beleieve it. The telephone company I work for has 60% of the market share for long distance within it's footprint. /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif

KiotiJohn · Dec 3, 2004

( They say that 98% of the compact tractor sales are in 28 states I have to seriously question their data and the accuracy of the story! They also make their claim but omit all tractors under 25hp. Hmmm. . . )
28 states is just about what I remember hearing from someone at Kioti. They don't even bother to advertise, and don't have any dealers in most of the western states other than CA. Most of their sales are in the eastern states. I saw a chart once, but don't have it. Apparently their own market research shows they need not bother trying to market CUTs in those other states as only the large farm tractors are being sold. I believe that's pretty true for Kubota and the others as well. John

Varmintmist · Dec 3, 2004

That makes the most sense for using 28 states as a baseline.

The CUT market and the AG market are 2 different animals. In those states that the AG tractors sell in, most likely a CUT buyer is going to the AG dealer for a second small utility tractor.

Good post so far /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

PowerTrom425 · Dec 3, 2004

As for a survey on TBN, I suspect that we would find PowerTrac would have disproportionate #s, ditto a few other brands. I don't think we TBN folks are anything close to a statistical sample.

And here I thought PowerTrac was #4 nationwide........... /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif Just give 'em another year or two!!

MicroPilot · Dec 3, 2004

Here is a site with some sales information for the tractor market at large: Association of Equipment Manufacturers

Muhammad · Dec 3, 2004

As I understand, AEM provides reports on market share for the companies that report their sales to them. I have tried to obtain this data but they've got some good walls up around it.

One of the people with access to this data previously posted that according to AEM for one month, the rankings were...

1. Kubota
2. John Deere
3. Kioti
4. New Holland

That was about two years ago. Plus, one month isn't a very good sample when most sales occur in the first six months of the year.

But in reality, I consider the big four to be Kubota, John Deere, New Holland and Kioti (coming on strong), in that order.

Bob_Skurka · Dec 3, 2004

I strongly suspect that nobody has a grasp on this issue.

If AEM only reports data that is reported to them, then there is no way that JINMA is going to ever get any accurate numbers because of the way they sell. I'm also getting confused about Mahindra. Just based on these boards, Kioti is the brand to watch out for (and I believe for very good reasons) and Mahindra seems to be sleeping in comparison. But 2 dealers say that Mahindra is #4, while a third dealer didn't put either Mahindra or Kioti on the radar screen for position #4 or #5.

It would not surprise me to see New Holland slip, especially with their price increases. Kubota's line was looking pretty tired, but the new 2005 models seem to be more modern and (at least as of now) they don't seem to be increasing prices. JD has been doing a good job of modernizing their line up, but is starting at the upper end of the CUT range and working down, it will be interesting to see how that progresses. On the other hand, nobody really has anything to compete with those 3 brands in the SUB-CUT category (Massey being the exception) so I'm curious to see if the minor brands come out with a SUB-CUT to go after the BX series, etc.

CMunger · Dec 3, 2004

The most reliable reports come from EMI, and are confidential, most all equipment manufactures are members, and as members they report sales to EMI by County/State, in turn the EMI reports that are given back to the manufactures show them there market share, byCounty/State for their product only, and not for the competitors
Chuck M.

HayDR · Dec 3, 2004

EMI changed its name to AEM AEM reports data only from Member companies. AEM membership cost $20,000+ so the data is not free. The Chinese companies have not yet joined. Also Grey Market tractors sales (20,000+ a year)are not included in AEM figures. AEM breaks market share down to each zip code. The US Dept of Commerce does track the imports so most MFG's know where they stand as to market share. Usually the market leader loves to publicize they are dominating and 2-5 use words like fastest growing company to make people they are close to the top.

cowboydoc · Dec 3, 2004

don't have any dealers in most of the western states other than CA 

Any dealer that doesn't concentrate on the western states is a fool if they think that there aren't alot of compact tractors in use. I see them everyday in Idaho, Montana, Wyoming, Washington, Oregon, etc.

KiotiJohn · Dec 3, 2004

( Any dealer that doesn't concentrate on the western states is a fool if they think that there aren't alot of compact tractors in use. I see them everyday in Idaho, Montana, Wyoming, Washington, Oregon, etc. )
I know that Kioti has at least one dealer in Idaho, not far from Spokane, WA. I think they have some in Washington as well. I suspect it's a matter of population, larger AG competition and difficulty getting dealers in those areas. I have no idea the coverage of Kubota, but I think it's probably similar to Kioti's. Canada is another place that Kioti has a presence, but dealers are few and far between, with more expected to be on the way. John

frank_f15 · Dec 3, 2004

Bob i know around here, it is probably devided evenly for the big 3 for under 50 hp machinnes,BUT over 50 hp JD, MASSEY, AND NH seem to out sell the kubota's at least that is what i see when driving around. but i magine if you go down the road a few miles that would all change. seems like differnt areas prefer different tractors.

Bob_Skurka · Dec 4, 2004

Frank, yup I'll agree with you on the over 50hp stuff. Kubota & most of the minor brands vanish from that sector. Deere, NH, Case, Massey seem to dominate, with Deere clearly the leader in my area.

But it it the under 50hp area that I am curious about.

Clearly Kubota, Deere & New Holland are dominant nationally. Regionally there may be some major inroads by some of the other brands. Nobody seems to have a clue about Jinma, but that is all the more reason to make me curious. Given how many different ways they arrive on our shores, and under so many different brands, I really suspect they have a larger market share than anyone realizes. There there is the popularity of Kioti, which on TBN is very high, but none of the dealers who responded to this thread seem to be worried. Mahindra, which has a much softer following on TBN seems to be the one mentioned as a possible choice for #4. But nothing seems to clear there either. And Massey . . . what is with them? Not to mention all the other brands!

CMunger · Dec 5, 2004

I posted this before, but in California, 50-100 hp, that USE to be dominated by Ford and MF, Kubota has a very strong presents and has the number one position in certain counties.
Chuck M.