Loader letter arrived!

[IslandTractor]

Bird, the difference here is that I am not expecting Kioti to pay to transport my tractor for warranty service. I just want them to let me install the part. It seems just dumb to move a tractor that far to get a dozen bolts tightened. If I had a warranty issue that really required dealer support I would certainly expect to take the tractor to the dealer on my nickel.

 

[Bob_Skurka]

Ed, I can understand your frustration and point of view, and I'd probably feel the same way. However, if you stop to think about it . . . I'll bet Kioti's warranty says that you have to return the tractor to a dealer.

Yes, but maybe the real question is not should this be covered under warranty, but should this be considered a recall? If this was a recall then Kioti would pay for the transport.

When my NH loader had to have 2 little brass fittings replaced, there was a recall issued, my dealer picked up the tractor, swapped the fittings, and returned the tractor. It was considered a safety issue. I'm still not sure why, but that what it was deemed. Had the brass fitting cracked, it seems to me the loader would have leaked down as fluid spilled out. I suppose if someone was dumb enough to bust the fitting, then raise the loader, then get off the tractor and stand under it while it lowered on them it would have crushed them . . . In any case, the loader was improperly designed if the original fittings were the design specified fittings.

In the case of IslandTractors loader the cracks are slowly growing. As long as the torque tube is not cracked through there is very little danger of anything happening but at some point if it cracks through then it will be unsafe to stand under! It would actually probably be unsafe to use because if the weight in the bucket was not evenly balanced there would be no torque tube to keep things level and the tractor might roll? In any case, it is about as unsafe as my NH was when they recalled my loader model. In this case, the torque tube was apparently improperly designed because it is cracking and if it ever did crack through, it would very likely be a safety hazard.

So I think the real question is should Kioti have issued a recall so customers don't incur transportation expenses because Kioti's loader was improperly designed?

Put differently, should a manufacturer of a consumer product, who improperly designs a product, force the consumer to pay to correct the manufacturer's mistake?

 

[Bird]

Bird, the difference here is that I am not expecting Kioti to pay to transport my tractor for warranty service. I just want them to let me install the part. It seems just dumb to move a tractor that far to get a dozen bolts tightened. If I had a warranty issue that really required dealer support I would certainly expect to take the tractor to the dealer on my nickel.

Sorry, Ed, I guess I misunderstood. And I agree with you. I guess I had something very similar happen a few years ago. When I had a Cub Cadet riding mower, one spindle on the mower deck seized while it was under warranty. I took it off, took it to the dealer from whom I bought the Cub Cadet, and he said, in order for him to warranty it, I'd have the bring the mower in and let him replace the spindle. That would have meant an extra 50 mile round trip, hooking up the trailer to haul it, etc. and maybe two trips if I had to leave it with him until he got to it, so I just paid for the new spindle. Then I wrote a letter to Cub Cadet. They responded that they had contacted the dealer and he would refund my money. The first time I went in, he said it would be two weeks before he could do it (less than $20 ). He did eventually send me a check, but needless to say he lost a customer.

 

[coasterez]

Island,

I'm in a similar boat with my KL130. Though, so far it hasn't cracked. I just accepted a dealer's offer to help out and have left it at that. I think we all know your position and I agree with it. I just don't think it's helpful to keep ranting on this forum. They obviously aren't listening to what is being said here, at least not carefully. Now to keep ranting at Kioti.... that's a different matter.

 

[IslandTractor]

Now to keep ranting at Kioti.... that's a different matter.

Well, they are going to get a break as I am on my way out of the country on business for two weeks. I'll start calling them again when I get home. Maybe by then I'll have my loader letter!

 

[rback33]

Well, they are going to get a break as I am on my way out of the country on business for two weeks. I'll start calling them again when I get home. Maybe by then I'll have my loader letter!

Now I could not give them the break.... My laptop goes with me almost everywhere and I would even post from Europe if I were over there.

 

[thcri]

Now I could not give them the break.... My laptop goes with me almost everywhere and I would even post from Europe if I were over there.

My laptop goes with me all the time. If I have a cell phone tower or a wireless in range I have internet access. That is pretty much all the time.


My question here is what happended to Highbeam? and what are they going to do with his loader after they attempted to fix it and made a mess out of it?


murph

 

[rback33]

My laptop goes with me all the time. If I have a cell phone tower or a wireless in range I have internet access. That is pretty much all the time.

Same here as of last week.

My question here is what happended to Highbeam? and what are they going to do with his loader after they attempted to fix it and made a mess out of it?


murph

That is an excellent question.....

 

[Highbeam]

\

My question here is what happended to Highbeam? and what are they going to do with his loader after they attempted to fix it and made a mess out of it?


murph

Oh I'm here. I'm still ticked. I have no use for this crack cover up contraption though since it will not fit on my hacked to heck loader frame so my input is limited. Kioti corporate has written to me that they would take care of me when the new loader design hits the street. I sent one email in about a month ago and was ignored and another broader email will soon follow.

So I continue to use my loader and my tractor. Hoping Kioti will come through as they promised.

No letter for me yet. The cracks in the photo on my initial post 13 months ago showed a clear extension from the inspection plate to and around the radius of the torque tube in all directions. So basicly half way around.

Every time someone new sees my tractor they ask if it's a Kubota. No it's a Kioti says me, just the same color but darn nice. Then they say what the heck is that on the loader. Oh, that's Kioti's too. Oh, they say and we try and find something else to talk about.

Keep ranting. Without people speaking up, the loader cracks would have been ignored.

 

[fcamillieri]

Bird, the difference here is that I am not expecting Kioti to pay to transport my tractor for warranty service. I just want them to let me install the part. It seems just dumb to move a tractor that far to get a dozen bolts tightened. If I had a warranty issue that really required dealer support I would certainly expect to take the tractor to the dealer on my nickel.

The dealer I bought from included free transport for service and I'm about 45 minutes from him. BTW I have one of the early loaders but don't have many hours on it. If it cracks I'll probably just weld a gusset on it.

Frank

 

[rback33]

Every time someone new sees my tractor they ask if it's a Kubota. No it's a Kioti says me, just the same color but darn nice. Then they say what the heck is that on the loader. Oh, that's Kioti's too. Oh, they say and we try and find something else to talk about.

OK... I will begin by apologizing, but I laughed out loud when I read that... certainly not because of the situation, cuz it sux, but I can honestly hear the conversation in my head. I am a little surprised they have not fixed yours yet though.....

 

[hotairballoon]

I suppose it is possible to get it installed, and then get it home and take it off if you don't think it is either useful or effective. There are scrap metal dealers around.

 

[IslandTractor]

The dealer I bought from included free transport for service and I'm about 45 minutes from him. BTW I have one of the early loaders but don't have many hours on it. If it cracks I'll probably just weld a gusset on it.

Frank

Welcome to TBN Frank. Always glad to see another Yankee CK20 represented on the board.

 

[gravel13]

Yes, but maybe the real question is not should this be covered under warranty, but should this be considered a recall?

Very good point Bob. How does someone (Kioti in this case) determine if it should be recalled? Is it recalled only if it is a safety issue? (I'm not trying to bring up the safety issue verus cosmetic cracks here) I was also reading about the hydraulic coolers that had some issues, I believe on the ck20. At what point does it not become a warranty issue and becomes a recall? Maybe a certain percentage of tractors have to be reported? Just my .02

I'm still waiting for the KL130 repair kit. I haven't checked my cracks in a good 7 months, I'll have to see if they have progressed.

 

[malk315]

Dropped my machine at the dealer (Harvard Outdoor Power in Harvard, MA) yesterday for 50 hour service and loader kit installation (CK-20).

Tom mentioned they are required by Kioti to take a picture of underneath the torque tube cover and send it back to Kioti. I'm guessing Kioti wants to see the variance and extent of cracked / uncracked loaders -- note this is a guess by me and not the speculation of my dealer -- Tom just told me they need to take a picture and send it back w/ warranty claim etc.

I didn't have time to take the cover off myself and inspect, but I told Tom either way -- cracked or not -- I don't care -- just let me know if there are cracks or not so I can let you guys know for stats purposes on here.

Tom also mentioned they are considering for Ed (IslandTractor) to simply send someone out to Ed's tractor to install the kit. I told Tom that I believe this is what Wallace tractor in PA was doing (forgive me if I'm wrong -- I remember reading at least one dealer on here mentioning they were going w/ field installs to save on transportation for everyone / it made things go quicker by doing the install in the field). If it wasn't Wallace, no biggie as the point is to mention that at least one dealer is doing field installs in lieu of forcing everyone to bring the machines in.

Hopefully that will work out for everyone involved.

I will report on how things went when I get the machine back in a week (I don't need the machine for at least a week).

 

[hotairballoon]

Dealer that has my tractor claims to have never seen a cracked loader, claims to be one of the larger dealers in the country. Had a large inventory the one time I visited. He still wont see one, but I am getting the fix ordered and installed anyway.

 

[IslandTractor]

Dealer that has my tractor claims to have never seen a cracked loader, claims to be one of the larger dealers in the country. Had a large inventory the one time I visited. He still wont see one, but I am getting the fix ordered and installed anyway.

Ask him if he's every bothered to take the inspection panel off to look. You can't see the cracks otherwise.

 

[dgl24087]

Very good point Bob. How does someone (Kioti in this case) determine if it should be recalled? Is it recalled only if it is a safety issue? (I'm not trying to bring up the safety issue verus cosmetic cracks here) I was also reading about the hydraulic coolers that had some issues, I believe on the ck20. At what point does it not become a warranty issue and becomes a recall? Maybe a certain percentage of tractors have to be reported? Just my .02

I'm still waiting for the KL130 repair kit. I haven't checked my cracks in a good 7 months, I'll have to see if they have progressed.

In most cases, a recall is initiated only after numerous complaints to the appropriate governmental oversight agency in relationship to units sold, threat of class action lawsuits, or if there is a chance of severe injury or death. Don't know if there have ever been recalls in tractors, I'm basing my opinion on recalls for other products.

 

[hotairballoon]

Ask him if he's every bothered to take the inspection panel off to look. You can't see the cracks otherwise.

Actually I did, he said that when this all started he started looking at tractors as they came in, hasn't seen any. I think you folks with problems use your tractors for something, instead of living room ornaments. Sure looks nice next to the pickup .

 

[IslandTractor]

I think you folks with problems use your tractors for something, instead of living room ornaments.

I'm sure that is true but I don't think there is any evidence that anyone was abusing the loaders. If you use the loader just to move horse poop and sawdust it is unlikely you are putting any stress on it at all. Most of us are using the FEL for digging or land clearing which certainly gives the FEL a workout but I don't think Kioti would ever claim their loader wasn't designed for such things. There are also people who have used their loaders aggressively who don't have any cracks. Not sure if Kioti has bothered to figure out if there are particular production runs of FELs that have more cracks than others but they are offering the fix for virtually every loader built before late 2006 so I doubt it is purely a lot number problem.

In any case, the fix is finally available and now it is just a matter of getting it installed. I'm headed home after a couple of weeks overseas to see if I got my letter yet. Then I'll give the dealer a call and see what I can work out.