Flail Mower Let's talk flail mowers

[Code54]

Ken,
Do you find the Ford cuts better or the Motts? I been looking at Motts/Alamo and some Fords recently and was wondering which you would recommend and why? Is the Ford difficult to find parts for? Any advantage of one over the other? Thanks

 

[KenB2920]

Is your current tractor bogging down? If not it won't make a bit of difference me thinks.

Lol, yes and no. I know it seems like an easy question. I'm not sure if it come from eating to much grass or the tractor not having the power to cut it.

My average speed for 3' grass is 1 mph when thick. When it's just tall weeds I run about 2mph ... It's only 1mph more but if I could cruise at that or even 2.5 Id be happy.

All the blades are essentials dull too. I spent over 3 hours sharpening 1 row the other night. Unbolting each one individually then sharpen and reattach made for a slow evening. 184 blades total and I only got %25 percent done.

 

[KenB2920]

Ken, Do you find the Ford cuts better or the Motts? I been looking at Motts/Alamo and some Fords recently and was wondering which you would recommend and why? Is the Ford difficult to find parts for? Any advantage of one over the other? Thanks

The mott with dull blades cuts better than the ford with new blades.
From flail master, a new set of 33 blades for the ford was $150

A new set of blades from flail master for the mott was about the same price. (Different kid if blade). There are 184 blades on the Mott.

Each set of blades (2 per set) are bolted on individually on the Mott... Loooong process.

I had new blades completely installed on the ford in about 15-30 minutes (hard to say exactly as I was also distracted by other things). But it went very fast and that was the first time doing it.

Since I burned my belt I've still not made it a priority to get a new one. Although I should. The ford seems heaver built and may take more PTO power to turn.

I should have a hydro top link coming soon as this does make a difference in cutting.

I was able to use the ford and make a few passed to literally scalp the ground, then rototill into a food plot.

The thing I don't like about the ford is the belt is not on a spring tension pully. Apparently that came after my model. Although I now have several hours using both its still hard to decide which I like better.

More tests will be to follow. I can say for grass, the Mott cuts better. The Mott seems daintier but is a good machine and actually seems to be my "go to" piece.

So now that my ramble is clear as mud I hope to add more opinions in the future of my findings.

 

[KenB2920]

Ken, Do you find the Ford cuts better or the Motts? I been looking at Motts/Alamo and some Fords recently and was wondering which you would recommend and why? Is the Ford difficult to find parts for? Any advantage of one over the other? Thanks

Maybe this might help after reading your question.

It depends on what your cutting and how often.

If it was for my house, only cutting a field a few times a year and time permitted. Cutting thinner grass and light weeds. I think I'd pick the Mott everyday first.

 

[Code54]

Thanks Ken - I am looking to cut grass, weeds and some smaller brush (decided I will clean the area out good with the brush hog so nothing will be over 1" except an occasional branch - mowing atvs trails in the woods and along the wooded edges of my lawn)
I been eyeing the "rough cut" rotors and liked the idea that the Motts/Alamos are used by road crews. Figure if they live long lives doing that I should be set for life! The Fords are more plentiful around my area and I just didn't know much about them. Been staying away from the new lighter duty machines as I know I will be in the woods with it and like a heavier unit for long term use.
I appreciate any idea, thoughts and feedback you have

 

[esbwn]

In my limited experience it has to be on the ground to creat a suction for it to cut right. I played around with all different heights before I figured that out. LOL I dont think 8" high would be good for the flail but then again I could be completely wrong about the suction theory.

 

[leonz]

In my limited experience it has to be on the ground to creat a suction for it to cut right. I played around with all different heights before I figured that out. LOL I dont think 8" high would be good for the flail but then again I could be completely wrong about the suction theory. ��

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hello esbwn,

If I have not done it already I want to welcome you as the newest member
of the "Flail Mower Nations"(no passport required).

No, you are not wrong esbwn. The correct term is "pressure gradient".

If the mower shroud is not close to the ground the ground underneath the
flail mower does not create the restriction required to create the pressure
gradient needed in front of the flail mower rotor to create the lift needed
to carry the clippings up and over the flail mower rotor and back to the ground.


Always think of it this way; if your upright vacuum cleaner with the carpet beater brushes
is held above the carpet while trying to clean it the vacuum cleaner will be sucking only
air and very little dirt except for the occasional dust bunny that wants to sacrifice its self.

 

[GManBart]

If the mower shroud is not close to the ground the ground underneath the
flail mower does not create the restriction required to create the pressure
gradient needed in front of the flail mower rotor to create the lift needed
to carry the clippings up and over the flail mower rotor and back to the ground.


Always think of it this way; if your upright vacuum cleaner with the carpet beater brushes
is held above the carpet while trying to clean it the vacuum cleaner will be sucking only
air and very little dirt except for the occasional dust bunny that wants to sacrifice its self.

I have no idea where you're getting this theory, but I'd be willing to bet a scientific analysis would disprove it....and the vacuum analogy doesn't work either.

Even with the mower shroud touching the ground there are far too many areas that are wide open (the entire front of the mower) for there to be any significant suction caused by the spinning rotor and blades. There is air movement, but it's not suction caused by a seal with the ground. Further, as you describe, the clippings are already cut if they go up and over the rotor...suction won't change anything...they're already cut.

A vacuum uses a suction motor to suck up what the rotor brushes lift off the ground....a flail doesn't work that way.

A flail needs to be near the ground for the best cut because of mechanical factors. The front of the flail (usually the metal or rubber guard) hits the grass/brush and pushes it forward (assuming it's long enough) and the blades then cut it. If the flail is up high (8" example) the grass and brush will be more flexible and it's going to move around before it gets cut. It's possible that in some situations it will bend enough that the blades miss some pieces entirely.

In short, if the mower is down low, the brush gets pinned in place better before it's cut which is going to give the most consistent cut. I've been watching my flail as I cut a lot...since it's new, and if you watch what happens to the brush as it goes under the mower, the tops are moving all over the place as they get run over. The bottom can't move because it's in the ground. Cutting closer to the fixed part is when you get a nice cut, but it's simply a matter of mechanics, not suction.

Regardless of all of that, if you drive through a field that has 36" tall weeds, and you set the mower at 8" above the ground, it's still going to cut the weeds...just not as smooth of a finish.

 

[IslandTractor]

Leon is correct, as always, with regard to the need for ground contact to establish the pressure gradient needed for optimal mowing/mulching efficiency.

Another characteristic of flail mowers that might not be obvious to those more familiar with rotary mowers is that flails don't cut well when backing up. I often back into thick brush but have learned to always drive out the same way to finish cutting. The flail does cut in reverse but not nearly as cleanly as when moving forward.

 

[GManBart]

Leon is correct, as always, with regard to the need for ground contact to establish the pressure gradient needed for optimal mowing/mulching efficiency.

You can't have a significant pressure gradient without a seal...and there is no seal. Only the sides of the mower touch the ground with actual contact. The roller touches, but has gaps above it, and on the ends. The front is open...chains, metal bars and rubber shrouds don't create a seal and often aren't in contact with the ground.

Until somebody shows an actual reference, I'm sticking to reality...the closer to the ground the grass/brush makes contact with the mower, the less it will move around, and the better the cut will be.

I don't know why anybody would even worry about the theory...if the ground is full of rocks, and you don't want to trash your blades, lifting the flail high enough to clear them will still let you cut that brush. Will it be perfect? No. Will it get cut down? Yes. That's all the guy asked....will the mower worked raised up a bit. Yes, it will still work.